Experiment with EC-1118

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Postby wineo » Sat Sep 22, 2007 1:10 pm

My 1080sg sugar washes with 1118 will ferment dry in 7-10 days but I rack them once they settle,and let them set for a month.The clearer the better.Clean in- clean out.
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hey uncle remus

Postby partonken » Sun Oct 07, 2007 7:23 am

hey uncle remus! You said you had a stuck ferment, and you poured your liquid over spent grains, or did you mean you just added a few spent grains into the wort and it finished in 2 days?

IVe got a stuck ferment into its 5 th week, its at 1.02 sg. Its got half a can of tomatoe paste 2 tsp of lemon juice, 1 tsp of yeast nutrient in 23 litres. I airated it well, and its still working but SLOW.

I used2 Tbsp of distillers yeast and i wonder if i should have added more?
I pitched the yeast for 2 hours also.

Im wondering if i add a handful of spent corn from my UJSM it might kick start it, like you did. Thanks and cheers
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Postby wineo » Sun Oct 07, 2007 9:40 am

Try a pinch of epsom salts.Just a small pinch.
It will probably do the trick.
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Re: hey uncle remus

Postby Uncle Remus » Wed Oct 10, 2007 6:28 am

partonken wrote:hey uncle remus! You said you had a stuck ferment, and you poured your liquid over spent grains, or did you mean you just added a few spent grains into the wort and it finished in 2 days?

IVe got a stuck ferment into its 5 th week, its at 1.02 sg. Its got half a can of tomatoe paste 2 tsp of lemon juice, 1 tsp of yeast nutrient in 23 litres. I airated it well, and its still working but SLOW.

I used2 Tbsp of distillers yeast and i wonder if i should have added more?
I pitched the yeast for 2 hours also.

Im wondering if i add a handful of spent corn from my UJSM it might kick start it, like you did. Thanks and cheers


If I remember correctly there was a 1/4- 1/2" or so of grain stuck on the bottom of a fermenter (a couple handfuls at most). We just poured the stuck wash into this fermenter and the next day it was bubbling away happily.

BTW the whiskey yeast is still alive and well in the fridge after MANY generations now.
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Re: wow

Postby pothead » Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:19 am

Uncle Jesse wrote:That's some slow fermentation. I've had 100% molasses mashes ferment completely overnight using a packet of baker's yeast.


me too...well almost,anyway. I have had molasses take 2-3 days with bakers yeast. And I like the flavor of the finished product better, and it smells better during ferment.

I also think the product taste better if it is not fermented too high of an %abv .
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby Oaty » Sat May 03, 2008 2:56 am

EC-118 and Red Stars champagne yeast seem to take forever to start and forever to complete 14 days. Turbo run like a bull, but are expensive and nasty. So far my best results with sugar washes have been with plain old bakers' yeast. Especially with the wheat germ sugar wash. Like wineo says an 1/8 tsp of Epsoms seems to perk anything up.
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby Trapperjones » Tue Dec 02, 2008 10:06 am

I've always use EC-1118 or Lalvin's K1V-1116. The later I find the best in speed and production. For my sugar wash I use the following:
6 kg Refined Sugar
1 carton or 650 grams molasses
3 TBSP DAP
2 TSP Yeast Energizer
3 TSP Acid Blend
1/8 TSP Epsom salts
2 pack EC-1118 or K1V-1116
Make your starter up an hour before and add 2 TBSP sugar with 1 TSP molasses to the starter after the yeast has been rehydrated about 10 mins. I heat the water to almost boiling then add the acid blend, molasses, and then sugar. Then I add the rest of the goodies dilute to 23 liters making sure my temp is 25 degrees then add starter. I find the starting temp is what makes or breaks the EC-1118. It likes 25-30 degrees. I don't use the airlock for the first 6-8 hrs to ensure the yeast have enough oxygen to reproduce atleast 2-3 times. On occasion I'll add another kilo or two of sugar after the SG goes below 1020. If I can't find any Lalvin then I'll use Red Star's Pasteur red or Premier Curvee. Wyeast's Dry Mead yeast is also another good sugar wash yeast. All in all I usually get 14-18% from the EC-1118 and the K1V-1116. I have pushed 20% on occasion from the Wyeast's Dry Mead.
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby rad14701 » Wed Aug 19, 2009 12:47 pm

Wow, Trapperjones... :esurprised: You've definitely got enough nutrients in that wash to keep things rolling along briskly... :wink: Call that recipe "the little train that could"... :ewink:

1 carton or 650 grams molasses (nutrient)
3 TBSP DAP (nutrient)
2 TSP Yeast Energizer (nutrient)
3 TSP Acid Blend (pH buffer)
1/8 TSP Epsom salts (nutrient)
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby Hawke » Wed Aug 19, 2009 5:22 pm

EC-1118 has always given me fairly quick ferments. Although I don't think it is quite the 'killer' they claim it to be.
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Re:

Postby grogrum » Wed Feb 03, 2010 3:51 pm

possum wrote:I thought that ec-1118 and red* champ were the same, but distributed by different companies ? No matter. I absoloutly love the platnum25 from White labs ! I used it mixed along with crosby distillers yeast for my rum and whiskey. It is the stuff. Crosby distillers gives good results by itself as well. But together my rum came out great, fast, highly alcoholic (before distill), and compleatly dry. I did get to feeding my rum in stages after building up a big yeast population.

I've had "a couple of drops" already tonight, I can't wait untill I get some more of of that rum going again.

Like I mentioned earlier, I had pretty good final product from the red* champ for wine, but for all sugar and nutrient wash, it was poopy.


On the packets they say they are different strains . . Saccaromyces Bayanus and Saccaromyces Cerivisae
I'm surprised you mix two strains of yeast! They will have had a 'battle royale' for dominance in the wash. There can be only one! Which one do you think will have won?
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby raybren » Thu Feb 11, 2010 9:50 am

About saving yeasts. It is easy and applicable to do. I know that commercial breweries will "wash" their yeast strains with acid or chlorine blends to kill off the weaker yeast cells and any other things that may have gotten into the mix. Has anyone else noticed how the different terminology from multiple industries is confusing as hell?
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby doctee » Fri Nov 11, 2011 6:39 am

lewismichel wrote:ec-1118 and red* champ are same?? is it?


No Red* champ isn't quite the same. What you want is Red* Premier Cuvee (PDM). it is much cheaper than EC-1118 and what I use for rum and sugar washes..

This is form piwine.com:

"Lalvin EC-1118 (EC-500), 500 gram S. bayanus. The same strain as PDM. It is a low foamer."
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby pounsfos » Tue Nov 15, 2011 2:33 am

might have to get some of this stuff and try it for myself..

its about time i moved off the turbo's
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby Linedog » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:53 am

Doing my first mash using the sweet feed recipe,the guy at the brew shop sugested I use ec 1118 as a yeast. After 2 days it is bubbling slowly and seems to be working. My question is how rapidly should it be bubbling and how long before it ready to run ??? The recipe says 4 to 5 days but some of the posts I've read says much longer,this is a 5 gal wash.
Thanks
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby Dnderhead » Tue Nov 22, 2011 6:35 am

how fast it works depends on the temperature,yeast,the ABV. wait until it stops bubbling,then it will "clear" or all will settle to bottom.
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby Linedog » Tue Nov 22, 2011 7:02 am

Fermenting around a constant 70F
Thanks for the reply....
What would be some other yeast sugestions for a sweet feed mash??
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby Prairiepiss » Tue Nov 22, 2011 7:24 am

Linedog wrote:Fermenting around a constant 70F
Thanks for the reply....
What would be some other yeast sugestions for a sweet feed mash??


Bakers yeast. :thumbup:
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby Linedog » Fri Nov 25, 2011 5:15 pm

New to this.....what type bakers yeast and how much for a sweet feed mash
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby doctee » Mon Nov 28, 2011 5:47 am

Linedog wrote:New to this.....what type bakers yeast and how much for a sweet feed mash


I developed a spreadsheet to answer the "how much" question a few years ago. It takes into account the volume of wash, the final abv of wash, and how old the yeast is.

I would be happy to post it to this forum, but sadly I don't think that capability exists here.
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby rad14701 » Mon Nov 28, 2011 3:05 pm

toddk63 wrote:I would be happy to post it to this forum, but sadly I don't think that capability exists here.

You should be able to post as a .zip, otherwise change the file extension to .pdf and make a note of the file extension it needs to be renamed to once downloaded...
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby doctee » Mon Nov 28, 2011 4:09 pm

yeast-pitch.zip
(3.27 KiB) Downloaded 537 times

Here is my yeast pitching calculator. Enter the date the package was opened or expiration date, which ever is earlier. Enter the volume of wash in liters. Enter the expected abv%. Enter an annual degradation factor. From the attached notes , you can see that if vacuum sealed after opening and kept at 4°C, degradation is only 5% / year. If you don't vac seal, it jumps to 8% / month ! I honestly don't remember where I came up with the curve to derive the formula, but knowing myself, it probably came from some published brewing technical reference.

Hope it helps.

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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby Rachiu » Fri Mar 16, 2012 2:01 am

I pitched EC-1118 (aka champagne yeast) in an all-grain mash (80% rice, 20% wheat malt) and it does not start fermenting after one day :cry:
It's anything wrong?
Will it start or will not? to expect more or to pitch another yeast (baker's)?
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby jiml07 » Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:13 pm

MY RUM RECIPE USING EC 1118 yeast
I use 10g of EC 1118 champagne yeast with the following recipe.
1 teaspoon of yeast nutrient
4 liters molassis
3 kg fructose
1/2 to 1 kg of milled malted barley
30 liters water
The first batch took about 4 days to complete at approximately 17 to 18% abv.
I left the barley and the yeast dregs in the bottom of the tub.
As I am new to all of this, I thought I would try to repitch the leftover yeast.
I mixed about 500ml of sugar water and added a couple of tablespoons of the dregs from the bottom of the tub,
shook this vigorously to aerate and left to see what would happen.
I thought I would have to wait overnight to see any results, but to my surprise, within about an hour it was bubbling vigorously.
I then decided to mix a new batch of molassis and fructose (another teaspoon of yeast nutrient) and added it straight back in the tub which contained all the dregs.
I was surprised once again as it only took about 2 days to complete.
I tried the same all over again a 3rd time, this time I used 50% backset which I save from the previous batch and to my amazement it completed in about 36 hours. I thought that the ferment must have stuck,
but when I checked it had completed its fermentation at about 18%.
This recipe is better then the distillery rum yeast that contain amyloglucosidase (this is why I added the barley) and only ferments out to 15% abv..
Last edited by jiml07 on Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby Durace11 » Wed Nov 21, 2012 9:28 am

What you are experiencing is the same as using a huge yeast starter colony to kick off your fermentation. You are putting your wash into a container with an established colony of yeast ready to eat & you are feeding them the same meal they just devoured. It's the perfect storm for a feeding frenzy. This is the same concept of the UJSSM pitching into the old trub in the bucket.
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby MrD » Wed May 08, 2013 8:23 am

KatoFong wrote:So lately there's been a few discussions about EC-1118. Some call it friend, others call it foe. Some people note its fast ferment, while others (myself in particular) say it has a tendency to lag. One source on the parent site recommends it as a good wash yeast, because it ferments out really crisp and clean, while I personally find it tends to be a bit funky when it ferments.

In researching EC-1118, I've found it's a pris de mousse yeast. As near as I can figure, that means it's meant to be added with sugar to an already fermented wine to add carbonation, as you would do in making champagne. Hence the high alcohol tolerance (a low tolerance yeast wouldn't be able to start a good ferment in an already fermented wine). In working with it recently on a mead, I noticed that, when I fermented the primary well under its alcohol tolerance and then added sugar and fruit to it in the secondary, it 1) roared to life in the secondary and 2) fermented out crisper than I had seen it do before. Its ferment also had a better defined end with the yeast settling and the wine clarifying relatively succinctly.

So tonight I'm beginning an experiment. I'm going to start a batch of wine using the following recipe and see what we end up with:

In primary:

25 lbs store-bought white grapes
7 lbs sugar
Water to 3 gallons
10 or so sachets of EC-1118
Some fresh OJ (for fine vegetable matter)
Yeast nutrient

Crush grapes in primary. Invert the sugar by dissolving into 1 gallon of boiling water with a few tsps of citric acid added. Add to primary and top off with remaining water. Rehydrate yeast and stir into the must. Cover with cheesecloth and loose lid and let sit for three days. Aerate regularly.

After three days, strain grape matter from the surface of the must, taking care to press out as much juice as possible. Siphon must into secondary.

In secondary:

Add to must

3 lbs sugar, dissolved into enough water to bring total to five gallons
(potentially) 0ne can 100% grape juice concentrate.

Mix thoroughly into must and afix airlock. Let it ferment out.

Alternately, I may do two secondary additions of sugar to the must, so as to bring the alcohol up gradually. My hope is that the incremental ferment will produce a better "wine" than simply dumping a bunch of sugar and letting the yeast go unsupervised.


EC-1118 is really good for delivering "fruity" characteristics to wine. I would HIGHLY recommend using Tartaric acid for your acid add as lots of nasty bugs will eat Citric and you run the risk of creating off flavors/aromas in your "wine".
For AG I've found that a combo of red-star pasteur champagne and saflager S-23 work well. Science being that the Pasteur is a top fermentor and the safe lager is a bottom fermentor. Saccharomyces cerevisiae and Saccharomyces pastorianus. Some yeast nutrients and DAP are also very good for a healthy ferm. Hope this is useful.
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby Skymike » Mon May 20, 2013 5:51 am

I am an Assistant Winemaker at a winery, we use bayanus yeasts on all our reds and whites. To include EC-1118. It isn't just for the secondary fermentation of sparkling. It is just a very strong, clean, and fast fermenting yeast. As stated, it can also tolerate high alcohol. We have had some wines hit 15.5%, 19% for our port. If you are having problems with a funk stir your ferment once a day. It is likely due to the dead yeast laying on the bottom. As long as you don't let that sit to long and create sulfides, it will blow off with the CO2. The oxygenation from stirring will also speed yeast activity.
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby Skymike » Mon May 20, 2013 5:57 am

MrD, you are correct about using Tartaric for acid additions. Also, when using DAP be very careful about additions. Us only what the east need. More is not better. Any excess nutrients not consumed can really cause some stinky problems. It's also best to add in two stages. About 1/3 to half in the start of fermentation and the rest at about the top of fermentation. We usually try to do the second at about 19 Brix. DAP is yeast junk food, they eat the desert first, they won't eat their veggies.
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby MrD » Fri May 24, 2013 8:42 am

Skymike, are you in "The Valley"? Napa Ferm ring a bell?
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby Skymike » Fri May 24, 2013 4:17 pm

Nope, Walla Walla
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Re: Experiment with EC-1118

Postby Thump35 » Sun Nov 10, 2013 12:39 pm

Ive used it in three runs so far. First was in the watermelon kiwi brandy I just got done running. And some grape wine I just put into the secondary, then in another batch of brandy I mashed yesterday. If the brandy I ran today is any indication, its a pretty good yeast with a good yield.
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