What did we do wrong?

[WAstill]

Hi all,

I've been constantly reading and working at perfecting the system to try to get a good batch together on my PDA-1 column still. Our first attempt was somewhat successful in that we definitely had some drinkable corn whiskey (70:30 corn:6-row malted barley). However, we wanted to up the volume of mash to make it a little easier for our cuts on the still. So here's what we did:

1) We decided to use 6.5 lbs of flaked corn, 1.5 lbs of rye, and 1.0 lbs of 6-row malted barley this time. Our initial problem was having a boiler big enough to use all the ingredients and cook it. We boiled the 4 gallons of water and then poured it immediately into a separate container with the flaked corn. We let that cool down, though it was obviously very very thick. at around 150F we added the rye and barley as well as 7 tablets of beano. Still the mash was very thick, tough to stir

2) we let that cool over night and it had noticeably loosened up, however still fairly thick. the temp was around 90F, so we pitched 20 g of dry ale yeast and let it do its thing

3) over the course of the next 4 to 5 days the batch was really cooking, we aerated the first couple days and let it go over the course of the final 3 days (bubbling was vigorous then slowed on the 4th and 5th day)

4) We decided to try to let it settle to distil when we had the time, however we were still worried about the thickness of our mash. After 24 hours of what we thought was sufficient time to settle it was still thick, we added some water (~1 gal), and let it settle some more. Finally we strained out what we could though there was still some sediment of corn/barley/rye.

5) We put it in our boiler and kept the temperature fairly low (270F) but now we sit here on hour 8 or 9 and the temp has not risen past 93-95F in our still. The mash is pretty hot but theres no action or increase in temperature anywhere in the system.

If there is anyone that can find something that we may look at to figure out our problem that would be greatly appreciated! I've been searching these boards for the answers, books of all kinds, websites....no answer!

Thanks!

[WAstill]

addition: If the mash is too thick even after straining, in a 7 gallon boiler, is there a way to get this thing to get some product going? very lost obviously!

[NcHooch]

Im sorry, but what's a PDA-1 column still?
...you never mentioned how much water you used, but 1 pound of malted barley is not very much for 8 pounds of grain .

[WAstill]

I'm sorry, the PDA-1 is sold by the amphora society: http://www.amphora-society.com/The-Amph ... 1_p_9.html

And I did mention I used 4 gallons of water - plus about a gallon of water later in the process

Thanks

[Dnderhead]

when using brewers malt you need about 20% "base malt"
the exact figure can be calculated with the DP..this has to be over 30.
but making a estimate,,8lb total grain bill will need 6 lb of corn and 2lb of malt.
ferther ,why are you trying to make AG and runing it threw a reflux still?

[WAstill]

I am running it without any packing inside the still. I wanted the versatility of a still to make other spirits than AG

[Dnderhead]

what did you use for malt?

[WAstill]

Used 6-row malted barley and malted rye...purchased from our local home brew shop

[Dnderhead]

i dont understand this either,,"temperature fairly low (270F)" how and where do you have 270f?
the only way you can obtain that kind of temperature is under pressur. if its the boiler temperature
(its got to be wrong) disregard.the mash will boil at whatever it wants to.witch will be between that of alcohol (172f ) and water 212f depending how much of each.
part of the reason your mash is thick is the rye,when using rye you should do a glucanase rest.

[Dnderhead]

came back to add ,,you say it fermented for 5 days,so you should have alcohol in the mash.
so you are not ruining your still right..disregard the thermometers,,slowly bring it to a boil.
when you start getting product ,regulate how fast it comes out with the heat.

[WAstill]

My apologies for the note of boiler temperature...I understand the science of the process in that my boiler temperature means nothing. I was merely adding it in from my notes in case someone may pick it up (because I dont know where the problem was). However, quick update: We kicked the power up a little bit and finally got it going, its been giving us an output, though we are getting a lot of output that seems to still be foreshots? (over 300ml) Is this ok or could there may be still a problem?

[Dnderhead]

you git what you git..what you dont like rerun.

[WAstill]

awesome! Thank you so much for your guys help...will keep reading and keep trying!

[NcHooch]

+1 on the rest for the rye.
I usually use a total of 6.5-7 gallons of water for a 10 pound grain bill (you'd like to end up with 5 gals beer and the grain soaks up some). I think if you try again with that recipe and use another pound of 6-row, more water, and incorporate a rest at 110F , you'll see a difference in your mash. (always add extra water during the mashing process, or after the mashing process....never after the ferment)

[rad14701]

You'll need to push plenty of power to run that PDA-1 in pot still mode... You would think that it would take less power than in reflux mode but it actually takes more... Just crank it up until you get the take off rate you want, just like with any other pot still...

I'm not sure the product output valve will open far enough to totally eliminate reflux... Hopefully it will allow more flow than my 1/4" needle valve which I have to remove from my small 1.25" combo head to eliminate unwanted reflux...

[Prairiepiss]

I would like to add. The PDA-1 is a LM reflux still. You and or Others reading this may be cornfused as to what type of still it actually is. That being said there is a lot of information around here on how to run an LM reflux still. As a reflux still and as a pot still.