LM, VM, CM still designations.

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RocketSurgeon
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LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by RocketSurgeon » Thu Dec 31, 2020 3:10 pm

What do the LM, VM, and CM still designations mean? I see them referenced frequently, but can't find an explanation.

Also, in Zymurgy Bob's post Read Me First Discussion (http://www.artisan-distiller.net/phpBB3 ... 46#p121746), he says; "In An Overview of Potstilling, you learned how to run your potstill...".

I am unable to find that post or any reference to it.

Will some kind soul please point me to it?

Thanks.
Not to get technical, but according to chemistry alcohol is a solution.

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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by zed255 » Thu Dec 31, 2020 3:35 pm

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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by Saltbush Bill » Thu Dec 31, 2020 3:48 pm

Liquid Management , Vapour Management , Cooling Management.
As far as I'm aware not all of Bobs book can be viewed free on line, it is for sale though and pretty easy to track down.

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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by Bushman » Thu Dec 31, 2020 4:03 pm

Also a good search for terms would be our glossary:
viewtopic.php?f=46&t=58100

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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by kimbodious » Thu Dec 31, 2020 4:37 pm

Might as well add CCVM to the list of acronyms - condenser controlled vapour management
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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by OtisT » Thu Dec 31, 2020 5:02 pm

That just makes it a CM in my book.
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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by Yummyrum » Thu Dec 31, 2020 10:02 pm

OtisT wrote:
Thu Dec 31, 2020 5:02 pm
That just makes it a CM in my book.
Not really Otis , in a CCVM you are not adjusting coolant flow but rather moving the physical position of the condenser . It is a VM .

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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by Saltbush Bill » Fri Jan 01, 2021 1:58 am

I see where Otis is coming from....by moving the condenser up or down are you not managing the amount of cooling?

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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by kimbodious » Fri Jan 01, 2021 3:50 am

No, but you are changing where the reflux is occurring (in relation to the offtake). A similar discussion about the nature of the CCVM design took place in 2013 in the Condenser Controlled Column thread viewtopic.php?f=17&t=41579
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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by RocketSurgeon » Fri Jan 01, 2021 7:52 pm

Didn't see those terms in the glossary I located previously. Perhaps there is more than one. Thanks.
Not to get technical, but according to chemistry alcohol is a solution.

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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by Prairiepiss » Sun Jan 03, 2021 8:30 pm

Yummyrum wrote:
Thu Dec 31, 2020 10:02 pm
OtisT wrote:
Thu Dec 31, 2020 5:02 pm
That just makes it a CM in my book.
Not really Otis , in a CCVM you are not adjusting coolant flow but rather moving the physical position of the condenser . It is a VM .
You are not controlling the coolant flow. Yes you are correct in that statement. But you are controlling the coolant. You are not controlling the vapors by mechanical means. You are controlling the vapor with the coolant you are controlling by moving it. So it’s a CM still.

You are letting alcohol vapors through by the amount of cooling action the coolant system is imposing on the rising vapors. And you are adjusting the coolant system to allow the vapors you want to flow by. Again it’s a cooling management still.

Just because the condenser is above the takeoff doesn’t make it not a CM still. You are just imposing your will on the vapors from a different angle. Above the take off instead of below the takeoff.

You are physically adjusting the coolant system. You are not physically adjusting the vapors. So I would agree. That is a CM still in my book.
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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by bluefish_dist » Sun Jan 03, 2021 8:51 pm

I would disagree and say it’s a vm. You are managing the takeoff by valving the vapor. You just happen to use a condenser as the valve.

If you lowered the condenser and then controlled it by coolant flow I would say, yes it’s a CM. But by raising and lowering the condenser with a fixed flow, you are not using coolant flow to manage takeoff.
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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by kimbodious » Mon Jan 04, 2021 12:37 am

8AC00995-AF5E-4B6C-B124-5175FE47387C.jpeg
0B7407C7-4D5C-493C-8E12-5DDE70F83C1D.jpeg
When the RC is above the offtake, you can change the flow of coolant but the result is the same.
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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by Tummydoc » Mon Jan 04, 2021 1:17 am

It's CCVM, not CCCM for a reason. Your condenser becomes the valve as stated above, and coolant flow is not the controlling factor.

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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by kimbodious » Mon Jan 04, 2021 2:18 am

I feel bad that I am somewhat to blame for this thread being hijacked. I am happy if the moderators want to move the tail end of this thread to the condenser controlled column thread
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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by Yummyrum » Mon Jan 04, 2021 3:02 am

Thanks for the graphic Kimbodious . That says what I was thinking exactly .

No need to move it . It is a good discussion and quite relavent . ... and I’m not just saying that ‘cause its validating my theory . :oops:

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Re: LM, VM, CM still designations.

Post by thecroweater » Wed Feb 17, 2021 3:06 pm

Adjusting where the condenser is to change where and how the vapour is collected is mechanical as heck, it is the definition of mechanical manipulation. Such a configuration will/does change the type of management 100% and not in any ambiguous way. What class of management still this is relates directly to the configuration it is ran at any given time, ei. It varies.
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