Birdwatchers sugar wash recipe

[ManimalCrackers]

Greetings! After sifting through the ~5 years worth of posts in this thread (!), I'm ready to attempt my first ever ferment and distillation.

Before I begin my fermenting, I have a few questions.

1) I will be using a 6-gallon carboy with an airlock (I'll be getting some buckets in the near future), and want to make sure my formula is correct. I'm shooting for 5-gallons total wash volume, which will hopefully give enough room for foaming. My calculations: 9.5lbs sugar, 6.5oz tomato paste, juice of 1 lemon, ~2oz yeast (super start yeast from a local brew shop), pinch of Epsom salts, enough water to reach 5-gallon mark. Does this sound right?

2) Most folks seem to be recommending keeping the temp between 77F-86F (25C-30C). Right now, I don't have any kind of external heating options (heating pad, etc), so the carboy will be sitting in my kitchen at a near constant temp of 71F (21.6C). Is this going to cause any issues other than a longer fermenting time?

3) I see a lot of folks mentioning they use a reflux still. All I have right now is a Whiskey Still Co. 2.5-gallon pot still. Will I get drinkable product with a single run through a pot still? Or would I be better off making some cuts and sending it through a second time?

4) I hate to waste things, so I was thinking of aging some of the finished product with a bit of the leftover lemon peel or lemon zest. Good idea or bad?

Thanks to everyone for taking the time to share your knowledge!


P.S. Extra thanks to Undies for his Birdwatch Sugar Wash Recipe Calculator! I wish I would have noticed it before reading through 60+ pages of comments! I think I had 6 google windows open there for a while trying to convert all of the metric measurements being tossed around! Darn you foreigners and your wonky measurments! They confuse a poor, simple, imperial-minded Yankee like me!

[frozenthunderbolt]

1) I will be using a 6-gallon carboy with an airlock (I'll be getting some buckets in the near future), and want to make sure my formula is correct. I'm shooting for 5-gallons total wash volume, which will hopefully give enough room for foaming. My calculations: 9.5lbs sugar, 6.5oz tomato paste, juice of 1 lemon, ~2oz yeast (super start yeast from a local brew shop), pinch of Epsom salts, enough water to reach 5-gallon mark. Does this sound right?
Should give you a wash with a potential alcohol of 13.4% - perhaps a tad high; loose .5-1 pound for less yeast stress, should work ok otherwise
2) Most folks seem to be recommending keeping the temp between 77F-86F (25C-30C). Right now, I don't have any kind of external heating options (heating pad, etc), so the carboy will be sitting in my kitchen at a near constant temp of 71F (21.6C). Is this going to cause any issues other than a longer fermenting time?
Will be slower, this could marginally increase the chance of infection - overcome this by starting it with a "yeast bomb" (use the HD google search function to investigate this). Otherwise your slightly cooler temp is probably good - less esters created at lower temps (so long as they are not so low they stress the yeast.

3) I see a lot of folks mentioning they use a reflux still. All I have right now is a Whiskey Still Co. 2.5-gallon pot still. Will I get drinkable product with a single run through a pot still? Or would I be better off making some cuts and sending it through a second time?
I would run a strip run first and find out what your ABV of all the alcohol (less foreshots if you want) will be through your still.
Then do enough strip runs to fill your still with 30-38% alcohol (you may or may not need to dilute with water to do this) and do a spirit run on which you should make cuts; higher ABV = more consistent run, diluting and re-running it will give you a cleaner finished product. If you took a fores cut on each strip run you should get slightly more useable hearts on you spirit run but i would still take a fores and a heads cut on your spirit run regardless.

4) I hate to waste things, so I was thinking of aging some of the finished product with a bit of the leftover lemon peel or lemon zest. Good idea or bad?
Lemon vodka can be good - macerate peels and then dilute and re-distill, pure maceration can result in bitterness from the pith (white part) - you would want to be using organic spray free un-waxed lemons (home grown would be ideal). Perhaps do a search on Lemmonchello for info around this idea - there are several good threads on it.

Thanks to everyone for taking the time to share your knowledge!
No worries

P.S. Extra thanks to Undies for his Birdwatch Sugar Wash Recipe Calculator! I wish I would have noticed it before reading through 60+ pages of comments! I think I had 6 google windows open there for a while trying to convert all of the metric measurements being tossed around! Darn you foreigners and your wonky measurments! They confuse a poor, simple, imperial-minded Yankee like me!

[Beam]

hey i read the post for birdfeeder wash for 80 litres well i was wondering if you could tell me the recipe for 25 litre wash please? also what percent is the ABV % for this wash? and is it virtually no smell or taste? also what yeast is best i live in Australia, QLD and i think i can get a dry yeast 280g for $4 bucks but i dont remember the name this is just from woolies by the way. thank you

[maheel]

for 25L

i use 5kg sugar
1 lemon juice
1 plastic tub of Tpaste
1 pinch of epsom salts
roughly 1/2 cup "scoop" of lowans yeast (the one your talking about)

[Lipdog81]

Hi Beam..

I am from Aus as well..

My 25L recipe is:
6kgs Raw Sugar
250gms Tomato Paste (woolies home brand tin)
80gms Lowans bakers yeast (woolies..comes in a red tin)
1 squeezed lemon
Good pinch epsom salts

SG approx 1090... ferments out to 990 no problem in about 8 to 10 days.

I am onto my 6th batch now and absolutely love it... I even drink it str8 it is so nice.. makes greet spirit once flavoured.. I tipped out all my Turbo made spirits after trying this as it is like chalk and cheese.

Ive just put on a 25L wash with 10kg sugar as an experiment.. will see how that turns out... it had a SG of 1140

[frozenthunderbolt]

Both of the last to posts are too high in sugar 4KG per 20L max 3.5 is better

[Undies]

P.S. Extra thanks to Undies for his Birdwatch Sugar Wash Recipe Calculator! I wish I would have noticed it before reading through 60+ pages of comments! I think I had 6 google windows open there for a while trying to convert all of the metric measurements being tossed around! Darn you foreigners and your wonky measurments! They confuse a poor, simple, imperial-minded Yankee like me!

No probs... Enjoy.

[maheel]

Both of the last to posts are too high in sugar 4KG per 20L max 3.5 is better

we are talking 25L mate... 5 in 25L is fine (1kg per 5L give or take )

even your 4 in 20 is 1kg per 5L....

[frozenthunderbolt]

Both of the last to posts are too high in sugar 4KG per 20L max 3.5 is better

we are talking 25L mate... 5 in 25L is fine (1kg per 5L give or take )

even your 4 in 20 is 1kg per 5L....

Yes and no. 3-4 made up to 23L keeps the potential alcohol under at or 10% You are probably right in that 5kg is ok at around 12% but I would say that 6kg giving a 14% wash is starting to get into lost returns territory as far a cleanliness and speed of fermentation go.
Much better to shoot lower and have happier yeast and a faster fermentation to dryness

[Undies]

Preface: I have read all 76 (and counting) pages, and either can't remember, or can't find, my answer. Sorry if it's been asked before.

I put on (yet) another BW wash (55 litres). The starting SG was 1.080, kept at constant 28degC (82degF). I decided to measure the SG every 24 hours (out of curiosity). After 24 hours of constant bubbling, I measures the SG at 1.040. Is this possible? I left the sample out overnight and remeasured, and it was still 1.040 (degassed).

I've always had success with this great recipe, but can it really work that fast at the beginning? No complains though.

[still stoopid]

Birdwatchers slow ferment question. I have been running this great recipe for a while now (the only one i run) without failure starting with a 40 liter batch setting to a 1.08 sg using 113 grams Flieshmans active dry yeast. This sucker has never failed me and finishes in less than 2 weeks at a temp just less than 25c , 75f heated with a non adjustable aquarium heater. Im heading away for 6 weeks and would like to slow down the ferment. Im thinking of using much less yeast and leaving the heater out ? Room temperature will average 20c 68f

Does this make sense? How much yeast would you guys recommend? I understand these sugar mashes are pretty tolerant to mold but would be nice to have it finish roughly when I return home ? Would also be nice to be confident that it wont stall the day after I leave ! Any thoughts/comments ?

Cheers,
Still stoopid !

[HolyBear]

Hey Still Stoopid, just keep it under airlock and it will be fine. It will keep, no problem. No need to change the recipe if your happy with it. Without the added warmth it will be slower.

[HolyBear]

Both of the last to posts are too high in sugar 4KG per 20L max 3.5 is better

we are talking 25L mate... 5 in 25L is fine (1kg per 5L give or take )

even your 4 in 20 is 1kg per 5L....

Yes and no. 3-4 made up to 23L keeps the potential alcohol under at or 10% You are probably right in that 5kg is ok at around 12% but I would say that 6kg giving a 14% wash is starting to get into lost returns territory as far a cleanliness and speed of fermentation go.
Much better to shoot lower and have happier yeast and a faster fermentation to dryness

+1 I like to shoot for about 8%. Definitely under 10%... it starts to get this funky bite for my tastes above 10%

[still stoopid]

Hey Still Stoopid, just keep it under airlock and it will be fine. It will keep, no problem. No need to change the recipe if your happy with it. Without the added warmth it will be slower.

Thx Wasabi

I just run the wash in the plastic primary and dont rack it over bcoz I strip run after it finishes then reflux it. Im just trying to get it to finish fermenting much later than the 2 weeks it usually takes. I dont want it sitting in the primary for a full month while im away !

Cheers,

[Undies]

Preface: I have read all 76 (and counting) pages, and either can't remember, or can't find, my answer. Sorry if it's been asked before.

I put on (yet) another BW wash (55 litres). The starting SG was 1.080, kept at constant 28degC (82degF). I decided to measure the SG every 24 hours (out of curiosity). After 24 hours of constant bubbling, I measures the SG at 1.040. Is this possible? I left the sample out overnight and remeasured, and it was still 1.040 (degassed).

I've always had success with this great recipe, but can it really work that fast at the beginning? No complains though.

Ah-hem...

[HolyBear]

Ah-hem... well ok... yes, the majority of the alcohol will be made in the first couple days. That's how/why single malt scotch can be made with a two day ferment. With grains, additional flavors can come over with longer ferments. You'll not be gaining the optimal use of yer sugar if you run it too soon and it will give you a sweet tasting spirit, even refluxed...

[Undies]

Thanks very much. I figured it started of quickly and slowly decrease until it stalled. But never thought it was this quick.

In case anyone is interested... At a constant 28°C...

Start SG: 1.080
Sugar: 11.25kg (to yield 55 litre @ ~11.2%ABV)
1 day: 1.040 (yield 5.2% ABV)
2 days: 1.025 (yield 7.1% ABV)
3 days: 1.005 (yield 9.7% ABV)
4 days: 1.000 (yield 10.3% ABV)

[Undies]

At a constant 28°C...

Sugar: 11.25kg (to yield 55 litre @ ~11.2%ABV)

Start SG: 1.080
1 day: 1.040 (yield 5.2% ABV)
2 days: 1.025 (yield 7.1% ABV)
3 days: 1.005 (yield 9.7% ABV)
4 days: 1.000 (yield 10.3% ABV)
5 days: 0.992 (yield 11.3% ABV)
6 days: 0.990 (yield 11.6% ABV)

[KHB]

Hi guys. My mate building my still had informed me its nearly ready. So I want to get a wash going. Was looking at doing this for my first one. Was going to do 2X25lt batches and run them one at a time. Just wondering if someone could tell me the quantities I would need. And full me in with any info I need to know?? I have a temp controlled fridge so temp control is no issue.

Cheers
KHB

[Undies]

Hi guys. My mate building my still had informed me its nearly ready. So I want to get a wash going. Was looking at doing this for my first one. Was going to do 2X25lt batches and run them one at a time. Just wondering if someone could tell me the quantities I would need. And full me in with any info I need to know?? I have a temp controlled fridge so temp control is no issue.

Cheers
KHB

http://birdwatchers.freewebhosts.com.au/

Easy.

[Undies]

Or... in it's new place...
Birdwatchers ingredients calculator: http://shuggo.com/birdwatchers/

[TopShelf]

Hey folks, first off like to say wicked recipe! Second I love all the feedback from all the users. I'm on page 38 of my second reading of this thread. I have a question that I haven't seen an answer for yet. When you take a sample into the cylinder for the hydrometer and you're done with the sample can you just put it back into the fermenter? Or do you dump it down the drain. Thanks for your answers. I'm just wondering if dumping it back into the fermenter will introduce too much oxygen and negatively affect the wash.

[Undies]

Hey folks, first off like to say wicked recipe! Second I love all the feedback from all the users. I'm on page 38 of my second reading of this thread. I have a question that I haven't seen an answer for yet. When you take a sample into the cylinder for the hydrometer and you're done with the sample can you just put it back into the fermenter? Or do you dump it down the drain. Thanks for your answers. I'm just wondering if dumping it back into the fermenter will introduce too much oxygen and negatively affect the wash.

Personally, I just dump the sample. I figure its such a small amout compared to ruining the whole batch with contamination.

My cylinder is 100ml, so five samples totals 500ml, or less than 1% of the batch.

[jeremy38541]

did you do a vinegar run and sacrificial booze run before running your rig to get drinking spirit? If not, there may still be flux in it affecting the taste (and safety!) of your finished booze.

For all the BW does make a great neutral I also get a very faint odd not with it (i always put this down to my crap commercial still though) a very faint bitterness would be the closest i cold describe it, but it still aint quite the correct word

I definitely did do the vinegar run and as hard as it was I did sacrifice the first booze run. It was hard to do because I had been waiting so long to get started but obviously you don’t have much choice in the matter.

+1 I like to shoot for about 8%. Definitely under 10%... it starts to get this funky bite for my tastes above 10%

A couple pages ago I posted about having an odd taste to the final product. I wonder if this might be the cause. My washes start off slightly above 10%.

Does anyone else have any suggestions or experience to share?

Thanks again.

[bigbuck]

got my first birdwatchers wash together,at first it went crazy and built up a cap withen the first couple of hours and later that night the cap fell and it started fizzing like soda,is this right?? i have never used a sugar wash before and am not sure how its supposed to react as compared to a mash???????????

[Bushman]

Yep just leave it alone.

[OlympicMtDoo]

+1 Bushman

[bigbuck]

ok thanks bushman,at least now i know i am on the right track,and the wash is right,as far as a ferment time at 80 to 86 degrees( i know you cannot tell me exzactly) but what is the ballpark time on ferment,i know sometimes my sweetfeed would be ready in 4 to 5 days

[TopShelf]

Just wondering if 1.071 og- 0.94 fg is a good ferment. I haven't seen anyone post a fg of 0.94 before, usually 0.96-0.99. Is that too low? Or is it just where it landed, seeing as theres no bubbling yeast smell or sugary taste, though I can really smell the alcohol.

[Bushman]

Just wondering if 1.071 og- 0.94 fg is a good ferment. I haven't seen anyone post a fg of 0.94 before, usually 0.96-0.99. Is that too low? Or is it just where it landed, seeing as theres no bubbling yeast smell or sugary taste, though I can really smell the alcohol.

I wouldn't worry about it several factors could actually lead to the low reading. It's done run it.