Solder Question?

[Dave73]

I've been using solder that is made up of tin and antimony. It says its lead free. Will this be ok to use for a new pot and cap?

[Dave73]

Ok I went and did what I was supposed to do in first place and researched the site and found my own answer but know my question is I have my pot built and nothing else would it be safe to use the pot that is soldered with the 5% antimony and switch to a different one for the cap, arm lines to the thump and the lines to the worm? I appreciate any advice anyone can give me.

[acfixer69]

Have no idea what your question is so no answer here. Leadfree good not leadfree not good

[flyingdutchman]

Hi Dave,
My guess is you used the much older style 95/5 (5% antimoney) plumbers lead free solder (dating back to like 1985 when I was a helper lol) rather than the current version of what we call lead free solder? Do you have a picture of exactly what you have soldered it might be helpful so people can understand.

[Dave73]

Im building a traditional style moonshine still with a 20 gallon pot a thumper and a worm. I have built the pot so far and nothing else and realized the solder I was using was the type that contained antimony. My question is will it be safe to use the pot with this type of solder? I will switch to silver solder to finish the cap and arm, and the rest of the piping. Sorry if I wasnt clear on my question, I have been using a keg with a stainless 2" reflux head for years now but have had a design my grandfather gave me before he passed and am finally getting to try and build it, so this is my first copper build. I quickly realized its not as easy as some make it look lol. Thanks for the help.

[flyingdutchman]

Hi Dave,
When i was a plumbers helper back in 85 to 87 95/5 (5% antimony (Sb)) was all i ever saw or used for lead free applications like drinking water lines etc. More recently I dont see the stuff around anymore and instead see the silver flo types of plumbing solder. A quick internet search shows that you can still buy the stuff and several suppliers imply it is safe for hot and cold water applications

WELDCOTE
95/5 TIN/ANTIMONY SOLDER
Description- This solder is useful for applications where moderately elevated temperature
is a factor. With a higher electrical conductivity and high fluidity, it is recommended for
lead free installation of small diameter, tight fitting connections. Used in the joining of
copper tubing in refrigeration and air conditioning applications. Also used in piping and
fittings for drinking water systems. May be used in the dipping of wire harnesses. These
solders are not recommended for use on brass.
Approvals-

BUT My first thought would be to check with a local plumber to see what the national and local codes say about the use of 95/5. Is it still approved for use potable water lines..
I have heard that in part the change away from it was because of its flow characteristics, 95/5 runs alot and silver flo flows better.
Then even if 95/5 is still approved for hot and cold potable water applications you need to remember that ethanol and heated ethanol vapor is a different solvent than water. Could it leach out/extract some amout of antimony in say ppb I do not know.
I never finished my apprenticeship as a plumber However I am a chemist and as a chemist my first instinct is to look at the MSDS for antimony (Sb)

Section 11: Toxicological Information
Routes of Entry: Eye contact. Inhalation. Ingestion.
Toxicity to Animals: Acute oral toxicity (LD50): 7000 mg/kg [Rat].
Chronic Effects on Humans: Causes damage to the following organs: blood, kidneys, lungs, the nervous system, liver,
mucous membranes.
Other Toxic Effects on Humans:
Very hazardous in case of ingestion. Hazardous in case of skin contact (irritant), of inhalation. Slightly hazardous in case of
skin contact (permeator).
Special Remarks on Toxicity to Animals: Not available.
Special Remarks on Chronic Effects on Humans: Human: passes through the placenta, excreted in maternal milk.
Special Remarks on other Toxic Effects on Humans: Not available.

Pay close attention to the LD50 (50% of a lethal dose) and..
Chronic Effects : Thats alot of organs to damage not to mention..
Special Chronic Effects on Humans it passes through the placenta and is excreted in mothers milk (yes I know pregnant women should not drink).
I dont mean to be a wet blanket but that msds doesnt make me jump for joy should the ethanol extract the antimony Sb. Then go and look up the msds for tin (Sn) and look at how much safer it is.

[Dave73]

Thanks Dutchman I appreciate the info I have picked up some silver solder and guess I'll be starting over. Oh well better safe than sorry.

[flyingdutchman]

Hey Dave,
Sorry I hate to be the bearer of bad news. I have certianly been accused of bieng to over cautious at times but usually I try to work with the better safe than sorry idea. I know copper dont come cheap. Maybe with any luck you can unsolder your work, clean it up and resolder it? If the silver flo does indeed flow better it might make the whole job alot easier to redo. I would love to see a some plans and a build along.

FD

PS if any other members have any advice on this I woiuld love to hear suggestions or work arounds?

[Dave73]

I'll post pics soon as I get back together again. LOL

[Dave73]

her's a pic of my pot and head havent finished anything else yet and still have to clean it up and polish.

[flyingdutchman]

Wow that is seriously nice work. You must have been on a mission because you banged that together in very short order. What size is it? How did the solder perform any differently or the same?

Looks great
FD

[Dave73]

I had a bunch of copper fortunately. it should be able to run 18 gals it will hold 22 gallons. the solder definetely took a bit more to heat up but worked great.

[scooter-1]

very nice.

[banjer74]

hello, I actually posted the same question, sorry about that. I didnt come across this post before I posted mine, but anyway I found a thread to a paper that was done on this subject. It seems to suggest that antimony in solder is safer than silver but anyway I thought it was interesting. I would like to hear peoples opinion on this after they read it. here is the link.. http://www.psinter.com/downloads/aim/Antimony_Study.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[Dave73]

Banjer I see what you are saying. Its a good argument ffor the safety of antimony. Lets see if anyone else weighs in on this