Is yours really better than commercial?

[MountedGoat]

I ask this not because I doubt it, but because I keep asking myself this question. I mean, commercial distillers have nothing but money at hand (talking large ones, not micro) and make a very consistent drinkable product. I haven't ever tasted another home distiller's product and so really only have mine vs. commercial to go with. To me I am making a very lovely drink and at the same time my lady friend always thinks that it is going to kill her and that it tastes not as good as commercial. Maybe I need to put caramel into it to smooth it out. Maybe I just need to get it to some other people.

Tell me what you think.

[new_moonshiner]

my question would be are YOU happy with it???

[eternalfrost]

I mean, commercial distillers have nothing but money at hand (talking large ones, not micro) and make a very consistent drinkable product.

the main reson it is very possible to make better-then-commercial at home is that you can do it in separate batches. in order for the big boys to put out the thousands of gallons of product each month to supply the entire country they simply cant take the time to do it in batches. this means most of the non-topshelf brands use continuous stills

with a continuous process you cant concentrate the heads and completely remove them like we do at home. they are basically a multi-plate column and the product is taken off someplace in the middle, the heads are removed at a plate at the very top. so you will always have the heads being incorporated into the main product take off as they pass up through that plate.

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i can say without a doubt that my refluxed vodka is far and above much cleaner then even things like grey goose etc i.e. the most expensive brands t my local liquor store

[minime]

i can say without a doubt that my refluxed vodka is far and above much cleaner then even things like grey goose etc i.e. the most expensive brands t my local liquor store

It's not even a close contest and I don't even try to achieve super duper neutral. I run my stills as close to wire as I can and still achieve 95+. Some folks on the forum reflux well beyond this point and achieve ultimately pure neutral. For my palette it's just not required.
I'm not a whiskey drinker but my wife loves the rum I've been making from Pugi's recipe. I'm not much of a pot stiller so I've been 3X ing on the pot still for heavy rum and running on a detuned column for white rum. I also use the column to remove heads even when I'm pot stilling because my wife hates any drink with heads and I can insure complete removal with the column. My wife has absolutely no interest in going back to the store bought stuff since I've been running this way.

@MountedGoat, Don't know what you're making but consistency takes a while to learn. It's also much easier to achieve consistency with large batches.

[Husker]

Of all things listed, consistency was the only thing where I occasionally fall down with. However, the nice thing about doing this at home, is if you screw it up, just re-distill.

H.

[blanikdog]

Same here, Husker but it doesn't bother me. It's close enough and a little bit of inconsistancy is 'part of the adventure' as somebody in here once said.

blanik

[MountedGoat]

Consistency is difficult I am sure even for the larger guys. The real thing though is that if I am a consumer and drinking one bottle at a time then I am not going to notice a difference really. Also there is going to be no sign of a change of batches on something like smirnoff.

I am running grappa and brandy. If I ran them 2x I am sure that I would get a more neutral flavor, though I am not looking for that. I keep only the hearts for sipping on and I think that they are smooth, the lady friend still doesn't.


I am running using this and the little flying saucer helps keep a TON of the heads and tails harshness out. Not saying it removes it by any stretch of the mind, but they are less harsh. The first time I used this I ran it without the reflux lentil and it was a real potstill, along with all that flavor. Talk about hardcore.

So I am doing a test this time and will rerun my entire set of brandy this year. I want to make it smoother, though at the same time I am somewhat afraid that I will be stripping a little bit too much flavor out of it. Right off the worm when I ran it the first time, as soon as those hearts came out I was a happy camper, tasting every 15min to make sure they stayed delicious. Then ran the tails for a long time down from 140 to 90 proof. I know 140 sounds high, however this is when I started tasting the tails. All in all it doesn't matter as I put all 3 gal collected in the same container to rerun, but really I am keeping the sweetest stuff and still not getting any love from the lady friend.

[punkin]

By all accounts from those who drink it regularly, i can top mid shelf stuff with ease.

I have often been out with Bourbon Girl and her mates, when they have had to buy a Jim Beam or a Johhnie Walker, and heard negative comparisons against the commercial stuff.

Comments like, "I couldn't go back to drinking this all the time", and the end of the night one, " Let's go home and have a real drink" .

I'll take my vodka over any commercial i've tasted including Wyborova, in fact someone dropped off a couplea empty Smirnoff bottles yeserday while we were sitting round out the back and there was a bottle of my 50% on the table. I sent the two bottles round for a sniff test and not one positive comment came back for the commercial.

[junkyard dawg]

my vodka, far from neutral, is also by far the best vodka drink I have had. There is not any commercial swill that is as penalty free as my own. Most commercial drinks give me a headache with only a couple drinks... Mine, not so much. I have to get really bent to have a hangover... I've made only a couple of all grain batches that were clearly superior. Thats a lot of work, but it is possible. A couple of times tho... I've made the best likker out there... awesome flavor, clean and hangover free... The fact that it can be done is what motivates me....well, its fun too....

[I-GOR]

my vodka, far from neutral, is also by far the best vodka drink I have had. There is not any commercial swill that is as penalty free as my own. Most commercial drinks give me a headache with only a couple drinks... Mine, not so much. I have to get really bent to have a hangover... I've made only a couple of all grain batches that were clearly superior. Thats a lot of work, but it is possible. A couple of times tho... I've made the best likker out there... awesome flavor, clean and hangover free... The fact that it can be done is what motivates me....well, its fun too....

I'm not a vodka guy, but the few times I've done it in my pot still I was fairly pleased. In the past year and a half I've learned the tricks ( kudos and thanks to all on this forum) to make a pretty passable product. Whiskey is my pursuit. All grain is a real step up in quality, no bones about it. 2 runs in a pot still on either whiskey or grappa makes and outstanding product, clean & hangover free. It's the hangover free part that makes this dangerous. If someone said it was possible to make the strong stuff & not get hangovers, I wouldn't have believed them. I know from that alone that what I make is better than commercial.

As far as reviews goes, its a mixed bag. A few won't drink it (maybe scared about public heath messages), the wife sometimes good sometimes not, others very enthusiastic. As has been mentioned in other threads, I think a major component to commercial whiskey is undoubtably the oak aging. I can't get the bouquet in a short period of time. My problem is I've never been able to age anything past about 6 weeks, it all seems to evaporate somehow.

[mikejwoodnz]

I make the basics then I fake the classics

[ZAXBYC]

The stuff I make these days is far better.... however the stuff I have made in the past urgh!

My Red Coconut rum was a big hit with the ladies, unfortunately i was ignorant and made some mistakes resulting in some horrid stuff!

I made one excellent pot stilled vodka in the past, and I couldn't work out how I had done it. Then after reading lots and part of my ignorance evapourated I realised - after a party I collected all the semi empty bottles / glasses of wine and ran them, instead of turbo stuff I usually ran.

[carlos castenada]

Hi all,

Its being about two years now since iv'e had any commercian product, i can't remember what it tasts like.
my friends allways compare what i give them to commercian stuff, but i think its impossible to compare the two.
the only reason you compare to commercial product is because its the only comparison normally available.
what makes there so right in the first place?.

I enjoy my sprit and love the personal factor.

Cheers.

[Dutchmancreek]

Every year my buddies at deer camp think my whiskey is better than the Jack D. and the Crown Royal that's on the bar (as do I). My wife and I prefer my product to any commercial booze.

I do have a problem with consistency.....some batches are much better than others and even with my lab notebooks I can't see what I'm doing different. The good part is that the lesser batches are still pretty good (at least for the past couple of years when I learned so much from this forum).

[junkyard dawg]

I think of my stuff like its a homegrown tomato

[tracker0945]

I can get a pretty good neutral but still have trouble flavouring it (more practice needed).
My DWWG, UJSM, PugiRum are at the point where I can confidently offer to guests.
The full grain adventure is just starting now.


Cheers.

[pintoshine]

I hope the best of luck for your all grain experience. I would suggest all malted barley and read "the home brewer's companion" by charlie papazian (AMAZON.COM)for a real good primer on mashing barley. Leave out the hops.

[Usge]

I ask this not because I doubt it, but because I keep asking myself this question. I mean, commercial distillers have nothing but money at hand (talking large ones, not micro) and make a very consistent drinkable product. I haven't ever tasted another home distiller's product and so really only have mine vs. commercial to go with. To me I am making a very lovely drink and at the same time my lady friend always thinks that it is going to kill her and that it tastes not as good as commercial. Maybe I need to put caramel into it to smooth it out. Maybe I just need to get it to some other people.

Tell me what you think.

MG, what proof are you at? My wife doesn't like "anything" thats higher proofs. It all has too much "bite" for her. (doesn't matter what it is).
Another thing you can try...and I know it goes against' conventional wisdom ....but ....run your alembic faster. When I "dripped" off my alembic, it left a harsh drink. Running it with a small stream pulls more water with it, lowers the abv, and it also smoothed my grappa and brandy out quite a bit. Give a try anyway.

[punkin]

I agree Usge, running too slow is as bad as running too fast on a potstill. Will cause harshness as you say...

[Tater]

I agree Usge, running too slow is as bad as running too fast on a potstill. Will cause harshness as you say...

Ive not used that type pot still so cant say about it .Id think it would also depend on the type pot still size of the worm and the operators experience .On pot stills Ive used there is usually only around 5 to 10 proof in the running it slow or running it hard in run.I don't get a harsh taste from running slow but do have to pay close attention on the end of heads and start of tails to be sure I get the flavor I'm after in fruit product

[bourbonbob]

Mine absolutely pisses on commercial stuff.........80 cents per litre (UJSM), excellent quality, no hangovers, what else do you need in life? Well maybe a little bit of pussy, preferably a rich one. lol

[Husker]

Mine absolutely pisses on commercial stuff.........80 cents per litre (UJSM), excellent quality, no hangovers, what else do you need in life? Well maybe a little bit of pussy, preferably a rich one. lol

Heh, cheap quality whiskey, and rich quality pussy. That's the ticket to life, BOOM Baby!!

H.

[big worm]

i to think that i need to run slightly faster than i have been. i know that i make good stuff. commercial drinkers have told me mine is very good. i've made some real shit to....back in and redo.....i love it

[manu de hanoi]

I ask this not because I doubt it, but because I keep asking myself this question. I mean, commercial distillers have nothing but money at hand (talking large ones, not micro) and make a very consistent drinkable product. I haven't ever tasted another home distiller's product and so really only have mine vs. commercial to go with. To me I am making a very lovely drink and at the same time my lady friend always thinks that it is going to kill her and that it tastes not as good as commercial. Maybe I need to put caramel into it to smooth it out. Maybe I just need to get it to some other people.

Tell me what you think.

I made the mistake to ask friends to taste my first experiment. Since then, everyone is convinced that I'm trying to poison them. Moreover the quality of the feedback I received from various pple is bad and hardly help me improve. Marketing and image has so much to do with it that it's hard to get valuable comments.
Until you have the means to make a real market survey, just take the feedback as non relevant statistically. People are often either polite and say it's good or scared and say no way. Vodka is a good start cause there is at least an objective way to judge it : it must be tasteless and chemically pure.

[trthskr4]

Since this question naturally leads to boasting I'll add that I've had a few ppl who never drink start drinking after I've put a sample of my UJSM in front of them. Some of it was cut and diluted the day after distilling and some had been aged for 5-6 months. I've never added anything to it but oak with one exception of an attempt to save a batch that I distilled out most of the flavor on and rather than rerun it with some mash I added pure maple syrup to it.

I've also had a die hard, long time commercial drinker abandon a bottle of Woodford Reserve at a friends house and I do mean left it after trying my UJSM.

I've never had anyone say they wouldn't try it to my recollection. I've also had kin folks who live in moonshine country and grew up drinking it all their lives say that mine is the best they've ever had.

But it's still not good enough for me...I'm always looking to improve and then stay consistent.

I don't think any great artiste ever just picked up a brush and painted a masterpiece on the first go. I could be wrong, but doubt it.

[goinbroke2]

I still get kind of perturbed when people call it "moonshine" even though it is. It's just that I've had "moonshine" and it's basically "throw away the first bit, then save all the rest and mix it together". I've tasted LOTS of moonshine but none that tasted like my moonshine if you know what I mean. When cuts are mentioned or heads/tail/etc I get blank looks from "old moonshiners who've done it for decades".

This is not without precident though, I build drag engines/cars/etc and am always on the net/car mags/where ever, researching the latest, greatest trick. When I started indexing sparkplugs local racers laughed and called me a loon. But my shit was always fast. The roundy round boys started calling and my shit was fast on that track too. It wasn't until much later that indexed plugs and cut down water pump vanes were correlated to quicker rpm and faster times. My motto was "you can't add 100hp, but you can add 1hp in a hundred places"

Ain't the internet and the passage of good info wonderful??


Oh, for the record, yes my shit is WAY better than bought shit.

[junkyard dawg]

Ain't the internet and the passage of good info wonderful??

yes it is. Thanks Uncle Jesse for doing what you do to make that possible.

Oh, for the record, yes my shit is WAY better than bought shit.

doubt you could say that any better...

[xx7777xx]

With Vodkas and Rums I can easily see how a few practiced runs with a known recipe can clearly output a superior product. A few people have mention the quality of their whiskeys, so I'm keen to hear more about people's maturation strategies as that is clearly a factor when making whiskey. How long do you need to have your product sit on oak before you can start getting, or beating the flavor of a commercial product?

[Hack]

How long do you need to have your product sit on oak before you can start getting, or beating the flavor of a commercial product?

About a week. Maybe two.

Taking the time to air it a week or so helps alot too.

[punkin]

It takes me about 6-8 weeks of aging on sticks before i'll be able to cut my ujsm to bottle strength X7. It's much better after 3 months.

All grain takes 2-3 months but 6 is better. Some of the stuff like peach brandy seems to oak much quicker even to the point of being reduced to a small stick after a matter od days or a week.

The longer you leave a whiskey on a minimal oak the better.