Trouble malting barley

[Hack]

Another update. I've got my malted barley in my drying cabinet now, which I know works. I ended up letting the barley sprout until the sprouts were 2-3 times the length of the grain. That's longer than I wanted, but it took me awhile to remember where the heater that fits my drying cabinet was.

I've got my next batch started, too.

Thanks for all the input on this, everyone. I'm on my way to all grain mashing now.

[hank]

UPDATE...I cooked up a batch of corn mash last monday. 25#corn, 10# rye, 10# my own malt, cooked in 15 gal. water, another 5 gallon used to wash cooker out after draining..20gal.total. everything went along as usual till i added my malt, with store bought malt conversion would start take place immediatly...with my own...nothin. I normally get that "brain" cloud. This time I didnt get it, couldn't figure what happened, first thought was barley was under modified but i know quite a bit was good should have got a small indication. After 2-3 hours iodine showed starch, decided to leave it for the nite, figure something out the next day. Tuesday morning go to check, about a 3" layer of clear golden liquid on top of mash...WTF . checked for starch negative. checked SG =1.062, never been that high usually between 1.034 and 1.042. NOT THAT I'M COMPLAININ but why would conversion take so long and SG be higher then ever. only thing different from my usual routine was an extra 5lb. of rye added with barley. usually I use 5# only and add when mash temp drops down to about 180, which i did this time but THEN added another 5# when temp dropped to 160, mixed, then added malt. Any thoughts?... will distill tommorow...so for am very happy would love to be able to do this evertime.

[muckanic]

Got to thinking... you can over soak and cause spoil.. but if you UNDER soak nothin happens no harm just add more moisture.

The spoilage usually happens after soaking, during the sprouting phase. It is mainly due to inadequate turning of the grain (too much heat, not enough oxygen), or inadequate drainage (too much moisture). The pros generally don't rinse during sprouting, although it couldn't hurt, especially when sprouting in the odd geometry of a bucket where turning is difficult. Some of the soak times being mentioned here look a little low to me. The idea is that the seed swells and takes up the maximum amount of water, with an indicator being that all seeds have sunk. That can take up to 2 days depending on the grain, with the soak water usually being changed twice daily in order to provide oxygen.

[Dnderhead]

Need to read malting and brewing (Barnes and Nobel) grains are washed, rinse loaded on moving floors or in drums. it is sprayed with ozone/
water to keep up the moister also moist air is blown threw it .it is continuously turned and whetted. depending on the moister in the air etc.
this is a continuous operation.some times incircling the whole brewery/plant. (walking Flore mod) with the drum similar things happen
but grain is washed loaded in one end and a screw moves the grain this is a double walled mesh tank moist air is blown threw the grain and
exits the middle . it is also sprayed with water when needed.

[Hack]

I've tried a few different ways and amounts of time soaking grain, but nothing compared even close with how well using a bucket with a few holes drilled in it did. Not even close, and it was incredibly easy.

[Dnderhead]

that's what I think. grate for do it your selfer. a barrel is next for larger amounts. same idea. but a barrel on rollers you do not have to handle so much.
dryer? thank smoke house with a draft. mite alter mine to include a higher roof maybe a "windmill" to ventilate.(also could be a disguise)

[hank]

gettin better at it now. what i find that works best for me so far is as follows
wash barley in a bucket with small holes in the bottom, after cleaned fill bucket and let drain 5-6 times, then put bucket inside another bucket with water and an aereator in it. let set and aereate turning occasionally till chits form on grain. After chits form i dump grain onto a plastic covered table, spread out till about 2-3 inch deep pile. cover with another sheet of plastic to hold in moisture, turn often, at least every 6-8 hours. once barley is modified, judging this is the hardest part for me now, i dry for a couple days on a screen with a fan blowing, then 4-6 hours in the oven at 120f. working very good for me now. i think i need to get the temp down where im doing this to maybe get a slower thus more even malt.

[Selby]

I made several batches of malted barley some years ago & found it is best made at the lower temperatures of the year around 50-60f. Wash the grain well & soak for at least 24 hrs. with a fish tank airstone bubbling through it. Make a malting tray of wood say 4ft. x 2ft. x 4inches deep raised off the floor a lttle to allow air circulation with 1/8th." holes drilled in the bottom , sides & endsfor air circulation (a bit like a sieve) Spread the grain on this to germinate & adjust to a thickness of about 2 inches. I covered the box with a plywood lid on dowels to keep it slightly raised & to approximate dark sub soil conditions & prevent too fast drying out. Try & keep it damp by mist spraying when necessary. When the shoots (not the roots) are nearly as long as the grain on average, dry in a food dehydrator ASAP to stop further devlopment but remember the enzymes in wet malt at this stage are very sensitve to high temperatures & should be dried at no higher temp. than 120F. Good Luck, Selby.

[Selby]

Update:- I remember now I changed the steep water 2 or 3 times during soaking to further oxygenate. It is quite possible to "drown" the grain during a lengthy soak wihout air & it will simply go rotten. Also I turned the grain bed over 2or 3 times a day mainly to prevent matting of the roots which grow pretty fast. I also remember I found it necessary to line the bottom of the malt tray with fly wire mesh after I made the holes 1/4" dia. Also dried the (wooden floorboard) tray asap to prevent mould occuring.This was during my beer days 20 years ago.

[Hack]

If all you are looking for is a way to dry the malt, a drying cupboard works really well.

Mine is the result of an evolution of ideas. I originally was trying to make a cabinet for sprouting that could also be used for drying. The sprouting part didn't work out so well but the drying part works great. I designed mine around the idea of a heat duct with trays as baffles. It's a basic plywood box with a door on the face where I can slide the trays in and out. The trays have bottoms made out of perforated aluminum grill and sit on runners in the sides of the cabinet that space the trays a couple inches apart. Screen would probably work for tray bottoms as well. The cabinet is also a couple inches deeper than the depth of the trays so I can stagger the trays every other one tight to the back and tight to the front. This makes a zig zag path for the air to follow through the box. The lowest tray sits about 8" above the bottom of the cabinet and in the base of the cabinet I have a hole just the size of my ceramic disc heater. I set the face of the heater in the hole and turn it on. The top of the cabinet is a removeable lid that I crack open about an inch. I can dry my malt in two or three days and it doesn't get overheated or cooked.

[AndyC]

Interesting youtube video of a guy malting his own barley

He also has some videos about homegrowing tobacco


My type of guy!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HauYECAEQ8I" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[Samohon]

Nice video, but I think I'll still buy my malted barley... £18 (29USD) for 25Kg (50lb) crushed and ready to go...

Thanks man...

[shadylane]

Yes, store bought malt is cheaper and definitely more consistant... But Malting your own grain is fun.

[Peter_Muir]

I found this design and instruction manual for a tabletop malthouse on an SCA Arts and Sciences page.

http://www.nogy.net/malthouse/page3.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[Barney Fife]

but I think I'll still buy my malted barley... £18 (29USD) for 25Kg (50lb) crushed and ready to go..

Raw barley runs between $20-$22 for 88lbs(40kg) at my feed store. Malting costs nothing, and is so easy, it's actually a pleasure. Also, when we malt our own, we can allow the grain to fully convert, making a true distiller's malt, instead of the brewer's malt which is stopped sooner to retain more sweetness and body.

[stinkypete]

thought id ask in this thread , first g at malting barley , i soaked 10 kg in a 20 l bucket overnight about 8 hours then drained within a day or so i noticed chits coming from quite a few , i was worried id kill the barley so i stped soaking and drilled a few holes in the bottom of bucket , possibly a little bit too big as the water drained real fast when i topped up with water , i kept them in the bucket for a further 3 days and then spread on plastic sheet on floor , roots started coming out ofquite a few but alot of the other barley are still not modified and now about 5 days later im seeing a few green sprouts (over modified ?)

what are my options now id hate to see all that barley go to waste , should i keep it moist and hope i get more results or dry it out and use it in a ujssm style wash with sugar , or throw it out .

appreciate any help here guys

stinky

[Dnderhead]

ask undies sniffer

[Horses-n-Hooch]

Hey Hank..... About your first post........some of us actually like the smell of horseshit

[stinkypete]

mine smells a bit like that is it stuffed ?

[quicksilver27]

I recently malted some double cleaned barley from Kansas. I washed it thouroughly with warm water then added fresh water and let it sit two hours. Then let it air dry for 8 hours. I did this twice. After the second time I spread about 5 lbs on a towel and sprayed it with water then covered it with another damp towel. Checking it twice a day and spreading it around, it sprouted little white dots on the third day. Now 95% of it is sprouted out and ready to be dried and kilned. Worked good for me.

[Xnerd]

I have about 20 lbs of corn malting about 4 days now. I would say that only about 70% of the grain sprouted at all.

50% of those are 1 inch 20% are about 1/2 inch and the rest are about 1/4 inch.

I am wondering if 70% malted would even be worth the footprint.

[Dnderhead]

use all malted corn.this can be done if 1/2 or more has sprouted.

[Xnerd]

excellent, thank you

[Dnderhead]

corn malt if all is right has a DP of 100. if 1/2 malted that makes a DP of 50..witch is plenty to convert itself.

[Xnerd]

That is what I was hoping to hear. I stirred it up a little and it might be less then 70% after all. Perhaps just over 50.
I would say that the vast majority of the grain has rootlets of less then 3/4 inch so I am going to give it some more time.

The hardest part for me will be to dry it.
The lowest setting on my dryer is too hot as well as my stove.
I might have to use a big folding table, cookie sheets and fans.

I have read a few people say that it is not totally unnecessary to run all of the roots off.
Its no big deal, I can do it, but was just interested in your opinions.

Thanks

[Dnderhead]

Wait just a minute ....the sprouts need to be 1-2 inches long,,,,not the roots..

[Xnerd]

Oh hell! Ok yeah they are starting to sprout too!
ok so, I guess I need to get all of my information here!

[Michaeln416]

I am amazed at how quick, easy and cheap it is to malt your own feed-grade barley. The price difference around here is remarkable; $55 for 25 kg of Canadian Pale Malt from the brew store vs. $10 for the same amount of feed barley. Plus you have lots of opportunity to add your own unique flavour to it as it dries (I'm experimenting with used coffee grounds on top of sugar maple charcoal to provide smoke).

My question is about mashing efficiency. Isn't some of the useable starch within the grain lost to the production of rootlets and the acrospire when malted? If I had 1,000 grains of raw barley and 1,000 grains from the same batch that were malted, wouldn’t the raw ones contain significantly more starch? I am curious about this because the feed-grade barley is a little leaner than the premium brew shop barley to begin with. Would my efficiency increase if I used more raw unmated barley in my grain bill? I should point out that I'm shooting for a single grain, scotch-like whiskey.

Here’s a couple of shots of my latest bucket full:

[Barney Fife]

By definition, a single malt is made of an all malted grain bill. What you're suggesting would lean the flavor profile more toward an Irish whiskey, because the Irish, always the penny-wise, do exactly as you suggest. They use enough malt to convert the whole wash, and not more; the rest of the grain bill is of raw grain.

So yes, it will work(I do it often, myself), but it does taste a bit different. Go for it!

[Michaeln416]

Thanks for that comment Barney Fife. I do enjoy Irish whiskey from time to time but for the most part I much prefer the flavour of scotch.

I've now gotten myself into a bit of a rhythm malting, drying, roasting, and toasting this inexpensive barley. This cool dry weather is perfect for it. So I'm going to build up some stock and play around with different toast/smoke levels.

Surprisingly this extra effort is greatly adding to my enjoyment of this hobby.