New ideas and innovations

[Bushman]

We had a new member today introduce himself and mention he had built his own still. Maybe I have been around for too long but it seems we do not have as many pictures of builds posted as we did years ago. It also seems like new ideas and designs are not happening like I remember. I understand it is easy to build what is tried and true but other than a few small variations it doesn’t seem like we have had any major breakthroughs for the last five or so years in design. If you have something to share with pictures please do so!
Just rambling on early in the morning without my first cup of coffee!

[googe]

I miss the ideas and innovations too bushman!.

[bronctoad]

well guys, I threw this in here an expected an eyebrow raize

but it seemed old school. maybe we've topped out with technology?,
and the current designs are the cream of the crop. Have we equaled
(small scale wise) current distillery practices? Is there something the big
guys are doing that we can't emulate? We all know that with good practices
"we" create better spirits than store bought with "simpler" equipment. Other
than fine tune-ing procedures and refining base ferments. what is there to
achieve? If there is a further target and "we" are to aim higher let me know
where to look. I love builds and just need direction
If this doesn't belong here have a mod delete my tipsy rambling

Bronctoad

[Bushman]

I wasn’t just thinking of still construction but anything that improves how we make our products. Here is some examples of ideas I have designed and built. But there have been great contributions by others as well and I think we probably have some great ideas other members have done but have not shared for various reasons.

Vacuum filtration system

Making your own copper mesh

[shadylane]

"New ideas and innovations"
Count me in
The only thing better might be an evaluation of the bright ideas that were failures

[googe]

well guys, I threw this in here an expected an eyebrow raize
New Phototastic Collage2.jpg
but it seemed old school. maybe we've topped out with technology?,
and the current designs are the cream of the crop. Have we equaled
(small scale wise) current distillery practices? Is there something the big
guys are doing that we can't emulate? We all know that with good practices
"we" create better spirits than store bought with "simpler" equipment. Other
than fine tune-ing procedures and refining base ferments. what is there to
achieve? If there is a further target and "we" are to aim higher let me know
where to look. I love builds and just need direction
If this doesn't belong here have a mod delete my tipsy rambling

Bronctoad

More info mate?, looks like a carberator with the neeldes lol

[Saltbush Bill]

Seems to me that new ideas and innovations come about when a lot of people are building stills. Five and more years ago a lot more people where building, 8-10 years ago almost everybody built, prior to that everyone built as there where no other good options.
Seems these days lots of new distillers just buy the cheapest off the shelf rubbish they can and try to make do with that.
As we constantly see here, that is often far from the best option.

[Yummyrum]

I think that could be a big part of it Salty .
Online buying has certainly caused a mind sift .

That aside , as regards to new things around here , maybe there haven’t been any major braking ideas recently , but in the last several months , Myself Pope and Getsmokin are working in our continuous strippers . That is something which had always been a minority in Home distilling with few and far between actually working .

Then if you’ve been watching Shady , he’s been experimenting with a variety of Deflags and posting results .
Then theres Shadys slide in plates with Cotton seals ... that I can see as something worth further exploration .

And again Shadys been trying some. New packing , while there have been some recent topics on how to make scrubbers more effective .

Perhaps ground breaking hasn’t happened for a while , but certainly there is new stuff going on .

[googe]

Was thinking that earlier, there is a lot of stuff developed from the forums that is available with the click of a mouse now. Gezzz that sounds bad. Anyway, ive thought about continuous distilling etc and dont think it suits our hobby, just my opinion, no offence intended. Your right sbb, it comes from a.starting point, was reading a thread that mash rookie started the other night and it was so in depth with thought and discussion.

Edit, yeah agree with yummy, shady has tried everything hahA

[LWTCS]

The move toward store bought now is a direct result of the good work that was happening then.

Two of the main vendors were in place but rested on their laurels and seemed to attract customers based on shinny rather than actual optimization.

Then OD's build spurred a bunch of movement that brought us here.
"The Magic Flute" was inspiring users and expanded the commercial space.

googe the thing about the continuous stuff is that you really can run it like batch because heat up times are so greatly reduced. No BS, that 12" rig in Illinois has a 350 gallon per hour beer feed rate and comes on line in literally 10 minutes. Shut down is 5 min. 4 barrels of finished product in a single shift. Never runs more than a shift because he's a strong family man with a new baby.

I think at some point there is a limitation at the hobby scale because hobbyist usually only have so much money they can pump into their outfits.

I feel like the next major paradigm shift may need more/other ancillary technology to exist/improve.

Preservation of heat and or reduction of utility costs is where I'm thinking things will go.

[Bushman]

Also with the explosion of craft distilleries have also contributed a lot to the mix. An example a few years ago when a lot of us were converting from gas to electric. I wanted to do more on the grain so I posted ideas for a screen cover for the electric element so as not to scorch the element. So I shared my idea on this forum, Larry asked for my permission to follow up and improved on my concept. The next year I attended the ADI National conference and was amazed at several other vendors had taken my idea and developed their own. Here is a link to my original idea.
heating screen
PS: There are a lot of other designs as mentioned OD’s flute which I feel was the beginning of the design explosion, I am just posting my ideas because they are easy to find.

[Bushman]

I also remember Myles who used to be very active on this forum as an inventor and innovator. He built a Triple walled condenser that I have tried several times to come up with a better design without success. My thought is it is very efficient and probably would be easier to build than a shotgun condenser. I have worked several times on an easier way to connect the tubes but haven’t yet solved the problem.

[LWTCS]

I've been trying to think of a way to push Slurry through a steam jacketed static mixer.
But don't really think there will be enough dwell time to adequately cook?

[HDNB]

I've been trying to think of a way to push Slurry through a steam jacketed static mixer.
But don't really think there will be enough dwell time to adequately cook?

that's one area that we have not had a lot of success with. a few facets of the hobby just take a certain amount of time and it's just not possible to make the seconds tick by any faster, or slower.

if you ever find a pump that will not leak, pump a grain slurry, handle alcohol and work up to 212* let me know...thats an innovation i could use.

[LWTCS]

I've been trying to think of a way to push Slurry through a steam jacketed static mixer.
But don't really think there will be enough dwell time to adequately cook?

that's one area that we have not had a lot of success with. a few facets of the hobby just take a certain amount of time and it's just not possible to make the seconds tick by any faster, or slower.

if you ever find a pump that will not leak, pump a grain slurry, handle alcohol and work up to 212* let me know...thats an innovation i could use.

Tall order.
Was thinking flexible impeller or even a screw pump.
Either way a positive displacement pump.

[Dewstiller]

Nice thread, not that I have much as a novice and newbie to add to it, but I think it's a shift of society in general with nearly everything.

Back in the day, at least for myself, my family didn't have much and my father maintained and repaired everything from stuff around the house to the cars, bikes, basically everything, etc. Nowadays, it would probably be difficult to find many under age 40 that subscribe to the build your own, maintain it properly or repair it yourself philosophy. It's become a throw-away society in general.

As a newbie to the hobby, I purchased my initial setup all online, piece by piece. The more I am diving into the hobby, my next larger setup will be made by myself, piece by piece. Initially this hobby is overwhelming compared to say just riding your bike, hiking, target shooting, etc. so it's pretty easy for a guy initially to just buy something off the shelf, with rise in manufacturing throughout the world and probably specifically China, and most of the world having internet, it's an easy way to do it.

I have a few friends under the age of 40 a couple of them barley own a hammer and a proper set of screwdrivers, I am not sure they would have the skills to do even some of the basics on this forum. That's not to say everyone is like that though, many can hold their own.

[Beerswimmer]

I'm excitedly watching the guys working on the continuous stills. Having a quick starting still that can run as long as you have wash can be a real time saver for the weekend warrior types, or just for the people that are busy with other things and can't devote as many 8+hr days to the hobby as they'd like. Just one long day to complete the work of many long days of stripping and dumping multiple washes. All of us can easily make enough wash to to fill a barrel, but how many stripping runs and spirit runs will it take to get through it? Saving time is the "innovation" I'm looking for.

[The Baker]

Piston pump?
This is not just speculation.
Though this pump might not handle straight alcoholic liquid, dunno, quite possibly it would.
Certainly it would handle a (thickish?) slurry.

In the bakery we had a pie cooker.
Stainless, like a 44 gallon drum (55 gallon American) on its end. Gas heated to cook the pie filling.
With a stirrer fitted to the top.
(Meat pies, not fruit though that may have been possible).
It was fitted with a piston pump, adjustable so that each stroke delivered enough filling for one meat pie through a long flexible
hose with a stainless 'nozzle'.

Geoff

[LWTCS]

Piston pump?
This is not just speculation.
Though this pump might not handle straight alcoholic liquid, dunno, quite possibly it would.
Certainly it would handle a (thickish?) slurry.

In the bakery we had a pie cooker.
Stainless, like a 44 gallon drum (55 gallon American) on its end. Gas heated to cook the pie filling.
With a stirrer fitted to the top.
(Meat pies, not fruit though that may have been possible).
It was fitted with a piston pump, adjustable so that each stroke delivered enough filling for one meat pie through a long flexible
hose with a stainless 'nozzle'.

Geoff

!!!

[seabass]

There's definitely been a huge shift on people buying vs building. It's surprising to me considering how easy and cheap it is to get stainless spools and have a modular setup. And those cheap off the shelf ones are overpriced for what they are.

It's also very hard to find cheap copper pipe these days. At least for me. I wanted to build a 4in perforated column, but cost of just the 4in pipe would run over $300. I think it's actually cheaper to buy spools and have someone weld a perf plate to it.

I'd love to do my part with experimenting and innovating, but I wouldn't know where to begin other than going in a more extreme modular direction. It really does feel like everything has already been done.

I do have one idea that I'll be messing with that's not fully hashed out... My 70l cooler mash tun is on its way out and I'll be building one out of a 100l stock pot. I'm going for a removable false bottom with a bit of space under it and a stainless coil to allow for steam heating for both maintaining mash temp and possibly stripping on the grain. I know modifying a mashtun into a beer stripper is a somewhat common thing for pros to do when building their own equipment. It just seems like the right thing for me to do with overhauling my mash tun and adding the ability to strip on the grain.

[bronctoad]

well guys, I threw this in here an expected an eyebrow raize
New Phototastic Collage2.jpg
but it seemed old school. maybe we've topped out with technology?,
and the current designs are the cream of the crop. Have we equaled
(small scale wise) current distillery practices? Is there something the big
guys are doing that we can't emulate? We all know that with good practices
"we" create better spirits than store bought with "simpler" equipment. Other
than fine tune-ing procedures and refining base ferments. what is there to
achieve? If there is a further target and "we" are to aim higher let me know
where to look. I love builds and just need direction
If this doesn't belong here have a mod delete my tipsy rambling

Bronctoad

More info mate?, looks like a carberator with the neeldes lol

Hey Googe
This would be my rendition of a inline bypassable BOKA with a catch plate drain
needle valve and a retractable 1 3/4" gate valve to collect fores and heads in
the closed/operate positions, then for hearts the open/bypass position to the CCVM
head and product condenser
I came up with this after talking to a few contributors here about the idea. It is a product of
conversation from our HD
Bronctoad

[Jack C]

I think the next big thing for hobby distillation will be safe and easy built steam generators and continues strippers. When this is worked out for hobby size it will be as big a deal as Dads CCVM work. I was lurking the site when that happened and I built several of them. They are still one of the fastest and easiest neutral rigs.

[HDNB]

I think the next big thing for hobby distillation will be safe and easy built steam generators and continues strippers. When this is worked out for hobby size it will be as big a deal as Dads CCVM work. I was lurking the site when that happened and I built several of them. They are still one of the fastest and easiest neutral rigs.

i was over at a local craft place. he had a 600l kettle that was steam heated in a bain marie...it was about a 2.5-3 inch thick jacket, full of water with the electrics immersed in the water.
had a simple blow off valve, i think he said 15lbs.

said he had only popped it once, when he got greedy on speedy...otherwise the thing just chugs along at a nice pace.

seems like the answer for working on the grain with electrics.

[LWTCS]

I think the next big thing for hobby distillation will be safe and easy built steam generators and continues strippers. When this is worked out for hobby size it will be as big a deal as Dads CCVM work. I was lurking the site when that happened and I built several of them. They are still one of the fastest and easiest neutral rigs.

CCVM time signature is Manu's no?

[The Baker]

re the piston pump I mentioned above:
it pumps say one stroke per second and a custom model could have a bigger bore, longer stroke, and maybe be faster.
In other words with a greatly increased capacity.
And with alcohol tolerant seals, whatever.

Geoff

[nerdybrewer]

Old ways worked pretty good for a long time.
I know there's good in innovation, but how much?
I built one post still, it's served me very well.
Got materials to build a thumper, but haven't gotten on that project due to one thing and another.
Steam injection, continuous stilling, other fancy stuff...
Maybe good stuff there, I'm trying to master the pot still and know I haven't gotten there yet.

[shadylane]

Some folks enjoy building Stills

Some folks don't have the tools or ability to.
They buy one and enjoy learning how to use it.

Some of us enjoy making "Rube Goldberg" contraptions
In this hobby, Practical isn't necessarily a requirement
As long as it's safe, educational and/or entertaining
It's all good

On a side note
The still itself is only a tool
When looking for new ideas and innovations
Don't forget all the other aspects of this giant sized rabbit hole
Folks that share their experiments and experiences are the real goldmine

[NZChris]

I've seen quite a few innovative ideas posted in my time here, some of them recently.

Ideas don't always get pounced on and turned into Tried & True methods and equipment so that all you have to is wait for somebody else to do all the hard work of developing and testing them for you.

[malt_gt_milton]

We had a new member today introduce himself and mention he had built his own still. Maybe I have been around for too long but it seems we do not have as many pictures of builds posted as we did years ago. It also seems like new ideas and designs are not happening like I remember. I understand it is easy to build what is tried and true but other than a few small variations it doesn’t seem like we have had any major breakthroughs for the last five or so years in design. If you have something to share with pictures please do so!
Just rambling on early in the morning without my first cup of coffee!

This may not be much, but here goes.
I didn't like that the output of my boka was sooo hot, and thought to add a Liebeg to cool it. Realizing the total amount of heat to be dissipated was fairly small -- the heavy lifting has already been done by the condenser at the top of the column -- I just needed to cool the resulting liquid a few degrees. So I soldered some cooling "bowties" to the boka output pipe, alternating them 90 degrees back and forth down the tube to catch the most cool air, and voila! -- works great. Not good at soldering or metalwork, so mine is not so pretty...
I cut the bowties from 6" lengths of 3/4" pipe, annealed and slit open lengthwise, then slit again into two narrower pieces. As you can see I trimmed off all sharp corners.
May add a few more to bring the temp down a bit more, already much cooler than before tho.
Would love to hear feedback, thanks!

mgtm

[Saltbush Bill]

CCVM time signature is Manu's no?

Yes I would think so.