Let's talk about pitching turbo yeast.

[aj]

Reading one of the threads earlier reminded me of a question I'd once had about the commercially available "turbo yest" packets and how one might squeeze a bit more life out of them.

See, up here in Alaska everything is more expensive. In the case of turbo yeast, there's only one place I know of that sells it, and their stock is unreliable and subject to change and outages. If this yeast is capable of tolerating up to 20% alcohol, why can't you just take some from the packet and propagate a starter from it?

The standard answer is that turbo yeast isn't just yeast. It's a specially formulated mixture of yeast, nutrients, buffer chemicals and substrate so that the yeast can more properly grow and take hold in the somewhat sparse environment of a straight sugar wash. This makes sense, after all, a sugar wash isn't the best place to just dump yeast in (especially dry yeast) unless the conditions are right.

So what do we need to do to duplicate these conditions?

Is it possible to stretch a packet of turbo yeast over several 15-20% ABV washes, and, if so, what's the best method of making a starter from it?

[Bohunk]

Your right, turbo yeast has several different things in it to help the yeast survive in high alcohol levels. One of these is diammounim phosphate(DAP), so you can some times get by using a lesser yeast, and adding a lot of DAP. Saving back some of your turbo yeast, as your own culture will work, but you will need to DAP it up a bit.

The Bohunk

[oakie]

I've never tried to grow the packets of turbo yeast but I read some where that they don't grow to well because they are made to start with a lot of extra live cells.

Just use some 1118 it will work just the same as the turbo if you use a little more than usual and give it plenty of nutrients, but its a lot easier to grow (so I've heard) and cheaper (where I'm at).

Hope this helps, Oakie

[junkyard dawg]

I'd pitch that turbo yeast in the trash and aim for lower starting gravities and lower yields. 15-20% tastes bad. Turbos tastes bad. not what you need for a good rye. If you're just learning, go ahead and use the turbo, but don't deviate from the directions too much or things will get screwy. good luck.

[aj]

Oh certainly not, not for rye. Good god, man!

I'm just talking about straight sugar washes. I've got a friend's wedding coming up, and bottles of Gin or Limoncello make good party favors. A high-gravity sugar wash is good for that sort of thing.

[junkyard dawg]

It would be but for the funky flavors that turbos bring. I can appreciate the ease of using turbos, but the funky stink sucks. Its easier IMHO to use other yeasts in a more traditional way that don't require so much effort to clean up and make palatable. A simple sugar wash made with a couple of handfuls of grain and some mollases or tomato paste is less effort in the long run than cleaning up a turbo yeast. So rather than stretch out a yeast that creates bad stinks why not use a champagne yeast that is relatively flavor neutral? If you are wanting to stretch out a turbo then you are going to add yeast nutrients. Same thing you have to do with a champagne yeast. Champagne yeast will get up to 18% or so, without all the funk that turbo yeast produces. I don't see why you would choose a stinky yeast that needs carbon treatment to propagate. Do the same thing with a good tasting yeast.

[Uncle Jesse]

The yeast I used to buy was a dried distillers yeast. I kept it in the freezer. It handled an 18% mash for me once, no problems and I was told it would do 19% but I don't like to push my mashes that high. Pushing for more and more just goes against my general attitude toward distillation.

[theholymackerel]

Besides nasty smells and tastes, I have a problem with how long high gravity ferments take.

An eight % wash can ferment out in 3 days or less and be clean and tasty while a sixteen % wash could take more than two or three weeks and likely have a bit of funk with it.

I don't see the point in doublin' yer wash strength when it could take up to 7 times longer to finish fermentin' AND require another step or two to clean up. If ya want more alcohol ferment more batches rather than make stronger washes/mashes.



I wish ya luck.

[triggernum5]

Toss the wash in the frezer in 2L bottles, then drain thaw them until all thats left is basically water, and you'll have a strong wash with little effort that doesn't have alot of acetates if your boilersize/distillation freedom is the limiting factor (thinking low-key teenager closet setup here, not that I condone that:).. If you have no limitations, do it right.. Baker's yeast for rum, EC1118 seems to be popular for other spirits.. I like to play with yeast myself (and screw up alot because of it).. Its the one aspect that can continually challenge you regardless of level of experience, but I'm still hopeful to find a cool natural yeast, or a worthy theft from a bottled beverage.. (I managed to snag Carlsberg brewers yeast I think.. Ferments high enough to assume its not just the bottling strain.. I guess I've reached my Carlsberg years..

[birdwatcher]

If your aim is to make ethanol, then vodka/gin, simply use regular bakers yeast available at any good health food store.

The following will take probably take care of your wedding.

My sugar wash

Equipment:

My fermenter is a Rubbermaid 106 liter opaque white storage container with lid.
In Canada, available at Canadian Tire.

Four 23 liter wine carboys

Four air locks.

Hydrometer

2" bottomless styrofoam box, with cover, large enough to cover fermenter or 4 carboys.

Wallplug, lightbulb socket connected to electrical cord.

digital thermometer

Stir stick

Syphoning tube

********

My recipe for an 80 liter wash. Ingredients as follows:

3 cups tomato paste

Juice 3 lemons

Approx. 18 kg sugar

225 grams fresh regular bakers yeast. Buy in bulk at any good health food store.

water(I use spring well water)

Procedure:

Keep careful notes from start to finish for future reference.

Carefully mix paste, juice, say 14 kg sugar with 60 liters water at 30C. Measure SG.
(you are aiming for 1.09)

Carefully add water and sugar to bring mixture to 80 liter, WITH A SG 1.09.
Temperature of finished mixture should be 30C-35C to start.

You should now have 80 liters of mixed ingredients.

Carefully sprinkle 225 grams of yeast over surface, stirring in.
Place cover loosely, to let CO2 escape, keeping flying nasties out.
There is so much CO2 coming off; there is no need to worry about oxygen coming in contact.

Place bottomless styrofoam box over fermenter. Dangle lit lightbulb through small
hole in lid. Bulb must be strong enough to keep the mixture at a steady range of
30C-35C for entire fermentation. Size of bulb depends on room temperature. Stick
your digital thermometer through side of box to track inside temperature.

{A good idea would be to set up with water a day before you begin wash to determine
the size of light bulb to maintain water/wash in the 30-35C range.}



Check SG and temperature daily

Stir daily

On day three, syphon contents evenly into four 23 liter airlocked carboys.
(This step may not be nessesary and I may at some future date simply take the wash from start
to finish in the unairlocked storage container)

Check SG and temperature daily

Shake carboys gently daily.

After a total of 7-8 days SG should be .995. If not, wait until completion.


Note: After ten years of making 95% ethanol, and fine tuning my recipe after lots of
suggestions from people on this forum, this is what works for me. I'm always fine
tuning and welcome any comments or suggestions.

If any points above are not clear or you have questions, feel free to ask.

Cheers,

G
_________

[triggernum5]

Played much with your previous's batches yeast, or pre-growing it?? I'm guessing you prefer some extra flavors in there given your temps unless syphoning it off the bed as you say does wonders in cleaning it up (Goes against everything I was taught, but wanna try that), but yeast seriously takes off like a bat outa hell when pitched at the optimal point in the batch's life cycle.. 7-8 days isn't bad though assuming its truly done by that time.. Any cloudiness at all?

[aj]

This is all good advice. I'd never really considered how much of the funky taste in sugar washes was coming from the turbo yeast itself. I just assumed I wasn't separating well enough. I looked around here for the different methods home distillers use to keep yeast going, but I think I'll start a thread on that one so we can get them all together.

[triggernum5]

Sugar washes can taste pretty nasty on their own before you figure out your tricks of the trade.. Tartaric acid (one of its salts, cream of tartar in your spice rack perhaps) reduces alot Do you monitor pH at all?? I like to see a pretty freakin red sample, especially for long ferment periods because most bacteria dislike acidity.. One thing I find is that oak sucks out alot of the nasties from a sugarwash imparticular noticably within a few hours.. When you put the wood to your nose, its hard to deny that the distillate should be cleaner..

[570rm47]

Hope im not a nave intruding on scared territory i ended up here whilst looking for info on cultivating yeast to ferment lactose into fuel ethanol.

Is it possible to cultivate it???

So turbo yeast is not all that good im assuming from some of what is said but it gives me real consistent results that seem fairly cost effective, i dont seem to experience the drawbacks except the smell of course during fermentation.
when I add the carbon treatment to the fermentation but see so little result from it the only difference being that i can get away with running the still a bit quicker. This no longer happens as any extras from the still go in the tank of my moped, I know the difference is only like maybe 4-5% ABV before proofing but I think i taste the difference too and dont mind running the turbo 500 still i have for an extra hour. I carbon filter with the ezfilter proofing barrel but yet again no one ever notices the difference unless i have pushed out the alcohol in less than 4.5 hours. This includes having sampling of the same age and flavour (i cant help myself). I like to let the wash settle for three days after the bubbles stop then siphon then i use the clearing agent for at least 48hrs or untill its like crystal clear if i have the time.

what are the flavours can you describe them to me or point me to a thread where its allready discussed.

[Bushman]

I believe Turbo is used and works fine for fuel ethanol but if that is your goal there are better forums that are geared to that end. Turbo yeast if you read give off tastes because of the strain it puts on the fermentation thus for a drinking product it is not the yeast of choice.

[pounsfos]

Hi 570rm47

please stepover here and introduce yourself
http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewforum.php?f=27

also this is a 6 year old thread, try not to re awaken such old threads instead post your question in a new topic, but do a quick search first for the answer.

[MitchyBourbon]

Yes you could cultivate the yeast, but it would not likely do you any good. It would no longer have the special mix of nutrients that allows the yeast to produce a high abv wash, so it wouldn't be any good for producing fuel. It would still be the same crappy yeast that was never designed to produce good flavors. So if you did cultivate a turbo yeast you would likely end up with something that was good for nothing.

Honestly, turbo yeast has its place and that is for producing fuel. Unless you know the formula for the nutrients it won't be any good for that either.