Controller double check

[NZChris]

If we select say 25% power in Time proportional mode , the element turns on for 25 full cycles , then off for 75 cycles .
The whole heat cool cycle is 2 seconds @50Hz and less than 2 seconds at 60Hz

Using a PID that does that on elements that were not designed for it has killed two elements for me before the jobs were done. Both times, I knew it was a possibility, but thought I would get away with it

[Yummyrum]

If we select say 25% power in Time proportional mode , the element turns on for 25 full cycles , then off for 75 cycles .
The whole heat cool cycle is 2 seconds @50Hz and less than 2 seconds at 60Hz

Using a PID that does that on elements that were not designed for it has killed two elements for me before the jobs were done. Both times, I knew it was a possibility, but thought I would get away with it

Chris ,perhaps you did use some older elements that were
not designed for periodic cycling , but bcook is using modern elements that I’m sure the manufacturers have realised will be undoubtably controlled by electronic control that invariably uses some kind if rapid switching .

He also is using a 6kw element that he will run at only 1.5kw . There alone is a massive safety margin.

Then , if he uses Burst-fire mode on his DSPR1 that is designed to cause maximum power verses time dispersion , then he has absolutely no concerns of element failure .

I'd recon Auber would have gone broke by now if they were selling Element Munting Controler's

[Demy]

https://www.auberins.com/index.php?main ... cts_id=444
At the bottom of the description it is specified how best to use according to the load / type of relay

[psf]

bcook608 are you still in the planning stage or did you already buy a bunch of stuff?

The reason I asked is because you can use a different enclosure and have a forward facing controller rather than a top facing controller. Here's a project box I used for my most recent 240V build using the Auber DSPR 400.

I mounted a fan on the top which blows air down directly over the SSR and the air vents out the side. Here's some pics I just took.

Front view. There's a green power indicator light, the DSPR 400, an alarm/light/buzzer and an alarm kill switch.
Controller 01.jpg


The rear has the power in, the power out, a RTD sensor connector and the power on/off switch.
Controller 02.jpg


Side view with a fan guard where the air exits.
Controller 03.jpg


The underside has 4 rubber feet.
Controller 04.jpg

you got a wiring diagram for this beauty? When my boys are out of school this summer and I can't run, I plan to upgrade my controller box. Right now I just have a still dragon design. no on off switch, no fan. I'd also like to make a ccvm column so I'll need some temperature monitoring and more precise control than the dial knob.

My only issue is that I'll have to run separate 110V into the box because my garage plug is a 3 wire welding plug.

[Salt Must Flow]

bcook608 are you still in the planning stage or did you already buy a bunch of stuff?

The reason I asked is because you can use a different enclosure and have a forward facing controller rather than a top facing controller. Here's a project box I used for my most recent 240V build using the Auber DSPR 400.

I mounted a fan on the top which blows air down directly over the SSR and the air vents out the side. Here's some pics I just took.

Front view. There's a green power indicator light, the DSPR 400, an alarm/light/buzzer and an alarm kill switch.
Controller 01.jpg


The rear has the power in, the power out, a RTD sensor connector and the power on/off switch.
Controller 02.jpg


Side view with a fan guard where the air exits.
Controller 03.jpg


The underside has 4 rubber feet.
Controller 04.jpg

you got a wiring diagram for this beauty? When my boys are out of school this summer and I can't run, I plan to upgrade my controller box. Right now I just have a still dragon design. no on off switch, no fan. I'd also like to make a ccvm column so I'll need some temperature monitoring and more precise control than the dial knob.

My only issue is that I'll have to run separate 110V into the box because my garage plug is a 3 wire welding plug.

I tried sending you the wiring diagram in a private message, but it wouldn't allow me to attach an image for some reason so I posted a topic with the controller build.

Auber EZboil DSPR 400 Controller

[psf]

I tried sending you the wiring diagram in a private message, but it wouldn't allow me to attach an image for some reason so I posted a topic with the controller build.

Auber EZboil DSPR 400 Controller

Thank you sir! I will probably have follow on questions in that post when I get to it but for now I have it bookmarked and its enough to let this old dog hunt. Thanks again

[NZChris]

He also is using a 6kw element that he will run at only 1.5kw . There alone is a massive safety margin.

Yes, it is. It's a trick I use with elements that are heating washes. I got frustrated with waking up on frosty mornings to find a fermenter freezing the nuts off my yeast because of a blown element, now all those elements are used with two in series so that they only put out 1/4 of their rated Watts. I haven't had a blown element since.

[bcook608]

UPDATE:

So I took a lot of the suggestions that you guys gave me and reworked the design.

Here is what I have. The wiring diagram is a little messy, but I'm using MS paint to create it so it's about as good as it's going to get. Anyway, it's wired the same as the first, the hardware is just in different locations.

Here is the new layout. This is still a top down view as the table I will be using is rather short. Also, if I feel like mounting it to a stand, this will be able to accommodate that

control panel layout.jpg (6.45 KiB) Viewed 2410 times

This is the (messy) wiring diagram

Obviously the wires will be able to be run underneath the ammeter, so it will be cleaner when assembled.

As you can see, I placed both fans directly over the heatsink and SSR. I tested the fans at straight 110v and they are whisper quiet. Plus they're cheap enough that when/if they start making noise, I will just replace them. I also took a page from SMF and located the power in and power out on the same side of the box. the vent for the air flow will also be placed between the cable lugs for a clean and professional appearance (I hope)

Also, one thing that I did notice about my ammeter is that it doesn't have to be wired in-line to get a reading. Do you think that will help with the flickering that NZC was referring to? Since it has a dedicated power line for the meter and samples the current via the ring, that shouldn't be as big of an issue, right?

These diagrams are also to scale. At least to the best of my ability and current patience level.

[bcook608]

If all you want is a variable power controller, no temp reading and zero bells & whistles then the DSPR1 will be just fine.

That sounds like JUST what I'm looking for. All that other extra stuff is just confusing to me. Maybe after I get the hang of electric I'll branch out to the other fancier units.

[bcook608]

And upon further review, I will probably move the cable lugs to the bottom for possible mounting on a stand.

[Salt Must Flow]

And upon further review, I will probably move the cable lugs to the bottom for possible mounting on a stand.

Something like this would work nicely if you are mounting this box vertically. Both power cables could be installed through the bottom like you mentioned.

Wiring.png (19.12 KiB) Viewed 2403 times

[bcook608]

And upon further review, I will probably move the cable lugs to the bottom for possible mounting on a stand.

Something like this would work nicely if you are mounting this box vertically. Both power cables could be installed through the bottom like you mentioned.


Wiring.png

Damn, that does look better. Then I could put the vent holes at the top and convection and the fans will push the warm air out the top and pull the cooler air in the bottom.

[Salt Must Flow]

If all you want is a variable power controller, no temp reading and zero bells & whistles then the DSPR1 will be just fine.

That sounds like JUST what I'm looking for. All that other extra stuff is just confusing to me. Maybe after I get the hang of electric I'll branch out to the other fancier units.

You'll love using your controller once it's finished. If you ever do choose to use another EZboil model, your current components can be used rather than building an entirely new controller with all new parts. That amp/volt meter is going to flicker like crazy when running at any % power other than 100%, but will work perfectly with that Still Dragon kit with SSVR & potentiometer.

The RTD sensor senses the temp and it is displayed on the Auber unit in 1/10th degree resolution in distilling mode. The probe is also used when using the controller in PID mode. It's just 3 connections directly to the Auber unit. The panel mount makes it really convenient to quick disconnect the probe from the controller box rather than having it hard wired and dedicated to one controller. I've broken a few of those sensors so it's nice to be able to disconnect it.

The 12V green LED is wired directly to the SSR terminals simply to illuminate whenever the element is on. It lights up solid when you're running at 100% power and pulses at whatever % power you are running.

The red light/alarm buzzer is wired directly to the terminals on the Auber unit. There are two programmable alarms on the DSPR 400. You can turn them off or set whatever temps you want. I find it convenient to stick the RTD sensor behind the insulation at the base of my column or riser, set an alarm for 100F and it lets me know when vapor is starting to rise up the column. I then move the probe up to the vapor takeoff and the alarm lets me know the moment vapor reaches the top of the column and reflux has begun. I do this for every run and I really appreciate it. Sure you could do that with any digital thermometer that has a probe and alarm function too. The kill switch is just wired in line with the buzzer so you can switch it right off then turn the alarm function off within the Auber unit's menu.

It may look like a lot, but it really is pretty basic. Having proven wiring diagrams is also really handy if you don't really understand the wiring.

[bcook608]

Man, I can't wait until Tuesday gets here and I can start putting this bad boy together!
Then I have to order the parts and tools to modify the still. Going to be brazing on a 2" t/c for the heater and eventually another on the lid for a 2" offset/slanted column.

[bcook608]

It's going to look something like this:

This is not to scale. It's a 5 gallon stock pot. I'll be using a sight glass at the base to monitor for pukes or excess foaming, then a 45* offset with a 12" extension to 2 90* elbows and a 24" shotgun. All 2" diameter and everything above the sight glass and before the PC will contain copper packing since it will be all stainless except the copper shotgun. I know the shotgun is overkill but I had it designed for my 26gal and that one will be out of commission for a while and I couldn't justify letting the condenser sit on a shelf collecting dust.

[EricTheRed]

Just make sure that your shotgun doesn't have restrictions when running at an angle. Ie. Tubes are free of any liquid.

[bcook608]

Just make sure that your shotgun doesn't have restrictions when running at an angle. Ie. Tubes are free of any liquid.

They're clear, they won't have any internal baffling in the vapor path, and the end is more cone shaped than bowl shaped. I was limited by the shitty program on my computer. It's also a modular build so I'll be able to adjust the angle and will likely run it at a more severe angle to promote flow.

[EricTheRed]

Good stuff.
Until i modified mine, had huffing issues due to liquid pooling in the low side

[Salt Must Flow]

I'm all for using multiple 90 elbows, but you could save a few bucks by using a 2" stainless U especially if you consider the additional gasket & clamp that would be needed using elbows. One benefit to using elbows is that every joint articulates so you can set the condenser at different angles easier. You'll be good to go either way you do it.

[bcook608]

I'm all for using multiple 90 elbows, but you could save a few bucks by using a 2" stainless U especially if you consider the additional gasket & clamp that would be needed using elbows. One benefit to using elbows is that every joint articulates so you can set the condenser at different angles easier. You'll be good to go either way you do it.

That's why I went with 90s, figured I'd probably have to have the shotgun at a more severe angle. Plus it'll let me rest the condenser against the pot for bracing itself

[bcook608]

Here's the finished product!

Thank you for all of your help and suggestions! It vastly improved the quality of the finished design! And the inside looks like the flying spaghetti monster so I will likely not post pics.

Next up is ordering the parts to convert the still, but that's going to have to wait until the next payday. I promised SWMBO that I'd split it up.

[Salt Must Flow]

Well that turned out very nice! My wiring typically looks like spaghetti too. I tend to focus more on whether it is wired right than how the wiring looks too.

Would you mind posting a pic of where the air exits? Do you have fan guards covering the exit holes?

[bcook608]

Well that turned out very nice! My wiring typically looks like spaghetti too. I tend to focus more on whether it is wired right than how the wiring looks too.

Would you mind posting a pic of where the air exits? Do you have fan guards covering the exit holes?

Right now I have (5) 1" holes in the top. No cover at the moment but I will be adding some screen to the inside of the box to make it look nicer.

[NZChris]

It looks a lot tidier than controllers in my shed.

[bcook608]

It looks a lot tidier than controllers in my shed.

Thanks Chris!

[Yummyrum]

Nice job bcook .

Have you had a chance to run it .How bad is the Meter reading when you turn down the power ?
Is it better when you you use Burst-fire verses Time proportional modes .

[Salt Must Flow]

bcook608, if that Amp/Watt meter flickering bothers you, you could always install a tiny little toggle switch and wire the meter through it. That way you can simply switch it off when doing a spirit run. You can order them online, but you can also pick one up at a local hardware store too.

I drew a red X where I would install a switch.

[bcook608]

Nice job bcook .

Have you had a chance to run it .How bad is the Meter reading when you turn down the power ?
Is it better when you you use Burst-fire verses Time proportional modes .

I have to wait for payday to get the element and ferrules to braze on for the conversion but once I'm back up and running I'll do some experimentation and let you know how the different modes affect the controller and the behavior of the element/still.

[Salt Must Flow]

I 3D printed several of these vent covers for the 1" vent holes in your enclosure. They're resized from this model. You should be able to glue them in place. I've reinforced similar things by applying hot glue around them on the interior of the enclosure.

[bcook608]

I 3D printed several of these vent covers for the 1" vent holes in your enclosure. They're resized from this model. You should be able to glue them in place. I've reinforced similar things by applying hot glue around them on the interior of the enclosure.


Vent 01.jpgVent 02.jpg

Those are perfect!