modified mini still

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Tue Feb 28, 2006 9:50 am

as the ministill is probalby the cheapest reflux still to build, I'm considering to make one.
but i never get how to make one, no mater how long i look at the pictures.
I changed it so I'll be albe to make it without a problem.
I made an autocad draft: modified ministill
comments?, what's the best place for a thermometer?

I hope you notice the coil is missing, that's for the future.
(I think it's even impossible to do it in autocad??)

and if it'n not clear, please ask

TEC · Post by **TEC** » Tue Feb 28, 2006 10:16 am

I just cut two angled slots a little over halfway through the column (use two hacksaw blades and the width of the cut is perfect). Then I cut about a 1.5" piece of the 2" column, cut a slot on one side and hammered it into a flat plate. This piece was then cut into two pieces and used for the angled plates. After some final trimming and polish, you have to look really close to even see where the plates are in the column (just a very thin solder line). Add your takeoff tubing and needle valve and you are done.

I can't see a cheaper or simpler way to build it and it works great

Also I made the head removable so it is easier to get to the packing.

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Tue Feb 28, 2006 11:51 am

mine will be removable too, the coil as wel as the head,
with a copper piece fixed to the column with telfon inbetween

I think I'm not capable enough to make good cut in the column, though it would be cheaper
I'll see

TEC · Post by **TEC** » Tue Feb 28, 2006 12:41 pm

You know, I thought the same thing, but just start the cut straight into the column until there is enough edge to keep the hacksaw from sliping and then change to the angle you want.

You can also cut a couple of 2x4 blocks of wood at the angle you want, clamp them on each side of the column and use them as a guide.

decoy · Post by **decoy** » Tue Feb 28, 2006 4:13 pm

Regardles it looks likeit will work fine.

Bokakobs still may be one piece and you dont need aditional fittings but ..

One thing your design has over the mini still is your reflux tube will trickle the alcohol into the center of the column were the mini still is more likly to run down the wall and it only needs one joiner or reducer ...

and if you can replace the outer tube with a glass tube of some sort, maybe a mesuring cylynder with the base cut out of it you will be able to see inside were the coil is and how much liquid is building up ..

your own idea is always the better one as long as it works ..

decoy · Post by **decoy** » Tue Feb 28, 2006 4:34 pm

you should always place your thermometer were it enters the condensor.

in your case ither near were you reflux drip is or were you have the holes in the center of the light blue tube.

TEC · Post by **TEC** » Tue Feb 28, 2006 5:00 pm

Stoker Wrote:

as the ministill is probalby the cheapest reflux still to build, I'm considering to make one.

Decoy,

Where does glass fit into this!

rectifier · Post by **rectifier** » Tue Feb 28, 2006 5:41 pm

I think decoy just likes to make shiny things out of glass

possum · Post by **possum** » Tue Feb 28, 2006 8:49 pm

I like that too, I was pricing pyrex tubing for a collumn. Imagine seeing the whole action with x-ray eyes.

possum · Post by **possum** » Tue Feb 28, 2006 8:56 pm

However, glass can be increadibly difficult to work with.
When I used to blow hot glass, the stuff had to go into a cool down oven called an anealer, and almost without exception, 1 piece in three would not survive the anealer.

I would love to have a glass view port in my copper boiler, but I'm affraid to cut the boiler up when it works so well.

I still belive a three piece (1.5meter total) glass collumn would be way cool.

Not practical for me at the moment.

stillman · Post by **stillman** » Tue Feb 28, 2006 9:33 pm

Hi possum,

I worked hot glass as a helper for 3 years(Not pyrex). All handblown artglass kind of stuff. We used a computer controlled anealer with good results. This equipement is expensive and I have no ambitions for starting my own glass-shop. I still like to play with hot glass from time to time.

From what I have read and seen, Pyrex is a hell of a lot easier to work. Not much annealing neccessary. I you heat it with a torch, shape it and then let it cool in between two Ceramic Wool blankets it should be OK. Neon glass is worked similarly.

Of course this takes practice and to work with glass you have to screw up a lot of glass to get your hand at it. If anyone is willing to try it just be real careful not to burn yourself with the glass. It will take a long time to heal and give you a wicked scar.

For your boiler viewport you could use the same glass as used for fireplace doors. I don't know what the seal would be though.

Cheers

possum · Post by **possum** » Tue Feb 28, 2006 9:52 pm

I think a piece of quartz sandwiched between copper plates(bezil?) would work.

For the collumn(glass) I think it could be done with little or no shaping of the tubes except for a hole for a vapor management type still. Copper fittings could be used to connect the fittings.

I love working glass, but a hot shop runs into sooo much money.
There is a local fellow who makes stuff for smokers out of glass, and his shop dosen't need a furnace, he uses a torch and a small anealer cabinate.
My experience with pyrex is limited to the little I did in chemestry class with a bunsen burner.

You ain't lying about the hot glass burns, they heal real slow.

Stoker; good luck with the collumn(mini-still).Did you learn to use CAD in school, or on your own ?

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Wed Mar 01, 2006 1:24 am

both, the basics are thought in school (and still are , that's what happens if you'r so old as I am)
and as a still isn't basic,...

does anyone know how to make a coil in CAD ??

who's interested in the volo view of my draft, or the real draft ?

and can anyone explain where to put the glass tube? I'm interested
I've (too?) narrow glass tubes, and i would fit it with teflon. just like it's done for my thermometer (see pictures below)

One thing your design has over the mini still is your reflux tube will trickle the alcohol into the center of the column were the mini still is more likly to run down the wall and it only needs one joiner or reducer ...

I'll even be able to remove or replace the head, 'cause I wont solder the fitting to the column, only to the head. I'll make the seal with teflon.
the coil will also be removable (no teflon, pressure issue)
it will be perfect to put in the dishwasher
the rest what's left will be the column, which is a 42 mm tube,
I realy like it.

I'll propably buy a tube. they are so expensive!!,copper: 5m, 42mm = €95 , then you just have a tube.

decoy · Post by **decoy** » Wed Mar 01, 2006 1:52 am

if its shiny its gota bee good...

you picked me, i just got a price on a length of 3" pyrex tube

1.5m length tubex75mmdiax3.2mm wall $126.00/1.5m length

the section i was talking about was at thye top for the reflux coil.

decoy · Post by **decoy** » Wed Mar 01, 2006 2:50 am

I will ask one of my customers who do drafting.

but most drafting programs that i have used like solidworks Rhinoceros3d lightwave etc.. you firs draw a spiral line or curve and then place a disc at start of the line, then extrude along curve..

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Wed Mar 01, 2006 5:06 am

I've never met the possibility to draw a spiral line in CAD

edit:that expensive tube I was talking about was a copper one

Edit: : now i have (met...) right now I'm able to draw a spiral line, but I've trouble with making a coil of it. the extrude function doesn't work with the spiral line.
picture of the first trial

stoker

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Thu Mar 02, 2006 2:42 am

I got my pipes and connetion pieces

would it be bad to let the reflux pipe out? (the purple one)
then the reflux would flow back in the light blue/green tube, the one with the 4 drilled holes.

+: less work, easier to build, a bit easier to clean, lower cost, less possible problems while building.
-: the reflux might not drop in the center of the column, the amount of condensed spirit in the reservoir will be larger.
any other pro/contra s

in what kind of shops can I find copper scubbers?

jbrew9999 · Post by **jbrew9999** » Thu Mar 02, 2006 6:09 am

I think an "overflow reflux" setup like you described is a great idea. You will want to extend the overflow pipe (the one with the holes in it) down all the way through the reducer though so that the overflow is FORCED to drip instead of cling to the side and run down the edge. You may have to modify your reducer to allow a pipe to go all the way through it (Or you could just make your reducer out of a cap that you drill a hole big enough to slip your vapor pipe through. As long as you are absolutely certain that the reflux will drip into the packing and not "channel" down the sides, it will work great.

The EL head really is simple to make though and it works great. I think it would be easier and cheaper to make then your design.

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Thu Mar 02, 2006 6:44 am

ok, good idea
I'll use a file to remove the edge of the fitting

The EL head really is simple to make though and it works great. I think it would be easier and cheaper to make then your design.

I can make a normal one and a modified one

, because I had to buy a 5m tube,good for 3 or 4 columns+condensers

decoy · Post by **decoy** » Thu Mar 02, 2006 1:39 pm

i will be visitng my customer that uses cad today ill ask em how to do a spiral ...

stillman · Post by **stillman** » Thu Mar 02, 2006 9:13 pm

I tried spirals on Cad before with no luck. Just looked in the help section and spirals isn't in there.

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 1:51 am

what would be the best place to put my thermometer?
I have options:
- below the coupling
- above the condensed spirit
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level Joe · Post by **level Joe** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 6:46 pm

If you run the reflux return tube farther down, maybe to the lower edge of what looks to be a reducer. I'ld put it through the widest part of the reducer midway up.

Thorin · Post by **Thorin** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 10:29 pm

your condenser should be the other way, i think...
(cold water where you have warm and vice versa)

else than that: you dont really need valve on your reflux tube in the design, cuz u adjust it with the output valve

^^dont bother with that, i thought the thermometer was a valve

^^

anything else?.... the design looks damn cool....

Thorin...

maximk · Post by **maximk** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 11:47 pm

125 for 1.5 meters of pyrex isnt' so bad, considering what i just paid for 1.2 meters of copper. I'm suprised no one has tried this yet. It would be a god amongst stills. I'm sure for an extra 25 they would even add a connector a foot or so down for a liebig.

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Tue Mar 28, 2006 12:55 am

I want to make the condensing and collection unit removable, so a thermometer put where you have put it would not be possible.
I'm almost finished with the still, and it is not exactly what I've drawn. the only thing I need is the valve, a thermometer and an extra pressure hole on top of the still
I'll post some pictures this evening.

edit: i think the water flow is correct, anyone else who would change it? (no big deal, just connecting the other tube)

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Tue Mar 28, 2006 11:48 am

bubble cap

this one should be turned 180°
the bubbel cap inserted the tube on the right is the spirit outlet, a valve still has to be added

a coil is inserted in the other side of the tube
and many others
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Tue Mar 28, 2006 12:29 pm

I don't see the return tube. Did you do away with it or have you just not added it yet?

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Wed Mar 29, 2006 3:37 am

yes, that's one of the modifications.
I modified the main coupling (42-22 mm) a bit, I filed the inside so a 22 mm tube can be put through it. and I push it 2 cm further.
if the level of the condensed spirit rises, it reaches the drilled holes in the 22mm tube and slips down right in the packing, the 22 mm tube has to be pushed deeper so the spirit will drop in the center, and will not stick to the inside of the column.
clear?

soon, I'll make a draft.

(does anyone already has found a solution for the thermometer?)

stoker · Post by **stoker** » Fri Jun 30, 2006 1:48 am

it's finished
I made a mini liebig condenser, the outlet is now +- 20°C, excellent.

every piece is removable
the extra insulation around the head has no purpose
and the extra coil around the head is not used

I ran it pritty fast yesterday and got 88° from a turbo wash (50l)
the temperature didn't really stabelize, it fluctuated bewteen 75 and 79 °C

for extra info, just ask