Filtering spirits using benchtop water purifier

[BackyardBombay]

Has anyone had experience filtering their neutral spirit using a benchtop water purifier?
My local 'brew shop swears by these Essencia carbon filters (http://www.essencia.com.au/carbonfilter.htm) which after seeing one looks like a water purifier with a big ceramic 'candle' particle filter with carbon filter as well...
So I went look browsing and found these Stefani water purifiers (http://www.stefani.com.au/products.php?id=1) with a ceramic candle and carbon filter cartridge... these units are half the price thanks to a big hardware chain's everyday low prices.

I appreciate some purists will scoff at my question, however there is a bit of 'setup' involved with using other carbon filter tubes, z-filters and the like, and I don't have the luxury of the room.

I'm hoping this idea saves on room by not having to rig up a feeder tank into a tube or z-filter and simplify the whole process....

Any thoughts?

I'd love to hear from someone who's had first hand experience or knows from someone first hand any recommendations.

[junkyard dawg]

I've had best luck just putting quality carbon in a bottle with the spirit. Filtering with white coffee filters is no problem.

[Uncle Jesse]

plastic purifiers...that's all I have to say is that they're plastic purifiers.

[grainhopper]

It's true what they say; you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.

And if they do drink its a plastic cup.

[lawnman]

tell you the honest trueth i dont worry about filtering any more.
i boil my water before i cut it back so ita all pure.
and i oak most of my brew and let it age so by the time it comes to drink its had time to settle.
my brew shop has the essenicia filter too but you have to change the carbon in it evry 2 filters or so.
i was using a britta water filter to filter my brew but at the end of the day never noticed any diff in taste or flav so thats why i havnt bothered any more.when it comes to drink it smells good and taste good so why bother
??????????????

[Grid]

After my first wash goes through i have a water purifier jug http://www.italiankitchenaids.com/produ ... cat=67that" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow i will run it through and see if it takes anything out... will let you know.

Grid.

[BackyardBombay]

Hi folks.

I've now had some experience using my 'brita' water filter jug and it really made no difference at all to the spirit.

I went with my brew shop's recommendation to go for the Essencia filter, which I can now tell you is a re-badged Waterco filter using the Waterco certamic candle and Waterco CZR carbon cartridge. I need to say it looks much like the Waterco clear plastic filter, except the Essencia unit has opaque plastic which makes me think (hope) they're using a alcohol resistant plastic.

It works very well, but does take a very long time to filter spirit. The one I have holds 4 litres and takes roughly 24hrs to filter that much. At least I can say it's thorough!

Using a clear well settled wash in my Essencia reflux still, I get very good results - my first run was 90%, the next 92%. Once filtered, its very clean and near odourless.

Still may not be as good as stainless steel or copper structures using loose carbon - but its a lot less work and suits me just fine.

Cheers!

[theholymackerel]

So sad that all the new folk seem so jazzed on carbon.

A wash/mash made from good materials, no stressed yeast, and understandin' yer still and makin' good "cuts" makes for a good booze that doesn't need carbon.

Basically, if ya need carbon ya screwed up somewhere.

If ya MUST use carbon, use it like Junkyard Dawg suggests. Plastic or rubber and hooch are a big No-No.




I wish yall luck.

[Uncle Jesse]

If you're using plastic at all to filter your high proof spirits then you are making a very big mistake and endangering your health. Period.

How many times do we have to preach against plastic before people will believe us? I'm not sure.

Let us know if you can taste the plasticizers, that's an experiment which would benefit us all.

[zymos]

How many times do we have to preach against plastic before people will believe us? I'm not sure.

.

This is probably not going to be a very popular viewpoint around here, but over the years I've purchased 20-30 plastic 5 gallon cubetainers of 190 proof. This is USP food grade ethanol, and every commercial grain and grape alcohol distillery I've ever seen (all 3 of them, but anyway) sells it in plastic.

I can see how you'd want to avoid plastic in the still itself, where higher temperatures are involved, but look at any chart for chemical resistance for HDPE-see for yourselves.

Some plastics do no doubt dissolve in high proof ethanol, but to just say things like "plastic should never come in contact with ethanol" is just plain ignorant of the facts.

To put this post in perspective, I am someone who would never even drink water out of Nalgene or polycarbonate unless I was dying of thirst...

[Uncle Jesse]

Again, Chemist tests these things for real and he's seen high proof alcohol imported into this country in "approved" containers and sure enough they had plasticizers leached into the spirits.

Take the chance if you want to, but a big part of the purpose of these forums is to keep people safe. As it's been said, this hobby ain't stamp collecting. We can only point you in the safe direction, however. What you do with the knowledge is up to you.

Just today, I have been checking some distillates received from a major rum distiller by GC/MS. They sent it in their half-gallon polycarbonate bottles--at about 70% alcohol. Lo and behold, what do I see: a nice peak for bis(2-ethylhexyl) phthalate...yum...

http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... lasticizer

[zymos]

I already said I don't even trust polycarbonate with WATER.

But plain old HD polyethelene is a totally different material.
Which again, is why the term "plastic" is not very informative...

[Uncle Jesse]

someone grab a data sheet on HD polyethylene? I'm interested. but right now I'm too busy shoveling snow.

[zymos]

here's one
http://pt.rexnord.com/Products/guards/o ... f01feb.pdf

And another

http://k-mac-plastics.com/data%20sheets ... stance.htm


First one says no damage after 30 days constant exposure to absolute EtOH, second just lists it as "satisfactory", which is the highest resistance on that chart.

[CoopsOz]

Just today, I have been checking some distillates received from a major rum distiller by GC/MS. They sent it in their half-gallon polycarbonate bottles--at about 70% alcohol. Lo and behold, what do I see: a nice peak for bis(2-ethylhexyl) phthalate...yum...

I wouldn't say 70% is low.....what are the results at drinking strength?

[Uncle Jesse]

I'd bet the results are different at drinking strength. But then again I just said I trust the FDA to do a thorough, unbiased assessment which in itself makes me cringe.

[zymos]

here's one
http://pt.rexnord.com/Products/guards/o ... f01feb.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

And another

http://k-mac-plastics.com/data%20sheets ... stance.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow


First one says no damage after 30 days constant exposure to absolute EtOH, second just lists it as "satisfactory", which is the highest resistance on that chart.

How come my post above this is empty?
Weird ... ((edit I think I had some bogus html in there when I put those links in?))

Anyway, if you can believe the companies that actually make the stuff, which you might not, but hey, they probably know better than most people, these charts show HDPE as being resistant to EtOH at both high and lower strengths.

Beating a dead horse I guess, and to be honest, I also believe in "better safe than sorry" myself, but I keep seeing this kind of knee jerk reaction around here, and I thought maybe it could use a bit of clarification...

[Uncle Jesse]

according to their specs it should be perfectly safe. I'd like to see a real independent test but you have to figure if they're lying it's a pretty big lawsuit in the works.

[HookLine]

according to their specs it should be perfectly safe. I'd like to see a real independent test but you have to figure if they're lying it's a pretty big lawsuit in the works.

Since when has that ever stopped the profit motive?

[alice]

I went to a couple of liquor distributors/wholesalers yesterday on a mission for some friends. One had Bundy Rum, Jim Beam and two brands of vodka in 20 litre HDPE cubes, stacked on pallets. The bloke I spoke to said they'd been flogging that way for at least ten years, mainly to pubs and clubs who buy in bulk and refill their bottles.

Somehow a stainless 200-litre drum (last contents were bourbon according to the label) managed to fall into the back of my mate's ute on the way out of the last place, too. They really should be more careful leaving that sorta stuff laying around on loading docks, it coulda rolled off and hurt someone...

[punkin]

I went to a couple of liquor distributors/wholesalers yesterday on a mission for some friends. One had Bundy Rum, Jim Beam and two brands of vodka in 20 litre HDPE cubes, stacked on pallets. The bloke I spoke to said they'd been flogging that way for at least ten years, mainly to pubs and clubs who buy in bulk and refill their bottles.

Somehow a stainless 200-litre drum (last contents were bourbon according to the label) managed to fall into the back of my mate's ute on the way out of the last place, too. They really should be more careful leaving that sorta stuff laying around on loading docks, it coulda rolled off and hurt someone...

Friggin bikies, there's no stoppin ya's

[zymos]

according to their specs it should be perfectly safe. I'd like to see a real independent test but you have to figure if they're lying it's a pretty big lawsuit in the works.

On the other hand, the plastic industry swears that bisphenol A is safe in the small amounts leached from Nalgene and polycarbonate, yet more and more scientists are claiming it is a very potent endocrine disrupter.

Devils advocate, me??

[Uncle Jesse]

Is the stuff approved by the EU? Somehow I get the feeling their health and safety regulations are a lot less influenced by corporate donations and PAC's than ours are.

[Digger]

going by the second web page its not the etoh ya need to worry about its the ethel acetate(sp). most new distillers cant do cuts good enough to remove most much less all.

digger[/quote]

[alice]

Friggin bikies, there's no stoppin ya's

Despite some people's best efforts...

Now wtf am i gonna do with a stainless forty-four? A coupla ideas spring to mind...

[theholymackerel]

Hey Zymos.

Ya seem bright and openminded, so give this a ponder: The folks that test the rubbers and plastics are testin' the rubber and plastic's resistance to chems such as alcohol. And they are able to say honestly that certain types are resistant to alcohol. First of all what does "resistant" mean? I doubt it means impervious. Anyway, this isn't good info for us as homedistillers. We need to know what the plastic/rubber does to the alcohol. Untill tests are done the other way around and test the rubbers and plastics effects on ethanol, no-one can honestly say that any plastic is safe for contact with drinkin' ethanol (esp. at the higher concentrations that some here prefer).



Because of this, we here at this forum prefer to steer folks away from any plastics or rubbers.


Thankyou for understandin', and if you or anyone else run across a study done to see what rubber and different plastics do to ethanol PLEASE post it here. Good, solid info is always welcome.

[belandaaron]

How many times do we have to preach against plastic before people will believe us? I'm not sure.

.

How about each time someone new gets on here? ?

How are they supposed to know the past struggles this site has had with plastic?

They are excited and raring to go with the equipment that they have been sold. Often it is not the best equipment but hey, god bless those home brew shops huh...

[Tater]

How many times do we have to preach against plastic before people will believe us? I'm not sure.

.

How about each time someone new gets on here? ?

How are they supposed to know the past struggles this site has had with plastic?

They are excited and raring to go with the equipment that they have been sold. Often it is not the best equipment but hey, god bless those home brew shops huh...

Might trying reading the RULES its in them