Baking your sugars (just below molten state) for flavour ?

Sugar, and all about sugar washes. Where the primary ingredient is sugar, and other things are just used as nutrients.

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Critchy Otch
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Baking your sugars (just below molten state) for flavour ?

Post by Critchy Otch »

Apologies if in wrong section (i'm new & VERY dumb) It was one of the things that brought me to the forum though.

I cook a bit, sous vide etc, & was reading on serious eats.com site about "oven baked basic pouring white sugar" which is typically beet sugar (set on a low temperature, stirred till it gets to your preferred state of golden, temp held (thermostat allowing) just below MOLTEN state, to introduce caramel notes, the use on that site is to introduce caramel notes / "something else" to baking.

Having a store of cheap uk beet granulated sugar I decided that either way it could be used, but whether or not it was time & energy efficient is another thing.

(I did ask a uk brew shop local to me, who apparently posts here, but never heard back)

So far I made over a week-end 3 kg towards a load for a full run on the T500 stored in a heavy duty zip-loc bag, the taste to the tongue in set state (granular) is there but can probably be done better by addition of other things realistically, nothing ventured nothing gained (it's time intensive & each pyrex borosilicare glass dish typically had a 6 hour oven time removed & stirred over 20 minute increments.. so far if its deemed pointless by learned members here, fine I can use it for baking, but if this & other sugars flavours change then it might be worth pursuing, thus the query.

Obviously I still need to do as much again (at least) for a still run sampler, but before I commit to another weekend of essentially drying out sugar in an oven (a lot of kilowatt hours energy & cost) I've got to ask..

A. Anyone else done this (& the results in terms of flavour gained being worthwhile or not)
B. Anyone done this to more heavily flavoured sugar types & what was the change / uses & advantages perceived?

The other possibly daft question being does anyone blend different sugars for still purposes for enhanced flavour profiles or is that simply crazy talk on a fundamentally molecular level where yeast action is involved?

(See, I told you I was dumb) ;)
For my sins, I own a full T500 set up ..Bah
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Chauncey
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Re: Baking your sugars (just below molten state) for flavour ?

Post by Chauncey »

When it caramelizes it becomes less fermentable.
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Ben
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Re: Baking your sugars (just below molten state) for flavour ?

Post by Ben »

What your proposing is common in Belgian ales. Look up sugar inversion, and Belgian candi sugar, or candi syrup. The inversion process improves the fermentability. Process is used to add flavor and lighten the body.
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jonnys_spirit
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Re: Baking your sugars (just below molten state) for flavour ?

Post by jonnys_spirit »

Treacle aka Golden Syrup -
https://decoratedtreats.com/homemade-go ... ecipe.html

Caramelized depending on how long you cook it and inverted with citric acid.

Cheers!
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Demy
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Re: Baking your sugars (just below molten state) for flavour ?

Post by Demy »

Just golden cooked sugar (let's say honey color ) will not make almost no flavor to your product, if you want really good flavors it must be made very dark with long cooking but in an alkaline environment and with the presence of proteins in order to activate the reactions of Mailard, this will make the difference otherwise you will not get big flavors.
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Re: Baking your sugars (just below molten state) for flavour ?

Post by The Baker »

jonnys_spirit wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:12 am Treacle aka Golden Syrup -
https://decoratedtreats.com/homemade-go ... ecipe.html

Caramelized depending on how long you cook it and inverted with citric acid.

Cheers!
-j
In Australia Golden Syrup (as its name suggests) is a golden colour.
Treacle is thicker and a lot darker.

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Critchy Otch
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Re: Baking your sugars (just below molten state) for flavour ?

Post by Critchy Otch »

Now that's good service! ..much appreciated.
I will hold back the sugar for simple "cookie baking" & delve further into the whole she-bang.

What I have baked in the oven so far involves no citric acid, (i'll check that link) which i'm about to order a kilo of from a uk company that is pretty cost effective delivered (free delivery over £5 spent)
https://trade-chem.co.uk/pure-chem/

Thanks for the direction.
Critchy-Otch
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NZChris
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Re: Baking your sugars (just below molten state) for flavour ?

Post by NZChris »

What you are asking about isn't the subject of many of the replies.

You don't have to ferment a full still charge worth to find out how fermentable it is, or if it tastes nice. Make up enough ferment so that you can measure the SG to check it's progress. If it ferments ok and the taste is promising, you could use your experiment for the starter for a full sized wash.
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Re: Baking your sugars (just below molten state) for flavour ?

Post by NZChris »

What temperature do you use?
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Ben
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Re: Baking your sugars (just below molten state) for flavour ?

Post by Ben »

Mfy3Pwh5LRpJ5biSTCK8VQ.jpg
Sugar color will change with temp, , with inversion you can cook at a low temp for a long period of time to hit the desired color. You can use a candy thermometer or use the sugar ball method. I have made dark syrups for use in high alcohol content beers, just invert with water and lemon juice, heat slowly on the stove until the water boils off, then keep it on the burner until you hit the color you want, douse with water. The water keeps you from having an impossible mess in the pot, pour the syrup in a mason jar for storage. It will store pretty much forever, too much sugar for anything to survive. The only bad thing about doing it this way is you have to cook however much sugar weight you want from the beginning, because there isn't a real easy way to tell the weight.


You could also buy Belgian candi sugar if your time is more valuable and you don't want to deal with the mess. Most brewing supply places carry it
BelgianDarkRockCandi.jpg
BelgianDarkRockCandi.jpg
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bluc
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Re: Baking your sugars (just below molten state) for flavour ?

Post by bluc »

I made rum with soft crack sugar toffee. Was Good but means to heat enough sugar to soft crack stage means i wont do it again. Was good but flavours didnt carry as much as I thought they would.
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Re: Baking your sugars (just below molten state) for flavour ?

Post by dukethebeagle120 »

Makes me think of maple syrup
its better to think like a fool but keep your mouth shut,then to open ur mouth and have it confirmed
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Ben
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Re: Baking your sugars (just below molten state) for flavour ?

Post by Ben »

The taste is really different from maple. It doesn't have the woody flavor to it. Think toffee, caramel, rock candy.
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