camboscams wrote:Planning on making this wash this weekend, but i bought 2 row barley instead of 6..... Drats, how will this affect my mash? from my research it seams as if 6 row has more enzymes? but hopefully someone will be able to shed some light on this
Thanks NChooch!
Yep, 6-row malt has more diastic power (enzyme strength) , that's why we use it. But you can definitely use 2-row, and most 2-row has a DP of about 150 which is strong enough to use as a direct replacement.
So with this being said should i use more or the same amount of 2 row?
camboscams wrote:Planning on making this wash this weekend, but i bought 2 row barley instead of 6..... Drats, how will this affect my mash? from my research it seams as if 6 row has more enzymes? but hopefully someone will be able to shed some light on this
Thanks NChooch!
Yep, 6-row malt has more diastic power (enzyme strength) , that's why we use it. But you can definitely use 2-row, and most 2-row has a DP of about 150 which is strong enough to use as a direct replacement.
So with this being said should i use more or the same amount of 2 row?
Thanks for the quick response
in this recipe, 3 pounds should be fine ... but if you wanna be sure, look up the Litner for your malt. Should be able to look it up if you know the brand.
NChooch
Practice safe distillin and keep your hobby under your hat.
My eleven gallons of wash has been fermenting for one week with some Nottingham Ale yeast. It's still bubbling away actually... but gravity is only down from 1.071 to 1.030.
Normally I ferment in the un-air-conditioned portion of the garage (around 85 degrees). I wasn't thinking and have had the fermenter sitting in the air-conditioned workshop at 70 degrees. I'm thinking the cooler temps have provided for a slower fermentation time period.
So I'm going to move the fermenter to the warmer part of the garage and hope that this will finish fermenting out soon.
Would fermenting in a cooler environment (low and slow) with say, E1118 or even a lager yeast change the flavor much and carry into the distillate? Like a lager or cider I guess is what I would compare it to. Or is it not really worth the extra time for fermenting? I guess I'm just theorizing by the saying "You only get good liquor if you put in good beer. Bad or lower quality beer=bad liquor "
My eleven gallons of wash has been fermenting for one week with some Nottingham Ale yeast. It's still bubbling away actually... but gravity is only down from 1.071 to 1.030.
Normally I ferment in the un-air-conditioned portion of the garage (around 85 degrees). I wasn't thinking and have had the fermenter sitting in the air-conditioned workshop at 70 degrees. I'm thinking the cooler temps have provided for a slower fermentation time period.
So I'm going to move the fermenter to the warmer part of the garage and hope that this will finish fermenting out soon.
Would fermenting in a cooler environment (low and slow) with say, E1118 or even a lager yeast change the flavor much and carry into the distillate? Like a lager or cider I guess is what I would compare it to. Or is it not really worth the extra time for fermenting? I guess I'm just theorizing by the saying "You only get good liquor if you put in good beer. Bad or lower quality beer=bad liquor "
It's safe to say that a different yeast, or a lower temp would have some affect (might not even be noticeable after aging) but most of us don't wanna be waiting around for 4 weeks for their bourbon to ferment out. Know what I'm sayin?
Cant quite say what happened with Qball there ...Nottingham is a damn good yeast for attenuation, and it's hard to believe it would just stop at 1.030 in a 70 degree bourbon mash.
NChooch
Practice safe distillin and keep your hobby under your hat.
Do you leave the mash alone during the whole ferment or do you open to stir at all? I've been fermenting nicely for the last 24 hours but wasn't sure if folks were doing a daily stir or just letting it do it's thing.
Thanks--this is my first AG!
Making this right now. But I'm doing it in two batches because I don't have a big enough pot for my recipe. I'm also cooking my corn(with some 6-row) in a pot in my oven.
30 gallon recipe:
42lbs cracked corn
12lbs 6-row
6lbs malted rye
Nottingham
Should only be about a 6% ABV mash.
Will do two strips, then a spirit run. I plan on doing this every weekend until I get a big amount to put away for long term aging!
I've only done a double batch once, it's a pain dealing with all that corn.
It'd be a different story if I had a flat-bottom pot that held 15 gallons and a big long stirring paddle.
I just stick with the 5 gal batches.
NChooch
Practice safe distillin and keep your hobby under your hat.
Just finished running a batch through the pot still with a bubble torpedo attached, let me just start by saying this is my first attempt at all grain mashing and so far so good!!! All i had was a 12qt pot and i did all 7 pounds of corn plus the 1/2 pound of malt (all i could get local was 2row....) so needless to say a 40qt pot is in the mail already. So all the product i could get was about a qt of 120proof so my assumptions were correct about getting low conversion.
I know when i boiled the corn there wasn't enough water so i would imagine that that didn't help me, i did not add any beno, so next time i want to do that for sure but what else could i do to up my conversion and raise my output?
Now onto the taste, I'm used to sugar mashes so far, sweet feed allbran wheat germ, and the taste that i got for this batch seems much more...professional tasting then what i have produced in the past, i can't wait to get it aired and on some oak!!!
So I managed to do something wrong (imagine that) with this recipe and would love some feedback/help. I used exact quantities as described and followed the temperature guidelines closely. The only thing that I felt may have been odd was when I insulated my mash after adding the barley in the evening/night, it didn't cool to yeast pitching temp until noon the next day. Is this problematic? I ran it through the pot and got some pretty nasty, 50-60 proof output. Some of which had sort of a greasy film. Needless to say I was sad! But I want to try again after any feedback from the pros on what I may have done wrong.
Thanks, in advance.
PNWnewbie wrote:So I managed to do something wrong (imagine that) with this recipe and would love some feedback/help. I used exact quantities as described and followed the temperature guidelines closely. The only thing that I felt may have been odd was when I insulated my mash after adding the barley in the evening/night, it didn't cool to yeast pitching temp until noon the next day. Is this problematic? I ran it through the pot and got some pretty nasty, 50-60 proof output. Some of which had sort of a greasy film. Needless to say I was sad! But I want to try again after any feedback from the pros on what I may have done wrong.
Thanks, in advance.
I routinely let mine cool overnight and the pitch the yeast in the morning .
When you said "nasty 50-60 proof" , did you mean % ?
If you actually meant proof, then I question whether you had any fermentation to speak of.
tell us about the yeast
NChooch
Practice safe distillin and keep your hobby under your hat.
Yep, I read your recipe about cooling it overnight and figured all would be fine. But it's coming out at 50-60 proof. Not %. I am guessing I didn't convert enough to sugar. It appeared to ferment OK--frequent bubbling until day 7 when it slowed to bubbling about once every 30 seconds. No odor besides kind of a sour corn smell which seemed appropriate. I used champagne yeast which my brew shop guiy told me would be good for the higher alcohol tolerance I was seeking. Any ideas or something I did obviously wrong?
Hectorious wrote:So I've done a couple of batches of this of this recipe, and it tastes great. Now I'm wanting to try a grain bill closer to commercial bourbon. Here's my plan:
Cook corn for 90 min in 4 gallons of water.
Dump into insulated cooler and cool to 150 F
Add rye and barley, and mash for 90 min, stirring every 15 min.
Transfer to fermenter, cool to yeast pitching temp, and add a healthy starter of 1118 yeast.
What do you think? I've got the corn and grains ready to go. I just need to finish a few chores around the house to keep the Mrs happy, and I'll be ready to go. Any advice?
I cooked up the recipe above, and it converted very well. At the same time, I prepared a sugar wash on the spent grains from my previous batch without the rye. This time, HORRORS! As both batches finished fermenting, they developed a white-as-snow powdery scum on top. No off smells or flavors, even when I tasted some of the gross scummy film. No strings or webs, just "wrinkles" when the film was pushed around a bit. I've been super-clean, washing equipment with sarsan and spraying with idophor (except the fermentation bucket with the spent grains). And I've never had this problem with all-corn UJSSM. I've read elsewhere on this site where some folks have run it anyway and got great results, so I'm not too worried. Then again, others have dumped it and started again. What is this stuff?? Anyone else have the same thing happen?
you can see come corn kernels floating in the second shot.
Carrying on our cultural heritage in the tradition of old Uncle Murdoch. "Ach, well..., slainte mhath!"
NChooch,
Mate what a thread. I'm currently running one of my versions of your recipy. This was my first all grain mash a few months ago. I love it. I tried some of the first batch now it's a couple months old, bloody good 'corn whiskey' as i have to call it in oz.
Mate thank you so very much for this. And thanks to every one else who have contributed on here.
AussieStiller90 wrote:NChooch,
Mate what a thread. I'm currently running one of my versions of your recipy. This was my first all grain mash a few months ago. I love it. I tried some of the first batch now it's a couple months old, bloody good 'corn whiskey' as i have to call it in oz.
Mate thank you so very much for this. And thanks to every one else who have contributed on here.
Keep it up!
Glad to hear ur enjoying it man
NChooch
Practice safe distillin and keep your hobby under your hat.
Hectorious wrote:So I've done a couple of batches of this of this recipe, and it tastes great. Now I'm wanting to try a grain bill closer to commercial bourbon. Here's my plan:
Cook corn for 90 min in 4 gallons of water.
Dump into insulated cooler and cool to 150 F
Add rye and barley, and mash for 90 min, stirring every 15 min.
Transfer to fermenter, cool to yeast pitching temp, and add a healthy starter of 1118 yeast.
What do you think? I've got the corn and grains ready to go. I just need to finish a few chores around the house to keep the Mrs happy, and I'll be ready to go. Any advice?
I cooked up the recipe above, and it converted very well. At the same time, I prepared a sugar wash on the spent grains from my previous batch without the rye. This time, HORRORS! As both batches finished fermenting, they developed a white-as-snow powdery scum on top. No off smells or flavors, even when I tasted some of the gross scummy film. No strings or webs, just "wrinkles" when the film was pushed around a bit. I've been super-clean, washing equipment with sarsan and spraying with idophor (except the fermentation bucket with the spent grains). And I've never had this problem with all-corn UJSSM. I've read elsewhere on this site where some folks have run it anyway and got great results, so I'm not too worried. Then again, others have dumped it and started again. What is this stuff?? Anyone else have the same thing happen?
IMG-20121114-00167.jpg
IMG-20121114-00169.jpg
you can see come corn kernels floating in the second shot.
I've never seen anything like that on mine, but as long as it
Smells good I'd cook it
NChooch
Practice safe distillin and keep your hobby under your hat.
Hi guys, first try at all grain. I basically doubled the recipe.
I soaked 14lbs cracked corn in 4 gallons boiling water overnight in my cooler. Added that to my bop with an additional 4 gallons. and started cooking. I got to a nice simmer and towards the end of 90 minutes I noticed the corn almost forming a paste on the top. I assume this is the gelatinization I am looking for? I wonder if I needed to cook longer. I also burnt some corn on the bottom of the pot but it kind of formed a layer and none of the burnt corn went into the cooler. Didn't notice any burnt smell, only sweet corn goodness . I let this set in the cooler for a few hours while I went to the in laws. Came back and dropped temp to about 147. Added 6lbs 6 row and 1lb malted rye. Temp dropped to about 143. I added 5 crushed beano tabs and stirred every 15 minutes for 2.5 hrs. Then let cool overnight.
This morn the mash was to thick to get a SG reading but it smelled great. The mash was just under 8 gallons that I split into two 7.5 gallon buckets and topped off with water to about 6 gallons each. I took a reading at this time and adjusting for temp it read 1.034. (1.030 at 90 degrees) so it looks like my abv is only 3.2%. Any advice you guys can recommend? This is my first attempt at mashing and I have the ingredients to repeat this process a second time. I am waiting for some WD Prestige today but if it doesn't come I have 2 packs of ale yeast I will pitch in the next couple of hours.
I plan to run this through a Brewhaus psII. Should I strip with a little reflux or will I lose to much flavor? Then spirit run in pot still mode.
Thanks for the great recipe NC!! It was a lot of work but extremely enjoyable
Barbasol that seems like a low conversion rate? Was the malt crushed? Just asking because the batch I am running now came out at 1.060, but it was more of a sweet feed mix and not pure corn.
Im just about done running 10 gallons thru the detuned boka, must say pretty good right now, can't wait till after some oak and age!
The man bangin' on the door yelled "Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms!"....I just assumed it was more supplies.
@ Barbasol
Sounds like you weren't too far off , but seems like you missed the mark somewhere there .
I've gotten the best conversion by soaking the corn using 25% (sterile) backset, and 25% water for a day ... add the rest of the cooking water, and then do the 3-rest corn cook (130, 165, 200) . this seems to release more starch. I usually hafta add a little malt while cooking the corn to loosen it up, and I also usually add some more water right after cooking to bring the temp down and loosen it up further. then mash it in the cooler as usual using your malt .
I assume yall must see the same type of really thick corn SMOP that i get if I don't pre-mash (almost as thick as grits) ...try and keep it more watery for the start of the mash, and I think you'll get better results.
NChooch
Practice safe distillin and keep your hobby under your hat.
Just added the 6-row and boy does this stuff smell good. This is my second attempt. The first one came out perfect and I just added some sugar to the hot backset and and fermented on the old grain. Again it was pretty good. This time I added 1.5 pounds of dark dry malt extract while I was cookin the corn. Hope I didn't screw it up. Too late to start the second batch so I will do that tomm.
Any comments on using the extract?
Thanks again hooch, for this awsome recipe. It is fairly easy to do and makes one hell of a product.
NcHooch wrote:@ Barbasol
Sounds like you weren't too far off , but seems like you missed the mark somewhere there .
I've gotten the best conversion by soaking the corn using 25% (sterile) backset, and 25% water for a day ... add the rest of the cooking water, and then do the 3-rest corn cook (130, 165, 200) . this seems to release more starch. I usually hafta add a little malt while cooking the corn to loosen it up, and I also usually add some more water right after cooking to bring the temp down and loosen it up further. then mash it in the cooler as usual using your malt .
I assume yall must see the same type of really thick corn SMOP that i get if I don't pre-mash (almost as thick as grits) ...try and keep it more watery for the start of the mash, and I think you'll get better results.
Thnx NC, it's fermenting now so we will see how it goes. On your soak do you have the backseat and the 25% water boiling when you add the corn?
I was planning to do the 3 rest cook but I over shot my initial temp and figured I would try the recipe as originally written. Next time I will pay more attention and do the California 3 Rest! At what point to you add the malt and then the extra water?
My corn was super thick in the cooler until I cooled to 150 and added my barley/rye. Then it thinned a lot.
Gonna add some sugar to these grains ala ujssm and also start a second batch of NC bourbon to fill my keg still.
You must not've read what i wrote ...
"I usually hafta add a little malt while cooking the corn to loosen it up, and I also usually add some more water right after cooking (the corn) to bring the temp down and loosen it up further. then mash it in the cooler as usual using your malt ." (at 150 degrees ...right?)
NChooch
Practice safe distillin and keep your hobby under your hat.
Man, my whole house smells like some good ass oatmeal. Ferment is goin off like crazy so I guess I did something right. I can def smell and taste the difference from adding the dark malt extract. I pitched my yeast (Red Star bakers yeast) at 100 deg. and it really seems to like it. Unfortunately I did not take sg readings ( life always gets in the way of hobbies) so I will just wait for the correct taste as that has been the way i'm used to. Hoping for no infections. I will update in the near future. Thanks again for all the great info and shared experience on this forum.
