Copperhead road wrote:Thanks Cranky, that’s pretty much my thoughts exactly.......
(but I want to run that past a very experienced brandy Distiller such as yourself)
Your welcome
Copperhead road wrote:I have an all copper 4” CCSC 5 plate modular flute with all the bells n whistles, extended Lynne arm blar blar blar..... but I can never seem to get the same flavours from fresh fruit pulp washes as I can with my trusty old plain Jane potstill, period.
Like I said the really hard core flute people hate my opinions, so much so I have stopped posting on most flute related threads. One thing I can say about it is that a while back I sent MCH some samples and went ahead and sent a bottle of "Unicorn Sweat" that was a grain based wash that I felt had come off the flute with plenty of flavor but MCH asked me if it was an oaked neutral because to him it was quite light on flavor. I think this is because he has largely mastered the pot still. Even running the flute with no reflux strips flavor due to passive reflux so I just feel it just makes a better final product to run fruit through a pot still.
CatCrap wrote:Cranky, the guys who try to use fruit as an adjunct and a ton of sugar... two thoughts on that...
1st, there probably are just a few VERY strong flavored fruits that would be effective in that method. And perhaps they think that fruit can be used like adjuncts in other recipes, like with grains or rums etc. Like how a pretty small amount of molasses can have a big impact in rum flavor. Or a small portion of smoked malt can affect a mash bill. OR how about the Honey Bear Bourbon Recipe? I haven't tried it myself yet, but i'm always surprised by that one, because it seems like the HOney malt is used in such a tiny proportion of the grain bill, how can it have such a big impact on flavor? But, no one seems to complain about that recipe. So i guess my point is just that some folks perhaps are making the mistaken assumption that light flavored fruits, like apple or pear, will have a very intense effect on their spirit. Sorry i can't seem to think of any better examples, fruit or otherwise, of adjuncts/fermentables that a small portion of the total fermentables will have a big big impact.
Second, it's a lot of work, and can be a very big expense, to do an all fruit or almost all fruit brandy. Many fruits take a lot of processing and can be prohibitively expensive. Like for example how we discussed a Raspberry Eau or Brandy, and that it would take hundreds of pounds or hundreds of dollars worth (if bought) of Raspberries to get enough to do even a small size ferment. And, hey even if you did 2 5 G ferments then a spirit run, or a 1.5X... you're not going to yield much spirit.
I think we on HD correctly try to push newer folks to get over the very-small still/ferment size. Makes your work more efficient and cuts much much more manageable. No offense to big bob... but, when i see folks going into this with a 5 Liter still.. i almost see it as a waste of time, or that they would have more success and enjoy the hobby more, and have an easier time learning, if they just try to get to a certain minimum size of equipment. I think there's just a threshold to hit to make all things work out better.
For me, i have an 8 gallon kettle. That means 6-7 MAX fill. So, my 25Liter fermenters are just about the perfect size for a run, when you account for what is lost to trub, or to grains or fruit pulp. So, when these guys are talking about getting into fruit, they're sort of trying to make it worth their time, in a way. Like how when someone is just learning about All Grain, and they're told by some of the AG gurus here, that an AG in the 5-8% PA range is just right.. don't push for more. So, a lot of people getting into this have been misinformed by Turbo yeasts and chasing ridiculous high ABV washes. I'm trying to remember the exact post the other day i read.. but the New member here (it was a very old post) said "So, i'm working on my neutral wash and it will ONLY(emphasis mine) be a 15% Abv wash."
I thought... ONLY!? LOL...
Anyways, hope ya get my drift.. that while it is reasonable to try to do things in an efficient way to maximize your resources and equipment, and make it worth your time and effort, it is a fine line to be crossed. To always keep in mind our number one goal here on hd is (besides safety!) Quality OVER Quantity. And that's where the sugar fruit conundrum comes into play. FWIW, in my limited experience, i think it can be ok on strong flavored fruits to boost ABV with a small percentage of sugar. And it sounds like on APple, pear, or other light flavored fruit, if at all possible, go for only natural fruit sugar, but if you absolutely must, a small percentage of the fermentable sugar can be table sugar. But if the majority by far is NOT coming from the fruit, well don't even bother. Just make neutral or macerate, or save your fruit until you have enough, or make smaller batches. This is basically how i have understood what Cranky has said about this topic, many times. Again, as far as i have understood it. At least that is how i have interpreted your posts Cranky. Don't want to be putting words in your mouth, no offense intended. That it isn't a travesty or tragedy to boost your abv with sugar.. but make sure that A it is only a boost, and B you really must use sugar. Better to stick to 100% fruity goodness whenever possible.
That pretty much sums it up.
CatCrap wrote:So, i want to do a cherry brandy. I have access to Dried cherries at a very very reduced rate. They're normally 7.50/#, i can get for much less. But, like i said they are dried cherries. They are quite sweet, so i think a ferment using only their natural sugar is feasible. But, the fact they are dry, i believe would require an extra step or steps to the ferment. Like to rehydrate them basically. I could pour boiling H20 on them and let it sit for a day to plump them up and rehydrate.. but i'm just not exactly sure what my method should be. If anyone here has any suggestions, i'd love to hear.. What would be my best strategy for using Dried fruit to make a brandy or Eau? They work really well for maceration... but that is a Vodka-Cherry infusion. Not a brandy. I want the flavor to come from fermented fruit sugar, not to be added later.
Once back when I was making mostly wine, I got my hands on a bunch of dried cranberries. If I recall correctly I ground them with my meat grinder before re-hydrating them, then fermented, then pressed. I think that's probably how I would go about dried cherries, or any other dried fruit.