What do you do with your cuts?

[Hack]

If I made myself a wine to distill to brandy, would the brandy taste different if the wine had been left for a year to mature before the distillation process? You can pretty much guarantee the wine will taste far better, but will the distillate?

I've been told that the answer is yes. Waiting will make it better.

[violentblue]

I thought I had read somewhere that Cognac had to be distilled within so many days of fermentation. I cant find the source where I thought I'd read it.

[eternalfrost]

According to French Law, in order to bear the name, Cognac must meet strenuous legal requirements, ensuring that the 300-year old production process remains unchanged. It must be made from at least 90% Ugni Blanc, Folle Blanche, or Colombard grapes, although Ugni Blanc, specifically Saint-Emilion grapes, are today virtually the exclusive variety used. The remainder may consist of the grape varieties Folignan, Jurançon blanc, Meslier St-François (also called Blanc Ramé), Sélect, Montils, and Sémillon,[1] [2] It must be distilled twice in copper pot stills and aged at least two years in French oak barrels, most commonly from oak shipped from all over Europe but passing through the town of Limoges and for that reason called 'limousin' oak.[3]

[blind drunk]

Eternal Frost said:

you can also recycle the tails, in a pot still it will concentrate the flavors. the same thing happens as explained with the heads, except this time its good flavor overflowing into the hearts rather then poison. in a reflux still you can save the heads and tails and dump it all back into the next stripping run to recycle it.

I'm doing a pot still run as I write and have been thinking and tasting all of this thread. When you say that by rerunning the heads, foreshots removed, the flavour pushes through into the hearts. So, there is still some hearts in the heads? I guess I'm about to find out by doing it but I know that in the past I did throw out alot of good stuff. Gotta learn somehow.

I do notice incredible taste in the heads but I can't stand that smell, so I've been collecting them and I guess I'll run them again.

Also, the tails have really good flavour in them as well, but they have quite a heat to them. Gotta figure it out. It's really a fine balance.

PS I hardly know what the hell I'm saying.

[muckanic]

I do notice incredible taste in the heads but I can't stand that smell, so I've been collecting them and I guess I'll run them again.

Fruit washes are a bit different to others, in that they can contain low-boiling volatiles which you want to keep. One workaround is to cut the heads out of the first low wines run, macerate some more fruit, then redistill without a heads cut.

[ZAXBYC]

Eternal Frost said:

PS I hardly know what the hell I'm saying.

hehe, is that becuase of your name

But seriously, I don't think you can ever stop learning with this hobby, our problem....or blessing, is that we do little batches at a time, getting something consistant is going to be difficult.

Word of advice....always keeep notes, espically if you are just trying something for a laugh, it might be something you wish to repeat again in the future!

[blind drunk]

Fruit washes are a bit different to others, in that they can contain low-boiling volatiles which you want to keep. One workaround is to cut the heads out of the first low wines run, macerate some more fruit, then redistill without a heads cut.

Good info and a good idea Muckanic. How would macerating with dried fruit work? Thinking of trying that, prunes maybe.

But seriously, I don't think you can ever stop learning with this hobby, our problem....or blessing, is that we do little batches at a time, getting something consistant is going to be difficult.

Agree ZAXBYC, endless learning. Not to concerned with consistency just want something I like to drink and can be proud of sharing.

[muckanic]

How would macerating with dried fruit work? Thinking of trying that, prunes maybe.

The low-boiling volatiles I am referring to tend to be more prevalent in fresh fruit, and it depends upon the fruit. Basically, it can help to treat the wash in roughly the same way you might treat a neutral wash flavoured with spices or herbs. It wouldn't be a great idea to make a low temp cut when employing a gin or absinthe head, but then stranger things have been known to be performed!

[Monster Mash]

Well I just have to throw this in since I haven't seen it mentioned in this thread. Save all of your cuts! Heads and tails (without the foreshots). This stuff is like gold! Lots of flavor in them that will contribute to a favor positive spirit like whiskey and rum. I always run these feints in with my spirit runs because they increase flavor and the center cut yield. Just wait till you have enough feints to run an all feints spirit run. If you haven't done this then you will be amazed with the result. Commercial distilleries often call this a "special reserve" run. Seriously, don't throw away the heads and tails! They are the precous leftovers of future nectar of the gods. MM

[goinbroke2]

Read the whole thread and now I'm trying to remember the original question! LOL!

At first, I threw away the foreshots, then collected in 500ml mason jars until it smelled watery/stinky
Now I throw away the fores, collect in 500ml jars and check ABV and go until 30% or so. (OBVIOUS TAILS)

Then I leave all the jars lined up and covered with clean cloth for a day or two and start smelling/tasting. The amount of runs I've done now I "guess" or average about 2L heads/ 9-12L heart/2L tails. I still smell/taste though to confirm the hearts.

Whatever is heads/tails goes into a feigns carboy and after 3 or more runs I add it to a spirit run. I normally have two 30L pails fermenting which gives me 40L of wash to run. Since the still is a 58L one, I top up to 45L or so with feigns.

One of the best runs I did was a whisky run of 20L of wash with 20L of feigns from whisky and red wine. It was a whitedog with a nice wine aftertaste. kind of a brandy or something I suppose.

[bronzdragon]

At first I used the "collect in half pints" method. Once I got used to how my runs go, I switched to bigger jars because I can pretty much tell where the cuts will be by temp and taste.

And yes, my cuts are different depending on what I'm making. For instance, I make rum and whiskey. I go pretty deep into the tails on the rum because I like that big full flavor on a dark rum. But a few times I've made a white rum and and ran it real clean and didn't go into the tails. My whiskey gets a tiny bit more heads in it and gets cut off a lot sooner as far as tails goes, then the rum.

I think it's all personal taste, as long as you toss the fores, and manage your heads. I always save heads and some tails for inclusion in the next batch also.

My opinion is that the ratio of tails, along with how you age the drink, is your primary method of flavor control. (setting aside any artificial flavors, which I don't usually use.)

cheers

~r~

[Aussie Beamophile]

At first I used the "collect in half pints" method. Once I got used to how my runs go, I switched to bigger jars because I can pretty much tell where the cuts will be by temp and taste.

And yes, my cuts are different depending on what I'm making. For instance, I make rum and whiskey. I go pretty deep into the tails on the rum because I like that big full flavor on a dark rum. But a few times I've made a white rum and and ran it real clean and didn't go into the tails. My whiskey gets a tiny bit more heads in it and gets cut off a lot sooner as far as tails goes, then the rum.

I think it's all personal taste, as long as you toss the fores, and manage your heads. I always save heads and some tails for inclusion in the next batch also.

My opinion is that the ratio of tails, along with how you age the drink, is your primary method of flavor control. (setting aside any artificial flavors, which I don't usually use.)

cheers

~r~

I can't agree more BD.

I have mates with fussy palates when it comes to scotch and bourbon. Everything I made for a while tasted like rum to them. I have progressively made my heads to hearts cut earlier, and my hearts to tails cut earlier, and I am now getting a cleaner tasting spirit that is carrying through to a more authentic tasting final product.

Everything, bar fores, that doesn't makes the final cut get tipped into the next spirit run.

PS: fores are great for cleaning bathroom mirrors and showerscreens!

Cheers

AB

[blind drunk]

One thing I do with my cuts that don't cut it is use them in some of my baking. There's just too much flavor in them heads and home made brandy is alot cheaper than the bought stuff. BTW I'm talking small quantities. Maybe 50ml per batch. The flavor really come through.

[violentblue]

best rum I ever made was collecting the heads and tails form a couple runs then re running them together, only got a little usable spirit from it, but it was the finest tasting rum I've made to date.