Single Malt - Triple Distill

[Boda Getta]

I have ran a sample 5 gal of single malt (100% barley) through my pot still and everything went great. I am getting ready to ferment and run a 25 gal mash of 2#/gal; I'm not using any peated grain and are looking for a Irish Whiskey style. I have read quite a few reviews of good Irish whiskeys and lern that many of the distilleries triple distill their Irish whiskey; my normal course of action has been to do a stripping run, then a low and slow spirit and prefer a pot still still because it retains more favor than a reflux still. As anyone here triple distilled their single malts? There must be a reason many of them triple distill but I don't want to strip all that good malted barley favor out of my run (the malt favor in my 5 gal run low wines gave me a boner).
What say you single malt guys? Jimbo. others?

BG

[rtalbigr]

I never triple my AGs. With good cuts a strip and spirit run does fine.

Big R

[just sayin]

If the quick stripped run is giving you wood, a slow spirt run should be all you need.

[zirtico]

If you really like the lighter Irish whiskeys, then by all means you should triple distill. Irish whiskeys tend to be lighter on grain flavour and heavier on caramel sweetness, things that I, personally, am not crazy about, although I do still like Irish whiskeys. I tend to make 100% barley scotch-style single malts without peated malts and only double distilled. And frankly, I wouldn't triple mine.

Another choice you have, albeit at a cost, is instead of collecting to about 25% ABV total on your strip run, you could stop the run earlier (at the cost of some precious alcohol) at about 30 or even 35% ABV total after strip. Since cuts are all smeared up in the strip, if you stop that early, some of the tails and esters won't come through on your first run, resulting in a lighter flavoured whisky after spirit run. It might be something to try if you really want to give it a go.

[Jimbo]

Boda, have you tasted some Irish whiskies to see if you like them? You said you read a bunch of good reviews. Reviews sometimes arent worth the paper theyre printed on since the reviewer wasnt tasting with your tongue. And they are tasting them relative to other Irish styles. You said the low wines of your single malt gave you a boner. Far be it to mess with anything that gives you a boner. maybe a single malt, twice pot stilled for max flavor is your spirit of choice. Id recommend picking up some Bushmills or trying a glass at the local watering hole first, before messing with something that gave you wood.

Also, trying to hit a target is no small task, and takes many runs to dial in. If you like Bushmills, there's way more going on than just the triple distillation. What yeast do they use, at what temp. etc Also Irish whiskies traditionally have high umalted content, so youre already off on that aspect.

Long story short. If you like it, quit messin with it Thats my $0.02.

For what its worth I do a 5 grain that I triple distill. Its not Irish as there's too many odd groceries. ANd even with triple distillation its still packed with flavors. But the triple runs does give it a certain cleanish character, even with the 5 grains flavors swirling. If that makes any sense.

[Odin]

Most Irish whiskey isn't tripple distilled. Not really. And the "third distillation" is not intended to make taste lighter. They are just as strong in taste as American whiskey. Yes, lighter in taste than Scottish single malt, but that has everything to do with the fact they only make half cuts on most Scottish single malts.

In Scottland, stills (boilers) have a size of 15,000 to 60,000 liters. In Ireland 100,000 to 150,000 liters is the norm. Smaller stills have relatively more copper. When content grows bigger it is with a factor "to the third" (volume increase, for instance more wash or low wines in a bigger boiler). The surface area, where low wines or wash is in contact with the copper still, grows with a factor "to the second". DM3 vs DM2. Hence, the amount of copper contact in the bigger Irish stills is much less, and sulphur control (copper does that for you) is less as well. The approach they use is that part of what's distilled is returned to the boiler. Right, for more copper contact.

So I am told.

I'd go with the advice from Big R and Jimbo: one strip run and one finishing run. In fact, I did my single malt in a 1.5 approach. I combined one part of low wines with one part of fresh wash and did a finishing run on that. But since I use an LM that gives me around 1.5 to 2 distillations in one run, that may not be a good comparison.

Odin.

[Boda Getta]

zirtico:
I'm intrigued your statement that you make non-peated Scotch style whiskey. I love Irish whiskey but don't much like the peat favor of most Scotchs; I was under the impression that the main difference between Scotch and Irish whiskey was that the malted barley used for Scotch was dried over burning peat, resulting in the smokey, peaty favor. Please share your method; I would prefer a fuller body without the peat.
Looking forward to hearing from you.

\BG

[Boda Getta]

Jimbo:
I like Irish whiskey and prefer Bushmills over Jameson; I toured the Jameson distillery in Dublin several years ago but it was before I was n this hobby and wish I had paid more attention. I was surprised to learn that Jameson and Bushmill was owned by the same folks, given the rivalry between the two (I think most of that is the Catholic /Protestant thing). I think I may have answered my own question, along with the great input from you guys. I thinking I will strip, then dilute with back-set and do a spirit run. My last SF I diluted with back set and I think it was the best batch I've made. I also added some rye LME and that may have helped.

BG

[Jimbo]

Most Irish whiskey isn't tripple distilled. Not really. And the "third distillation" is not intended to make taste lighter. They are just as strong in taste as American whiskey.

Sorry Odin, gonna have to raise this one up to the board for review. Every Irish whiskey I know of IS triple distilled. Its really Irish Whiskeys claim to fame, uniqueness, signature, whatever you want to call it. Truly triple distilled with 3 seperate stills, a wash still, feints still and spirits still. And the distillers do claim this is to make a lighter smoother tasting whiskey. As far as taste goes, I dont think they taste as strong as American Whiskeys at all. Jamesons is sweeter than Bushmills for sure, but thats due to the corn they add and other processes nothing to do with triple distillation.

[Boda Getta]

I believe that most are triple distilled, but not all; Cooley, Kilbeggan and possibly others are double distill. Many of the distilleries use pot still while others use a combination of pot stills and column stills.

BG

[Odin]

Hi Jimbo, this is insight info I got from someone from the craft in Ireland. If he is wrong, so am I. It is what I have been told. And I remember reading an article about it, so that pretty much confirmed it for me. I will try to think up where I read that, so it can be part of a broader discussion. Not sure I can, though. Long time ago. Boda Getta: not wanting to trail off topic! Sorry!

Odin.

[Jimbo]

Hi Jimbo, this is insight info I got from someone from the craft in Ireland. If he is wrong, so am I. It is what I have been told. And I remember reading an article about it, so that pretty much confirmed it for me. I will try to think up where I read that, so it can be part of a broader discussion. Not sure I can, though. Long time ago. Boda Getta: not wanting to trail off topic! Sorry!

Odin.

Odin, recognizing that one party or the other is rarely fully correct in a debate I did a little more research on this, and as expected we're both right, or both wrong if your a pessimistic sort LOL. The popular Irish Whiskies, at least in the US, are blends, Bushmills, Jamesons, Tullamore Dew, Paddy are the most popular by a large margin. But there's several others too. These are triple distilled and contain large % unmalted grains, even corn. These are made using blends from both potstills and columns.

There are also 'Potstilled whiskies, Redbreast, Midleton etc. Single pot still whiskeys use partially unmalted barley, and are "generally distilled three times."

Finally there's a bunch of true 'Single Malts' from Ireland. This is where its your turn to be right These are, as name says, 'single malt' whiskies, all malt, and typically distilled twice.

Cheers mate.

[rager]

I love my single malt wheat whiskey and whiskey in general (thanks jimbo)

i did a triple distillation on a barley/wheat . turned out fantastic with plenty of flavor using a pot still. all

what i did was stripping run, pulled fores and a small amount of beginning heads to get them out. then did a semi spirit run as far as how hard i ran it, pulled the beginning heads again . then did a final true spirit run and made my cuts off that. i feel that pulling the early heads on the first two runs helped minimized the heads on the finals because they weren't be run over an over again and smearing with hearts. not sure if this is a common practice but i feel i had really good results and will do the same moving forward.

rager

rager

[SoMo]

You guys are leaving out another important key, used barrels from America on a documentary I saw some prefer wild turkey others beam or jack, depending on availability and such.

[Boda Getta]

This run will go into my 3 gal Gibbs Bros charred keg

BG

[Jimbo]

You guys are leaving out another important key, used barrels from America on a documentary I saw some prefer wild turkey others beam or jack, depending on availability and such.

Yes Irish and Scotch whiskeys use used American Bourbon barrels. Im sure for economics reasons. Not so many oak trees in the UK. Nearest ones in France, and you know how them blokes in the UK feel about the Frenchies.... Our bourbon barrels are often knocked down for shipping and rebuilt into larger 250L 'hogshead' barrels for aging whisky in Scotland

[SoMo]

One even used stainless steel vessels with staves just plunked in like we do a jar of our stuff.

[Jimbo]

Id buy that, just because he's different and trying new things. I wondered abotu that too, on large scale. Bourbon law says no can man, but for a 5 grain triple distilled no ones gonna say what how why where how long to age, or even if you age it. This is simultaneously an old hat craft and a burgeoning new frontier. Perfect, far as Im concerned

[shadylane]

" Single Malt - Triple Distill "

If it's to be consumed young and white, Triple Distill would work.
Guess a lot, depends on what cuts were done on the second and third distillations.

The normal, strip and spirit run, with ageing, works good also.
It's your baby

[SoMo]

They also dilute to 25-27% for spirit runs to get straight casking strength no need to water down before aging, that steps important too.

[Boda Getta]

I plan to handle it basically like my UJ and SF; I will do two hot and fast strips, I will dilute to 65-70 proof with good clean back-set, then a low and slow spirit run, making good conservative cuts. I will char in a 3 gal Gibbs keg until I get the color I want and it smooths out, then in gal glass jugs for 10-12 months.

I did the mash this mornings and everything went very well. I mashed 50 lbs malt at 2 lbs/gal using 16 gals strike water. Settled at 148F for a little over 2 hours, did a iodine test which showed full conversion and used the last 8 gals of cold water plus gal jugs of frozen water to cool. Stired really well, pitched bakers yeast, then used a aquarium air pump and air stone to make sure the yeast got plenty of air. Finished up at 1.065 and working away and smells fantastic.
Thanks to Jimbo for his thread and you other guys who participated in the thread. Got my enzyme kit in yesterday and will do a AG corn next. Between this single malt recipe and the enzymes for corn my sugar head days may be behind me.

BG

[HDNB]

I plan to handle it basically like my UJ and SF; I will do two hot and fast strips, I will dilute to 65-70 proof with good clean back-set, then a low and slow spirit run, making good conservative cuts. I will char in a 3 gal Gibbs keg until I get the color I want and it smooths out, then in gal glass jugs for 10-12 months.

I did the mash this mornings and everything went very well. I mashed 50 lbs malt at 2 lbs/gal using 16 gals strike water. Settled at 148F for a little over 2 hours, did a iodine test which showed full conversion and used the last 8 gals of cold water plus gal jugs of frozen water to cool. Stired really well, pitched bakers yeast, then used a aquarium air pump and air stone to make sure the yeast got plenty of air. Finished up at 1.065 and working away and smells fantastic.
Thanks to Jimbo for his thread and you other guys who participated in the thread. Got my enzyme kit in yesterday and will do a AG corn next. Between this single malt recipe and the enzymes for corn my sugar head days may be behind me.

BG

+111
you are already leaving the commercial brands far behind, kicked into the ditch, with this kind of effort. your single foot will blow away their multi-distilled swill by a country mile!

Cheers BG!

[MichiganCornhusker]

Very nice, Boda, your plan and process look perfect to me. Makes me want to run out and get a sack of malted barley right now. You will love the corn, too. I think you are going to be very happy with your results! Shwing!

[zirtico]

Hey BG:

I find that most scotches tend to be lightly or not peated at all. I know quite a few distilleries dry their malt without peat smoke. Popular scotches like Glenlivet 12 and Glenfiddich 12 have little to no peat flavour, at least not to my palate. In fact, Glenlivet has a lot of apple/pear notes and Glenfiddich has sherry notes which distinguish them from one another. It's mainly the Islay scotches where the peat can be overpowering.

I personally make a lot of my single malt using pale malt extract. Using pure, plain pale malt extract fermented with Safale Ale yeast gives me phenomenal results. I use my oak sticks by toasting to medium plus and then medium char, soaking them in heads for a little while until the heads get REALLY dark and almost black with colour. I double distill my 8% ABV "beer" and make conservative cuts and throw the used oak in. I like to drink my scotch neat or with a single cube of ice and after even just two months on oak, the whisky has an incredible complexity (12 hours in the freezer/12 hours in the furnace room every day, along with a good shaking). For me, I get lots of dried fruit notes, some vanilla, and a little bit of spiciness and for my tastes, its a richer, fuller-bodied whisky than either of the Glens which I really love.

[Stonecutter]

I’m finished with my first AG strip/spirit protocol and it’s definitely a success. The smoothness of the white dog is amazing.
Well now I’m all hooked and will never go back but what has happened is that I’m on this kick about making an epic triple distilled light whiskey.
Mmmm TullyDew.
I’ve revived this thread and decided to post a link that relates to Jimbo and Odins discussion 8 yrs ago

https://coolmaterial.com/food-drink/how ... gets-made/

[squigglefunk]

thanks for that read, I found it interesting! I for one do enjoy Jameson ... definitely lighter, sweeter, more vanilla flavors than american whiskey to me. I use my "new" oak staves once for my "american" style whiskeys then I reused them for my "irish" styles lol.

[jonnys_spirit]

I might try a more full bodied irish style with a mixed grainbill of malted and unmalted barley maybe with up to say 5-10% oats and wheat aged on american used bourbon oak and finished on european (eg; hungarian) Oloroso sherry oak. I have rather enjoyed the few redbreast 12 bottles that I have tried.

Some notes:
https://whiskymag.com/story/all-in-the-mash
https://www.redbreastwhiskey.com/en-en/ ... rmentation
https://whiskipedia.com/fundamentals/ol ... rry-casks/

Cheers!
-j