Insulation and stuff

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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby new_moonshiner » Fri Oct 24, 2008 7:33 pm

you already have the space why not use it ? if you use scrubbers then make sure 100 percent that they are all copper far as restricting it should not effect it much .. and yes it will make a difference more packing the better .
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby Dnderhead » Fri Oct 24, 2008 7:39 pm

I doubt it whould make any difference just take a magnet with you to make shore is real copper
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby new_moonshiner » Fri Oct 24, 2008 7:49 pm

unless im mistaken about the only scrubbers that are pure copper are the chore boy ones . you can go to the parent site and look at the charts and compare 6 inches more of 2 inch packed column and see if its enough to justify looking for more packing or not..the reflux operation is a slow process anything I can do to help cut down the hours in front of the rig Im all for it .
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby phoenix » Fri Oct 24, 2008 7:50 pm

Dnderhead wrote:I doubt it whould make any difference just take a magnet with you to make shore is real copper

Genius, sheer genius :mrgreen: I was wondering how to tell them apart
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby new_moonshiner » Fri Oct 24, 2008 8:02 pm

if the base product is made with something besides steel the magnet wont detect it ..I purchased some online a couple years back and they passed the magnet test thing but come to find out they were not pure . do a search on here and find out what others have found to be true copper scrubbers .. there is way more fakes out there than they are the real deals.
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby minime » Sat Oct 25, 2008 2:27 am

phoenix wrote:On to the column. I have 42" of 2" but only enough structured copper packing for 36". Should I by some copper scrubbies to fill up the other 6" or is it going to make any difference. Will having the 2 types of packing interfere with my vapour flow? I sure wish those needle valves would get here soon.


6" of packing will definitely make a difference in quality/speed. Stainless scrubbers work just as well as copper to hold reflux in suspension. You can get 'em in most places that sell cleaning supplies.

Hope your needle valves get there soon, looks like you're almost ready to go. Do you have a pot still strip head for your keg?
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby phoenix » Sat Oct 25, 2008 7:55 am

minime,
Right now I have it so the head is removeable and slips into the top of the copper bowl by itself. Is this going to work or am I just kidding myself?
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby minime » Sat Oct 25, 2008 8:09 am

phoenix wrote:minime,
Right now I have it so the head is removeable and slips into the top of the copper bowl by itself. Is this going to work or am I just kidding myself?
Kim


That will work but I think you'll find your distillate will be very warm. Most of us use a liebig to strip with so the distillate is already cooled at the same time. You need to get a bit of experience to decide what's best for you.

great pics by the way :D
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby phoenix » Sat Oct 25, 2008 8:21 am

I have a small liebig that is going to go after the take-off valve to further cool the distilate. I'm hoping that is going to help. If not it's back to the drawing board. I also have that other 10gal boiler but as it has an air operated stirrer that came with it I'm thinking it may just become a hot wort tank.
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby rad14701 » Sat Oct 25, 2008 11:37 am

That liebig should work just fine for cooling and its performance can be even further improved by packing it with copper scrubber or mesh... Nice work...
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby phoenix » Thu Oct 30, 2008 7:31 am

What a screw up :x . My "needle valves" came yesterday and all I can say is "WTF" When I saw them listed on e-bay they were listed as Swagelock SS 3/8" "Needle Valves" part# SS-6NBS6-A. I searched the Swagelock site and they said they were Severe Service SS " needle valves" for precision metering of liquids so I ordered them. First off they are friggin HUGE! Second, do these look like "needle" valves? They are the correct part # but they sure don't look like "needle valves" to me at least as far as I understand the term "needle valve" Do you think they are useable? Live and learn I guess. So now I have to start looking all over again unless I can find some brass ones here in town. The only place I could find SS ones here needed to order them in, 6-8 weeks unless I wanted to pay $50 extra for them to be couriered in. DRATS
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby minime » Thu Oct 30, 2008 7:49 am

phoenix wrote:What a screw up :x . My "needle valves" came yesterday and all I can say is "WTF" When I saw them listed on e-bay they were listed as Swagelock SS 3/8" "Needle Valves" part# SS-6NBS6-A. I searched the Swagelock site and they said they were Severe Service SS " needle valves" for precision metering of liquids so I ordered them. First off they are friggin HUGE! Second, do these look like "needle" valves? They are the correct part # but they sure don't look like "needle valves" to me at least as far as I understand the term "needle valve" Do you think they are useable? Live and learn I guess. So now I have to start looking all over again unless I can find some brass ones here in town. The only place I could find SS ones here needed to order them in, 6-8 weeks unless I wanted to pay $50 extra for them to be couriered in. DRATS
Kim

Looks like you got a great deal. I think you'll find about 20 full turns from fully closed to fully open. That'll give you very precise control.
If you find it's unusable because of size go visit a hydraulic shop. They'll have all that stuff available in stock.
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby rad14701 » Thu Oct 30, 2008 2:39 pm

@phoenix

Looks like you ended up with "ball end" or "ball tip" model according to http://www.swagelok.com/downloads/webca ... 01-168.pdf which also shows that model as having a right angle as opposed to being inline... Not sure how well that's gonna work for takeoff regulation but it'll definitely work for water flow control...
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby Tatt2d » Thu Oct 30, 2008 3:39 pm

Yea, it does look like a needle valve, just a little overkill. We have those at the steam power plant i work at and they're used in high pressure systems - as in well over 500 psi. Dont know the part # for sure but they do look like they could handle those conditions.
I say you got 'em... give 'em a shot.
I ask because I dont know better...

My first drops of distillate fell on Nov.18 '08 quickly followed again 10 days later. I'm hooked...
I run a 1.5" reflux column 51" tall. It is a CM rig... Yea, I know... - researching LM/VM now...
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby phoenix » Fri Oct 31, 2008 1:43 pm

Crap!!! I see by that link that those valves are to be used either fully open or fully closed :cry: I guess I'll use one on the reflux side as that is all I cared about there but now I need to find one to work on the takeoff side :oops: My bad
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby phoenix » Sun Nov 02, 2008 8:37 am

The reflux side is done. I hope I didn't have to keep the return tube real short. I will insulate it. I did it that way for easier disassembly if I need to at a later date. Will it have any bad effects by me not doing it as short and straight as possible? I wish I could find someone here that had SS 3/8 comp. needle valves in stock. I tried the big hydraulics place here in town and he had nothing useable. The plumbing places just had the small valves that look like needle valves but are a kind of ball end instead. I'm getting pouty :evil: What do they use a 3/8" SS needle valve for in the real world anyways. Maybe that will give me an idea where else to look for one.
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby minime » Sun Nov 02, 2008 10:11 am

phoenix wrote:The reflux side is done. I hope I didn't have to keep the return tube real short. I will insulate it. I did it that way for easier disassembly if I need to at a later date. Will it have any bad effects by me not doing it as short and straight as possible? I wish I could find someone here that had SS 3/8 comp. needle valves in stock. I tried the big hydraulics place here in town and he had nothing useable. The plumbing places just had the small valves that look like needle valves but are a kind of ball end instead. I'm getting pouty :evil: What do they use a 3/8" SS needle valve for in the real world anyways. Maybe that will give me an idea where else to look for one.
Kim

Kim, how deep is your liquid pool going to be?
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby HookLine » Sun Nov 02, 2008 10:35 am

Where is the take-off outlet?
Be safe.
Be discreet.
And have fun.
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby Hawke » Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:47 am

If you are in the states, go to http://grainger.com and search for Parker needle valves. Grainger is a business to business seller, but all you need to do is give them the name of who you work for. They carry the ss valves from 1/8" to 1/2".
It is the very things that we think we know, that keep us from learning what we should know.
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby phoenix » Sun Nov 02, 2008 4:19 pm

minime,
I just left a couple of mm on the inside, I hope that was enough. How big or deep does this pool need to be? I didn't see any mention of it in the plans I used but I do remember somebody mentioning that I needed one if I wasn't going to use a valve on the reflux side. Do I still need one even with the valve? Easy enough to fix if I need to.
Hook,
It's hiding behind the reflux valve.
Hawke,
I'm in the great white north and graingers shipping is very high to here.
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby minime » Sun Nov 02, 2008 5:32 pm

phoenix wrote:minime,
I just left a couple of mm on the inside, I hope that was enough. How big or deep does this pool need to be?
Kim

Excellent, the smaller the pool the better as the liquid is continuously renewed anyway. Hope you find a suitable product valve soon. Can't hurt to go with brass temporarily and it'll only cost you a few bucks. If you're concerned 'bout brass, don't drink the distillate. Doesn't stop you from doing a trial run. It's time you get going. Gonna be cold in those mountains pretty soon :lol:
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby phoenix » Sun Nov 02, 2008 8:59 pm

Cold :D I golfed today in shorts and a light wind shirt other than in the 5 min. hail storm :o OK, so that was down in the valley, but still...
I can't even find a decent metering type brass needle valve around here. I've tried NAPA, Rona, HD, plumbing supply (where I got all the copper stuff), hydraulics supply, and all there is is the non-needle needle valves :( I got the insulation done today so all I really have left is the water lines, needle valve and mounting system for the liebig. I also got some stuff done on the parrot but I don't have the base fully figured out yet. It's getting so close I can taste it.
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby Dnderhead » Sun Nov 02, 2008 9:25 pm

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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby Hawke » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:25 am

That is a $90.00 (US) valve for $10 :shock:
It is the very things that we think we know, that keep us from learning what we should know.
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby phoenix » Mon Nov 03, 2008 8:23 am

OK, That's the wierdest thing. I went to the E-Bay link above, it's a 1/4" not the 3/8" that I need but when I pushed my browser back button instead of coming back here like I should have I got "rkhelp.com" instead. I tried it 5 times and every time I went straight to "rkhelp.com" What gives? Is this happening to anyone else? This is too wierd :o
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby phoenix » Mon Nov 03, 2008 8:33 am

I just tried it some more and this is really strange. If I go to this site and then move on my browser doesn't recognize that I was ever at this site. I opened a new window, go here and as soon as I go to the E-bay site via that link my browser "back" button goes out like I was never at this site.
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby rad14701 » Mon Nov 03, 2008 1:26 pm

pheonix, my guess is that the item on eBay is for sale by the nimrods at rkhelp.com, one of the disreputable sites that's been mentioned here more than once... They probably put something on your PC that makes it do that, or have it in the code they've posted on eBay...
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby Hawke » Mon Nov 03, 2008 1:57 pm

Looked at it 3 times, over the last 2 days, always comes back here for me.
It is the very things that we think we know, that keep us from learning what we should know.
Valved Reflux, 3"x54" Bok 'mini', 2 liebig based pots and the 'Blockhead' 60K btu propane heat
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby Dnderhead » Mon Nov 03, 2008 2:51 pm

Look on hear also check out "other items" has 3/8 and cheper on "other items" he has. 18.$
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Re: Insulation and stuff

Postby Hawke » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:03 pm

noticed that most of the valves he has listed are for pairs. That first 1/4" set was worth 280 dollars, the winner got them for under $30 shipping included.
It is the very things that we think we know, that keep us from learning what we should know.
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