If you could choose

Little or nothing to do with distillation.

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CoopsOz
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Post by CoopsOz » Sat Feb 16, 2008 5:23 pm

We could ban rope! :lol: Or at the very least, make it a requirement to have a license IOT buy it.
It is most absurdly said, in popular language, of any man, that he is disguised in liquor; for, on the contrary, most men are disguised by sobriety. ~Thomas de Quincy, Confessions of an English Opium-Eater, 1856

Butch50
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Post by Butch50 » Sat Feb 16, 2008 5:40 pm

Don't home owned guns get used significantly more often for suicides than self-defense globally anyhow?
The Gun Facts link that UJ provided a few messages back debunks that myth, along with many other gun myths. It really is a worthwhile read, and isn't very long.
Banjos and Whisky, Down On The River Bank

Cruisaire
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Post by Cruisaire » Sat Feb 16, 2008 6:17 pm

My favorite multipurpose tool

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wineo
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Post by wineo » Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:46 pm

Nice rifle UJ! Reminds me of a rugar no.1.I have a 308 that will group like that.It groups good out to about 800yds if your shooting off a good rest.I have the trigger pull set at 14ozs.If your doing that with open sights,your eyes must be good.Mine aint what they used to be.Getting old sucks!

belialNZ
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Post by belialNZ » Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:52 pm

blanikdog wrote:When firearm ownership was made virtually illegal in Australia suicide by shooting dropped around 80%.

During the same period suicide by hanging increased by around 80%.

blanik
hhehe, little surprise there, if someone wants to kill themselves, they will. Ban rope and they'll be drowning themselves.

I would expect that in an environment where gun ownership is easier, that the suicide figures would be higher (simply because its VERY easy to suicide that way).

However I wouldn't DREAM to think that gun ownership causes suicides. Its just a very easy, and hard to f'up, method.

Anyhow, NZ and Australia have higher gun ownership per head of population than America anyhow, just, no hand guns (well, you can if you are a gun enthusiast and have the right license).

And I still want a semi-auto shotgun.

rad14701
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Post by rad14701 » Sat Feb 16, 2008 8:15 pm

blanikdog wrote:When firearm ownership was made virtually illegal in Australia suicide by shooting dropped around 80%.

During the same period suicide by hanging increased by around 80%.

blanik
So who will the government go after next, the rope makers or the lamp cord manufacturers...???

"I'm sorry sir but there's a mandatory four day waiting period to complete a background check before we can sell you that extension cord." :shock:

Butch50
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Post by Butch50 » Sat Feb 16, 2008 9:16 pm

So who will the government go after next, the rope makers or the lamp cord manufacturers...???
Believe it or not - knives were on the docket for banning in Scotland, dont know how it turned out though - you know there is no logical stopping place for banning weapons, you would end up banning rocks eventually :D . Check out this news article from 2006: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scot ... 788881.stm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow


Swords ban to beat violent crime

Swords were handed in and destroyed during a knife amnesty
A crackdown on the sale of swords has been launched as part of a campaign to tackle knife crime and violence.
Justice Minister Cathy Jamieson announced laws to ban swords unless sold for legitimate reasons.

Shops selling swords will need a licence, as will businesses dealing with non-domestic knives and other bladed weapons such as machetes.

The measures are the latest steps from the Scottish Executive to curb the problem of knife crime.

They come weeks after a nationwide knife amnesty.

A total of 12,645 blades - including lock knives, machetes, swords, meat cleavers, bayonets and axes - were handed in during the five-week amnesty.

People must realise that swords cause horrific injuries when they get into the wrong hands

Det Chief Supt John Carnochan
Violence Reduction Unit

Exemptions to the ban on sword sales include swords that are to be used for Highland dancing, museum displays, historical re-enactments, fencing and martial arts.

Ms Jamieson said: "Knife-carrying is all too prevalent in some communities, particularly in the west of Scotland, and has cut short and scarred too many young lives.

"In these areas police, doctors and law-abiding citizens have seen the damaging effects of swords, including samurai swords, being wielded on the streets.

"It is simply far too easy at present for these weapons to be bought and sold."

Anyone selling swords under the exemptions would have to take "reasonable steps" to establish that the intended use was a legitimate one.

Commercial sellers will have to comply with strict new licensing conditions, including keeping records of all sales.

'Deep-rooted culture'

Ms Jamieson added: "The licensing regime for sales of all non-domestic knives should help weed out unscrupulous traders and help legitimate traders take steps to avoid these dangerous weapons falling into the wrong hands."


Shops selling swords under exemption would need a licence

The measures will be included in a new Sentencing Bill, which will go before the Scottish Parliament later in the year.

It comes after First Minister Jack McConnell announced a five-point plan to tackle knife crime in November 2004.

Other parts of the plan brought in under the Police, Public Order and Criminal Justice (Scotland) Act doubled the maximum penalty for carrying a knife to four years, gave police the unconditional power to search someone they suspect of carrying a weapon and increased the minimum age for buying a knife from 16 to 18.

Det Ch Supt John Carnochan, head of the police's violence reduction unit, hailed the measures as "another major step forward in the fight against knife crime and violence".

More than half the murders in Scotland each year are carried out with knives or other sharp weapons.

Det Ch Supt Carnochan said a licensing scheme alone would not solve "the deep-rooted culture of violence which is prevalent in parts of Scotland" but added that combined with the other measures it would have a positive impact.

Cultural problem

He added: "People must realise that swords cause horrific injuries when they get into the wrong hands. We routinely see incidents involving swords, which result in appalling injuries."

Kenny MacAskill MSP, justice spokesman for the SNP, said: "We must continue to recognise that knives are as much of a cultural problem in our communities as they are a criminal one.

"We must ensure we tackle the causes as well as the symptoms of this scar on our communities."

Margaret Mitchell, justice spokeswoman for the Scottish Conservatives , said: "I broadly welcome these moves but legislation alone is never going to be enough.

"We have to make sure that anyone who would use any kind of knife or weapon feels the full force of the law and the strongest possible custodial sentence."



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blanikdog
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Post by blanikdog » Sat Feb 16, 2008 9:36 pm

Butch50 wrote:...He added: "People must realise that swords cause horrific injuries when they get into the wrong hands. We routinely see incidents involving swords, which result in appalling injuries."
Bugger!! Who would have thought that weapons of war can result in 'horrific injuries' :roll: :roll: :roll:


blanik
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HookLine
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Post by HookLine » Sun Feb 17, 2008 12:02 am

belialNZ wrote:Anyhow, NZ and Australia have higher gun ownership per head of population than America anyhow, just, no hand guns (well, you can if you are a gun enthusiast and have the right license).
You sure about that (for Oz at least)?
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Butch50
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Post by Butch50 » Sun Feb 17, 2008 8:49 am

gave police the unconditional power to search someone they suspect
Perhaps the scariest statement I have read in a long time about a "free" country.
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Usge
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Post by Usge » Sun Feb 17, 2008 1:05 pm

Guns don't kill people...it's just the noise that they make.

Look, guns are dangerous. Anything that easy to use with that much capability is dangerous. And, it's not like guns are "new" to people/society either. Personally, I've always felt that training and knowledge is the most important thing. When I was growing up, we were trained in all aspects of firearms. It was just part of growing up. Even the neighbors had permission to kick your ass if they saw you "waving" something around, or improper carry or etc.,

I have a "very" healthy respect for what they can do. EVEN when they are "not loaded". That was one of my earliest lessons. You don't treat it one way when it's "loaded" and act another way with it when it's not. They derserve a healthy amount of respect. 2ndly, I now live in a very, very congrested, cramped living quarters, area. I totally understand why firearm ownership and particularly carry is strictly limited here. I understand it because I know what they can do. I already know what can happen if somebody who bought a .44 mag S&W after they saw Dirty Harry movies discharged that weapon inside an apt. building.

I was very fortunate to have the careful training that I had. But, the truth is training, and common sense is not a requirement to purchase a firearm. It's harder to get a drivers lic. in that particular regard. You have to take a test, go on supervised probationary periods of using it, etc., before you get a lic. And just like driving a car, it just as much depends on the person next to you (ie..how good a driver THEY are) sometimes more than it depends on you doing the right thing. You may know you are a good driver, and do everything right. But, all it takes is one asshole to come barrelling through to cause a multi-car pile up.

Sometimes it's more important to be aware of the people around you. Just ask Dick Chenny's hunting partner.

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Post by Husker » Sun Feb 17, 2008 2:02 pm

Usge wrote:EVEN when they are "not loaded".
Since I teach hunter education, this is one of my fav videos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZE3QAeYRk-A" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

What a dumb ass. Darwin has a way to deal with dumb asses like this.

H.

Old Goat
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Post by Old Goat » Sun Feb 17, 2008 6:06 pm

I have never been a firearms aficionado, after reading report after report of handguns, especially being rarely used for protection in a home environment. More than likely are used against family members or in the commission of crime. However, since my recent move from the city to a rural environment, I have begun to see the value of firearms. We recently purchased a Henry Golden Boy, and am now looking for a shotgun. Not so much for personal protection, as for property protection, warding off varmits endangering the livestock. I wanted a Winchester Model 9410, but is no longer in production and very expensive. So, I am looking at pump action. A cop told me a few years back after I was burglerized, that if you have a pump shotgun, the sound of the gun being cocked is enough to send most intruders out the door and leaving your goods behind. If anyone has any recommendations on a reasonably priced good-looking small guage shotgun, let er rip.

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rad14701
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Post by rad14701 » Sun Feb 17, 2008 6:49 pm

Old Goat wrote:A cop told me a few years back after I was burglerized, that if you have a pump shotgun, the sound of the gun being cocked is enough to send most intruders out the door and leaving your goods behind.
I wouldn't consider that to be the best course of action... Wracking a round into the chamber just tells an already locked and loaded criminal where to shoot first as he knows you're not as ready as he is... He'll also already have the safety off... The train of thought should be that the intruder is no beginner whereas this will be the first time you're performing under pressure... Having a gun in your hand increases the chance of you getting killed as the intruder feels that he has nothing to lose by unloading indiscriminate gunfire and he doesn't care who is on the other side of thin interior walls...

Everyone needs to think before playing cowboy... If you think you want to take that route, and have never been shot at from close range, you owe it to yourself to think twice... Also be sure you're ready to cross the line from supposed intimidation to laying out some lead, knowing that you might kill someone... I've exchanged non-combat close quarters gunfire more than once and have had a warm gun barrel pressed to the side of my head... I'm still here to talk about it so I speak from experience... That's as much detail as I'll ever share so don't ask...

HookLine
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Post by HookLine » Sun Feb 17, 2008 7:12 pm

rad14701 wrote:I've exchanged non-combat close quarters gunfire more than once and have had a warm gun barrel pressed to the side of my head... I'm still here to talk about it so I speak from experience... That's as much detail as I'll ever share so don't ask...
Location: New York.

Say no more.
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Be discreet.
And have fun.

rad14701
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Post by rad14701 » Sun Feb 17, 2008 7:48 pm

HookLine wrote:Location: New York.

Say no more.
The state, not the city... I live as far West of NYC as you can get and still be in the state... Only a couple miles from the state line in two directions... Surrounded by and grew up as a country bumpkin but live in a small city setting these days... Oh, how I long to live a secluded life in the back-woods where I can neither see or hear my neighbors...

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wow

Post by Uncle Jesse » Sun Feb 17, 2008 8:08 pm

that moron is lucky he didn't shoot a student
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Usge
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Post by Usge » Sun Feb 17, 2008 9:15 pm

Husker wrote:
Usge wrote:EVEN when they are "not loaded".
Since I teach hunter education, this is one of my fav videos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZE3QAeYRk-A" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

What a dumb ass. Darwin has a way to deal with dumb asses like this.

H.
Good Lord!! Yea...bring that other "gun" out. (you hear them moan).
I would just mention, for the people watching such a display of utter stupidity...you "can" leave. You don't have to, nor are you required...to stay and see what or whom he shoots next.

HookLine
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Post by HookLine » Sun Feb 17, 2008 9:26 pm

rad14701 wrote:
HookLine wrote:Location: New York.

Say no more.
The state, not the city... I live as far West of NYC as you can get and still be in the state... Only a couple miles from the state line in two directions... Surrounded by and grew up as a country bumpkin but live in a small city setting these days... Oh, how I long to live a secluded life in the back-woods where I can neither see or hear my neighbors...
Is my ignorance about US geography showing, or what? :oops: :roll:

So, if somebody says New York, how do you know if they mean the state or the city?

I have lived in a rural area for many years, one neighbour is just stone's throw away, but the rest are far enough off to be out of my mind. Everybody round here likes it quiet and keeps to themselves, so we all get on. I love it. Probably moving to an even more secluded property in a couple of years. The most important civilising factor of all is plenty of space between people.
Be safe.
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And have fun.

rad14701
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Post by rad14701 » Mon Feb 18, 2008 6:38 am

@HookLine...

No, I doubt that you are geographically challenged... It is quite common, however, for people to interpret NY as NYC, like the rest of the state exists for no other purpose than to provide a tax base to support our states cash drain... I've been there once and have no desire or reason to ever return... I'm more of a dirt road than a concrete jungle kinda guy...

Oh, yeah, how to tell the difference... The "City" part gives it away... The only people who don't add that part are the ones who live in the city and have forgotten about the other 90-some percent of the state even existing... There really is an inland/upstate New York that doesn't dangle in the Atlantic Ocean...

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Post by doc barleycorn » Wed Feb 20, 2008 9:36 pm

Kimber custom CDP. Nothing like the feel of .45 ACP in the heel of your hand.

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