My shotgun condenser

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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby Twisted Brick » Sun May 27, 2018 11:09 am

solartje wrote: A condenser is already a pita to solder, imagine acing it and then destroying it when soldering the ferrules.


There's a number of ways to solder a shotgun successfully. After much indecision, I decided to go with Jimbo's recommendation, and soldered the vapor tubes and ferrules all in one go. It was easy-peasy, and sealed up solidly. I would imagine copper ferrules would make it even easier.
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Tue May 29, 2018 12:13 pm

Do you have a link to jimbo's explenation?
I was planning on soldering it in steps like a member pm'ed me a step to step guide.
Innertubes to plates, then endplates to shell with wet rags in the innertubes, then water in/outles with rag around endplates, then fill the condenser with water and solder the ferrule/bellreducer.
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby Twisted Brick » Tue May 29, 2018 3:35 pm

solartje wrote:Do you have a link to jimbo's explenation?
I was planning on soldering it in steps like a member pm'ed me a step to step guide.
Innertubes to plates, then endplates to shell with wet rags in the innertubes, then water in/outles with rag around endplates, then fill the condenser with water and solder the ferrule/bellreducer.



Oops! My bad! Its been awhile, but now that I think back, it was Miles, not Jimbo whose recommendation I followed. I couldn't find it, but will keep an eye out for it.
“Always carry a flagon of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore, always carry a small snake.”

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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Wed May 30, 2018 8:26 am

Didn't find it either.
Today i had some time to work on my extra baffles.
So i cut my 2"pipe, opened it, flattened, cut, glued, predrilled, drilled, stepdrilled, filed, cleaned, cut, and when i was ready to assemble... I found out i just made the 7 hole pattern. Wrong pattern :evil: :crazy: :clap:

Now i have the option of using 7tubes or 6 tubes.
Easy solder or more power.
I'l thinking of using the 7 holes for the pc
Go big or go home.

I did find a nice thick exotic wood slab i'll be using for the parrot. It's a bit longer then i wanted but i'm thinking if what i could do with the extra space.. Install a condenser support? a litte writing chalkboard to write abv down, ... Any idea's?
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The wood slab. Ready to Countersinck the mason jar
IMG_20180530_183346.jpg
Oops wrong template loool
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Mon Jun 04, 2018 1:19 pm

Finally got my 1" /28mm pipe to finish the parrot.
And my 2" pieces and ferrules are on there way.
So i'll probably make the parrot first to get some extra soldering time under my belt, use the wet rag technique and then move to the condenser and the rest of the pot still.

Exited !


Edit : it all arived. Copper porn !! Damn those copper ferules are a beauty !


I tested the ferrules, they are 51mm od, and they fit perfect on the 54x1,5 tube but on my unknown 53x1,0 they are like 1/10th of a mm to small. So hammertime after some time in thz fridge. The fit is so tight i won't even have to solder them !!! Wich will make the condenser ALOT easyer. Solder innerpiece and hammer the ferrules in. Sudenly the job is gettibg easyer.

I'm even thinking of buying ss ferrules and see if it's the same tight fit. Saves me some copper ferules i could use for later builds.
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Thu Jun 07, 2018 9:11 am

More progress done today.
6 morr baffles, shell cut and water inlets sanded to match the shell.
Dry fitted all the parts to see how off i am and it all fits easy. Stacking all the baffles was the trick. Without stacking it wouldn't line up no matter how much precautions and steps i used.


Last thing to do, turn the baffles to 2" circles

Question. It's such a shame to not see the end of the pc. I would love to use a glass bell reducer. Anyone tried it? As it's at the end i shouldn't be concerned about leakage.
I got a very tall shampagne glass that would fit perfect in the 2" tube as a reducer to the parrot.
Any tips on how to get it done?
My 2c: wrap glass in teflon tape and insert in tube and tadaaa... Kiss? ;-)
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby Twisted Brick » Thu Jun 07, 2018 11:50 am

Love the ferrules, Solartje, true copper porn.

Your baffle array is a thing of beauty. Some say baffles on a hobby scale are totally overkill, but for me they were worth every minute/dollar simply for the build satisfaction. Your shotty is going to be beast.
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Thu Jun 07, 2018 12:25 pm

Thanks alot !

Yeah i could go for a simple liebigh as i'm only going to use 3600w for stripping, so it's way overkill, but the pleasure of building this shotty is priceless.

I started this hobby because I love to learn new manual skills, learn the theory behind it and challenge myself and search my limit. I thought this would be my limit after the first fails but now , and thanks to this form, i believe i can actually make a shotty. Not there yet though :-) i've got nightmares about leaks. Only one way to find out.


I've got a jig ready to spin my baffles on.
Gonna precut and fine sand them on a drill this weekend.
Kept my 6 holes baffles to make a 2" shotty rc in case i want some neutral.
Ps i found my next project ;-) transforming a 10L close in kitchen boiler into a thumper with a seperate in and out tube. Full copper porn !
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Mon Jun 11, 2018 12:56 pm

Progress on the baffles.
I cut them with a scisor,
Then by hand i filed them so they almost fit.
Then on a drill for the finetuning.
Worked like a sharm.

Tomorow i'll do the endplates.
They need to be extra precise.
If they dont touch the shell enough the heat will not spread well and soldering might be hard.
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby Twisted Brick » Mon Jun 11, 2018 5:59 pm

solartje wrote:
Tomorow i'll do the endplates.
They need to be extra precise.
If they dont touch the shell enough the heat will not spread well and soldering might be hard.


Looking good, Solartje!

Just a suggestion: jig up your tubeset square (plumb?) before you solder your baffles in place. That will ensure the input end of your vapor tubes match up exactly to their endplate. It also makes fine tuning the fit of your baffles inside the shell easy-peasy, lemon-squeezy.
“Always carry a flagon of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore, always carry a small snake.”

- W.C. Fields
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Tue Jun 12, 2018 3:01 am

I'm not sure i understand your tip.

I'm leaving the inside end tubed stick out a bit 2-3mm and sand it all down after soldering so there is no edge for pooling. I'm soldering both endplates from the inside.



Edit: i f'ed up with the baffles. I drilled and stacked them in two times when i made them, so 6 + 6. Each 6 fit perfect but they don't fit up with other 6. As long as i did AAAAAABBBBBB they dry fitted perfect with one dificult baffle in between. I messed up by cutting the 35% off the wrong way. All 6xA have high cut and all 6xB low cut, but as i need alternation i need to do A+B+A+B and its a pita.
I drilled every hole 0,5mm bigger and made it work but so much time having them line up perfect for nothing to have now 0,5mm openings. ° sight°.


Ah well, all part of the learning curve and they are just baffles... As long as the endplates are perfect.

I did find an idea for my bell reducer. Instead of trying to connect glass reducer to the copper rc it's easyer to put glass on my parrot. So i tried different glasses but none work but i do have this little 20cl rhum bottle that turned upside down would fit snug !! Need to cut top and bottem and it would make a nice transparent funnel to go over the barrels of the rc who would stick out of the shell so the work can be apreciated.
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The idea for the glass bell reducer.
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:17 am

i F'ed up again. One of those days... Just gonna call it a wrap and continue next time.

The hard part went perfect but I broke the bottle neck with testing a shortcut. There is enough neck left to check if it fits and its 1mm to large for my 1"-1/2" reducer of my parrot. So gona swap the reducer fitting to a reducer coupler and wrap 0,5mm of teflon around the bottle neck to make it fit.
The outside of the rumbotle is 2" and the thin side 1".
It's a sign !! I think the idea will work.
Got one last bottle left. Hope it works
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby Twisted Brick » Tue Jun 12, 2018 2:54 pm

As long as you're going to sand your input-end vapor tubes flush with the end plate then disregard my suggestion. You got this.

The glass, maybe not the best idea. I think its better that it broke now than jeopardizing all your hard work by shattering in your distillate during a run.
“Always carry a flagon of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore, always carry a small snake.”

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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Tue Jun 12, 2018 11:27 pm

The glass is 1/2" thick and very strong. I really want the tubes visible. :oops: I could just use a big copper funnel.

I know still + glass is not a good combo, but it's not on the vapor side, its not thin blown glass but 1/2" thick and if it brakes in my parrot, i got 200ml spoiled. I can live with that right?

I broke it not by handling it.
I heated it with my soldering gun instead of hot water as it is very thick glass :roll: the shock was to big when put in ice water. The whole top exploded instead of just the cut 'Duu'uuh' :twisted:

I tried the second bottle, cut went perfect with just hot watter, some ptfe around the neck and it's a perfect fit in a 1" coupler. Doesn't move sideways, doesn't fall of when parrot turned around I even banged the sides against a table a couple of times and nothing. This is very thick strong glass. I'm gonna use it. So, i'm gonna cut my shell 2" shorter so the tubes stick out 2"

I'm thinking about the soldering and ferrules. I'm afraid that if i hammer the ferrule in place After soldering i might make lealks between the shell and endplates when enlarging the shell.
maybe better to hammer the ferrule first and then insert the tubes and solder the endplates :thumbdown:
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:34 am

I soldered all the bafles and endplates
cut the hole for the water inlet, shaped the brass water fittings and cut them shorter and hammered the copper ferrule into the shell. Didn't even need to aneal and didn't had to hit it hard. It's super strong.

Soldered the parrot and tested the glass reducer.
Works perfect with some ptfe tape around the bottle neck. Soldered a endplate inside the maintube instead of a endcap right under the inlet to avoid pooling. Waiting for the hydro's to cut as short as possible. Drilled a 1" hole in the woodslate and just put the tube in. Cut a 3" hole 1" deep in the slate to put the jars in so they are more stable.

Last part. Solder the endplates to the tube. Gonna cut a solder ring and put it around the endplates, fill tubes with wet rags and aply heat to the shell. I give myself 75% chance i got leaks, but hope i can fix them.
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:49 am

I also found this on a local site.
He's asking 25€ for one. Think they could be usefull for a new riser with a ball . the cone could be used as a reducer
Worth it?
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Wed Jun 20, 2018 11:06 am

All soldered up.
I did a crapjob. I'm sure the first baffle space is filled with solder as the endplates gap let alot of solder fall behind the endplates.
I had one big leak on the outlet side but as i made a small ridge i just filled it up with solder and it's solved.
I still have one pinpoint leak (1drop every 10minutes) i need to solve and it's done.

I did a crap job on the brass fitings. It worked before but wasn't working now. After 3 tries i got them ok. No solder 360° around but enough to be strong and not leak. I manually tried to pull it off and it stays on but i'm sure if i hit it with a hammer it could fall off. Not sure if thats strong enough? Next time i'd use a copper pipe and the brass instead of brass straight on the shell.

I'd love to presure test it but no idea how to do so with hole equipement? Any idea's?

Here some pics.
Attachments
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My crapy soldering job
IMG_20180620_205155.jpg
The mini leak up left
IMG_20180620_205310.jpg
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Wed Jun 20, 2018 12:01 pm

Last pic for today just because i love the copper glass porn :mrgreen:
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby Kareltje » Wed Jun 20, 2018 12:44 pm

The glass part is beautiful! Hope it will last forever.
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Thu Jun 21, 2018 10:15 am

Kareltje wrote:The glass part is beautiful! Hope it will last forever.


And the copper part is ugly? Hahaha :lolno:
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby Kareltje » Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:34 pm

No, of course not! :D I am impressed, but I can just solder a sock on a pipe. :cry:

It reminds me of the eyes of a deepsea fish, that have a transparent dome over them.

solartje wrote:I also found this on a local site.
He's asking 25€ for one. Think they could be usefull for a new riser with a ball . the cone could be used as a reducer
Worth it?

I would like them too. Depends a bit on the thickness.
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Fri Jun 22, 2018 12:29 am

Kareltje wrote:No, of course not! :D I am impressed, but I can just solder a sock on a pipe. :cry:

It reminds me of the eyes of a deepsea fish, that have a transparent dome over them.

solartje wrote:I also found this on a local site.
He's asking 25€ for one. Think they could be usefull for a new riser with a ball . the cone could be used as a reducer
Worth it?

I would like them too. Depends a bit on the thickness.


I checked and the dome is only 4" wide so not much of a use. It looked bigger in the picture
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Fri Jun 22, 2018 10:18 am

Damn i got frustrated with my shotty. :evil:

Wanted to plug te pinhole, and it went from worse to disaster. After 6 tries of plugging, and getting new holes, i decided to angle the shotgun and just poor a shitload of solder in there. As the pipes are flush with the endplates it's the only way i could stack some solder.

Well after 5 more tries as soon as the shell got hot, poof! , all the buildup would dissapear behind the endplate. The fit just wasn't tight enough.

After emptying a can of butane and 25€ more of solder, my brass waterfitting fell of, because i forgot to put a wet rag around it. Resoldered it, better this time.

I have forgotten how many hours of trying, filling with water, pressure testing, failing, emptying, sanding, fluxing, repeating i have done but i know my first baffle has a shitload of solder behind it. Lucky it doesn't influence the waterflow. When i was ready to give up, after all the buildup dissapear behind the endplate, i checked even though if i thought i saw at least 6 holes and tadaaaa no leaks. Go figure! Lucky i'm very stuborn

I think it's ok now. Only way i can pressure test it, is by filling it with water, plug the wateroutlet and blowing in it. If i release my thumb it shoots out several meters in the air so i gues that should be 2-3bar at least. Don't think my litle pump will do more.


Celebrating it with a bigass cuban cigar cuz damn i almost lost it !!

Sanded it with, 120,220,320 and 600 grit. Gonna buy a 90mm pvc tube , fill it with vinegar and salt and let it rest 12h overnight. And then on the pollish wheel.



Next time:
-Dont make the intake endplate flush with the tubes but 2mm deeper so you can easily pool it with solder in case of a leak'
- the only fit in the whole build that needs to be perfect is the space between endplate and shell. The tubes can be expanded to fit perfect in the endplate. The baffles don't need to fit perfect.
- use copper pipe as waterinlet first and then brass. Brass direct on the shell needs so much heat its hard not to desolder the endplates even with wet rags.
- use as much baffles as you can drill in one go. Impossible to make two identical batches. I thought i was very close, well with 9 baffles so close there is no room for error. 1 hole 1/2mm off and its a pita to mount.
- take more care of my shell. It's full of scratches from the bench. Copper is soft !!
Attachments
IMG_20180622_201947.jpg
Cleaned with flour/salt/vinegar paste and sanded, ready to polish.
IMG_20180622_202025.jpg
The end that took me over 15 tries to fix.
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby Twisted Brick » Sat Jun 23, 2018 9:22 am

I am impressed with your patience and resolve, Solartje. I would not have been able to re-approach my shotgun as many times as you have. I am truly fortunate my shotgun was one of the less-fussy parts of my rig to build. Looking forward to seeing how it performs.
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Re: My shotgun condenser

Postby solartje » Sat Jun 23, 2018 2:10 pm

Yes, your endplate jig is epic. You have no idea how hard a shotty is without them, with no pressdrill, no experience whatsoever in metalworking.
Next shotty i'll buy 2 of your plates and save myself a haerthatack :-D

Soldered the 180° today. Went smooth untill one pipe just didn't wanted to go into the 90° bend. Because of the bends, hamering it in was no option. I think the tube wasn't perfect round anymore. Took me 2hours to finaly get it. Tried every trick in the book. At least the soldering looks very well. I can see it come out the other side 360° so i'm pleased. Getting better at soldering. Used too
much solder as usual but i'm in the 'better more solder then more leaks to fix' camp :-D
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