Condenser mod

[Swag]

This is sort of an offshoot of the air condenser I built. This modification provides more surface area as well as turbulence within the vapor path.



This example is only for illustration. It's is a piece of 1/2" pipe with a length of 1/4" tubing soldered through at an angle. The ends of the tubing are shaped into a sort of funnel, so no matter which way the water flows it will draw the water through the tube.
Here is an end view...



With this much material sticking out of the side of the pipe, a larger jacket would be needed. The tubing could also be cut flush with the pipe, but I think that there would be less circulation through the tubes.
Anyway, I thought I would throw it out there. I haven't tested it yet but the concept makes sense to me.

Cheers

[Swag]

The reason behind this mod is to hopefully be able to shorten up a leibig. My current Leibig is about 4' long, which makes the end a little too low for convenient collection, even though I have it running off at a 45 degree angle. I'd like to knock a foot or so off.
With a bunch of little tubes running through the middle of the vapor path, I think it may be possible.

[Danespirit]

Does the 1/4" tube have a shape like a sinuscurve?
It goes through the 1/2" , makes a curve and through it again..and so on..was that the idea?
Or are the 1/4" only "stubs" going through the 1/2" and then a larger pipe around this arrangement? (Liebig with pipes through inner pipe).

[S-Cackalacky]

That sounds like a plausible idea, but I wonder if it would be advisable to use a larger vapor path - maybe 3/4 or so. Just seems that you would be making a restriction in the 1/2" path that could clog.

[Swag]

Does the 1/4" tube have a shape like a sinuscurve?
It goes through the 1/2" , makes a curve and through it again..and so on..was that the idea?
Or are the 1/4" only "stubs" going through the 1/2" and then a larger pipe around this arrangement? (Liebig with pipes through inner pipe).

Yes, this would have a larger pipe around it. The tubes go straight through. The tricky part is making the holes oblong so you have a tight fit with the tube at an angle. I think I have that figured out now.

[Kegg_jam]

Had to look at this a couple of times to get the idea. Cool concept . Maybe you'd only need a few of those little diverter's to accomplish your goal.

[Swag]

That sounds like a plausible idea, but I wonder if it would be advisable to use a larger vapor path - maybe 3/4 or so. Just seems that you would be making a restriction in the 1/2" path that could clog.

I agree, and I've started building one with a 3/4" pipe and 3/8" tubes running through it. The outer jacket is going to be 1.5". The whole thing will be less than 2 feet long. I haven't calculated the total surface area yet, but I'll try and stick at least 15 tubes in. The thing I worry about is leaks. I'll have to test it under pressure before I solder it in.

[humbledore]

OK so this is all internal to the outside sleeve, catching flow and sending it through the smaller pipe into the vapor path? Pretty good thinking. Interested to hear how it turns out.

[still_stirrin]

I hope you don't get a puke. Those cross tubes will make it a MF to clean the gunk out if you do.

You know, there's several ways to improve efficiency of a Liebig condenser....external spiral wrap, internal turbulator and even cross crimping of the inner tube. But heck, you're into experimentation so have at it.

Oh, and a shotgun product condenser is shorter because of the multiple tubes increasing the conduction surface area with the cooling water, making it much more efficient too. But hey, you like to travel down the untrodden path.

Cheers.
ss

[Swag]

I got this soldered up today (Okay, I'm not a plumber). Fifteen 3/8" tubes through a 3/4" pipe. Plenty of turbulence through this baby. In fact, I can't see any light through it from one end to the next, but I can blow through it fairly easily.



I'm waiting on some end fittings to show up in the mail. I'm tired of a string of fittings to get from one size pipe to the next, so I ordered two tees to fit all three pipe sizes (1.5, 3/4, 1/2). Much cleaner, cheaper and shorter.

I hope you don't get a puke. Those cross tubes will make it a MF to clean the gunk out if you do.

You know, there's several ways to improve efficiency of a Liebig condenser....external spiral wrap, internal turbulator and even cross crimping of the inner tube. But heck, you're into experimentation so have at it.

Oh, and a shotgun product condenser is shorter because of the multiple tubes increasing the conduction surface area with the cooling water, making it much more efficient too. But hey, you like to travel down the untrodden path.

One of the reasons I made this is because a shotgun is beyond most folks fabrication skills. Anyone with a drill and a little patience can build this contraption, or a variation to suit.
I was really just trying to think of a shorter, relatively simple design to fit my stillin area. This looks like it may fit the bill.

Cheers,

[Kegg_jam]

Hey, if it doesn't work out you can always turn it into a Christmas tree stand or something.

[Brutal]

I was really just trying to think of a shorter, relatively simple design to fit my stillin area. This looks like it may fit the bill.

Cheers,

Man you work a whole lot faster than me! I have a shorter condenser design I want to try too but I haven't even ordered the fittings lol. I was going to start a thread but I can't describe it effectively with text.. or words..

I bet this design works. Keep us updated.

[Swag]

The jacket is 15", so as soon as I get the end fittings I'll be able to estimate an overall length. These are the only bits I have so far:

[Swag]

Got the fittings in the mail today so I decided to solder it up. I tested the inner tube for leaks before I did and it was dry. The condenser itself, without the fittings on the end is 21". I think I could have made it shorter, but I fit it to the piece of 1.5" scrap I had.
I'll finish it up with the water fittings after work tomorrow.
(The goofy color is due to the lighting)



If this works good, I may make a reflux condenser with a 1" inner pipe and a 2" jacket. I may even try making a jacket out of ABS or PVC, since copper is so bloody expensive!

Cheers,

[Swag]

Finished building it today. I hooked it up to the still and it came out well. It's short enough so the end doesn't go past my parrot beak anymore.



I'll have to test it this weekend because I know Still Stirrin is dying to see how much vapor it can knock down. I need to clean out the still anyway since I've done a lot of soldering on it lately (as you can see above the condenser). What do you guys use to remove old burnt flux on the inside of the still?

Here's the water input:




Cheers,

[still_stirrin]

Finished building it today...What do you guys use to remove old burnt flux on the inside of the still? ...

Steam (water run), then vinegar + water run, then sacrificial alcohol wash....doh!

....I know Still Stirrin is dying to see how much vapor it can knock down....

Flattery will get you anything!
ss

[Jimbo]

Thats a trick ass condenser swag!

[Danespirit]

Swag..that is looking very pro,man..
I hope it will work as good as it looks..really nice "thinking outside the box"..
Should be nominated as "Condenser build of the year.."

[Hound Dog]

Nice job Swag.

[Swag]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the kind words.
OK, I ran it for a couple of hours today cleaning out the still with a vinegar wash. I capped off the reflux port and ran it full tilt through the new condenser. The condenser easily knocked down all the vapor! The product output was a stone cold continuous stream.





I didn't measure the rate of cooling water required. I adjusted it until the flow was warm and left it there.
Here is the output flow.



My propane burner:



This condenser works great. It's easy to build, much more efficient than a standard Leibig and a lot shorter. I think it's a perfectly good alternative to a shotgun.
I know this particular unit could handle considerably more vapor than I was generating through my rig. If it were sized up to a 2" jacket and a 1" inner pipe it could handle twice as much vapor. Certainly enough for any hobby rig.

Cheers,

[Swag]

I started working on a reflux version of this concept. I modified the first air condenser I built as a beginning.



I drilled 5 through holes to accommodate 5 more 1/2" tubes at right angles to the original ones. These are straight across because that is how the water is going to flow.
This column is going to be standing inside a 3" ABS jacket. The input water will flow from the bottom of the jacket to the top, where an exit port will drain it off, just like in a parrot beak. The top will be open.
Here it is soldered up:



Here's a little construction tip for anyone new to this stuff. There is a really easy way to draw a straight line on a tube parallel to the length. Just use a piece of angle iron placed on the tube and trace down the edge. Like this:



Cheers,

[skow69]

You still want the cooling water run from top to bottom.

[lampshade]

Is there a way to increase the water flow through those tubes? I'm thinking that the law of the path of least resistance would have most of the cooling water pass by the tubes without entering into the tubes.

Maybe, instead of having several cross-flow tubes, you just provide two that have ample cooling water flow, much like the early CM designs had in their 2" column. The plumbing for this arrangement might be atrocious.

[Hound Dog]

Just asking Swag, why didn't you extend the tubes out a bit and cut them at an angle like in your single sample piece? It would seem that since these are straight across, it would increase flow through the tubes like Lampshade asked and create turbulence.

Hey, not to beat a dead horse or anything, this going to have a vent in the top?

[lampshade]

It seems to me that increased (1) cooling and (2) vapor turbulence could be accomplished by one (or two) cross-flow tube at the top of the liebig (just before the cooling jacket) and with minimal plumbing.

[shadylane]

Nice looking still, But when the valve is closed for full reflux, lose of reflux cooling water or an increase in heat will turn it into a bomb. Also during normal operation the still will smear. You could convert it into a CM by getting rid of the valve and lowering the RC

[Swag]

I originally planned to put 2 vertical baffles between the jacket and the column which would separate the input and output halves of the water chamber. This would force water through the pipes. But then I was curious to see if it would work without the baffles. There's a lot of surface area on the 1.5" pipe alone. I'll have 21 sq in of surface area on the 1.5" column and 15 sq in on the 1/2" tubes. There will also be convection flow through the tubes as the water heats up. I'll try it both way to see if there is a big difference
I also gave some thought to water entering from the bottom rather than the top. I think the 3" jacket is large enough so there will be an amount of mixing between cold and warm water before entering the tubes. This will create a more even temperature gradient from bottom to top. I'm not entirely convinced it makes much of a difference anyway.

[HookLine]

Always good to somebody thinking outside the box.

[Swag]

Nice looking still, But when the valve is closed for full reflux, lose of reflux cooling water or an increase in heat will turn it into a bomb. Also during normal operation the still will smear. You could convert it into a CM by getting rid of the valve and lowering the RC

It just wouldn't be the same here without at least one bomb threat post.
I already have a RC which I can lower to act as a CM, but I want to see how this works. I'm also going to put a vent on the top of the column, just haven't got there yet.

Cheers,

[Hound Dog]

Always good to somebody thinking outside the box.

Swag conforms to no box!

It just wouldn't be the same here without at least one bomb threat post.
Cheers,