FLUTE TALK

[Jimbo]

Ok. Flutes do pass flavor, this well known. I'm not judging all 6 plate runs. Just commented on kovals. Sorry if I appeared judgemental.

[Farmboy]

yea, I think you right bentstick. I will enjoy the time saving part, plus I like to build things. and will be nice to pass it down to my 2 boys, they like the idea also. lol thanks to everyone for all the help, hope I don't bug yall to much.

[cranky]

I just finished my flute last week. There were a lot of design constraints on mine which resulted in 4 perf plates 7 inches apart, pretty much permanently that way. After the cleaning and sacrificial runs where I played around a bit I did my first product run. It easily came off at 92% until tails where it only dropped slightly. After blending I took a bottle to the Bearriver BBQ and people were surprised at the amount of flavor that carried over. I also had 25 gallons of apple cider in the garage so I figured what the hell I will run 10 gallons of it through. It was easy to get everything dialed in to pull the apple off at 80%. I am currently letting it rest and am anxious to see how it will compare to the 1.5 run of apple I did in the pot still in January or Feb, but I think it is going to be pretty nice and it was much easier to find and separate the "apple bomb". Since I have it set up as an all glass column I can see virtually everything going on. One thing I found was by adjusting cooling flow and heat input I could load or unload almost any combination of plates. Top only, bottom only, middle 2 or 3 or all 4 but didn't really test to see how loading affected the final product but I found this interesting. I do confess I've lost my place several times while reading this thread but don't recall this being mentioned before. Has anybody else encountered this ability to load different plates? or is this some curious thing with my strange design?

[goose eye]

If the ole boys wont so old they would have liked to mess with a flute.
kinda set in the old ways but aint got fear of new stuff an
how if it makes it better then ole boys all for it.

So I'm tole

[googe]

Never seen that ability cranky, can you elaborate what settings load what plates?. Only time I've seen that sort of action is if there's some flooding, vapor bypass, inefficient plates, to much power etc.

[pulsetech]

I can't do anything other than dry my plates up. Bottom first then the next up and then next up again until they are all dry. They load in the reverse order from top to bottom. Jimbo I run 4 plates for pretty much everything. Even at 90% abv my whiskey has as Much taste as my double run pot stilled did. ( watered down of course)

[thecroweater]

Yeah I'm with googe on this, if it ain't stacking from the top down you got either flooding or some serious entrainment going on. That might be too much reflux to heat or vise versa
Goose eye I would say better but as it ain't going to taste the same it is subjective. Good clean whiskey out of a single run, aging time more than halved. I liked my old pot but I only had to witness one flute run and I was sold lock stock and barrel

[Jimbo]

I only have 2 plates, but its top down for me too as the defleg cloud seeder raining starts.

Goose eye I would say better but as it ain't going to taste the same it is subjective. Good clean whiskey out of a single run, aging time more than halved. I liked my old pot but I only had to witness one flute run and I was sold lock stock and barrel

Different yes. The bourbon Im drinking at the moment is from Feb 2014 from a pot, so I havent got to really put judgement on the first fluted bourbon I did yet But its several months old now and coming into its own. Its nice. But definitely different. Still cant wrap my head around how exactly. Probably take a couple fifths after I move to that lot for my drinking likker.

[cranky]

It's kind of hard to describe and I was just playing around. I know a lot of things about my flute are probably less than ideal but I like it so I'm happy. There is a short video of it running with all the plates loaded here
http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... &start=240
I didn't really record any specifics while running as it was the first few runs but increasing power and reflux at the same time would push everything to the top plate but still return down the pipes leaving only a small amount of liquid on the remaining "dry" plates. None of the plates actually dried up as such but the fluid bed would get shallower or deeper depending on what I did. next time I run it maybe I'll play around and see if % changes based on what I'm doing and how I'm loading things but a 2hr 20min run at 92% and full flavor I think I must have done something right. I was just curious of other peoples observations.

[pulsetech]

Had an interesting idea today. What if in a Stainless steel modular flute you made your plates from PTFE sheet. The plate and seal could be one piece with holes drilled for bubble caps and a down comer. I have recently had trouble with plates sealing and bypassing. I bet this would mean no more bypass or leaking. Just an idea
PTFE sheet is easy to come by.

[Hound Dog]

Had an interesting idea today. What if in a Stainless steel modular flute you made your plates from PTFE sheet. The plate and seal could be one piece with holes drilled for bubble caps and a down comer. I have recently had trouble with plates sealing and bypassing. I bet this would mean no more bypass or leaking. Just an idea
PTFE sheet is easy to come by.

That would probably work well as perforated plates. Seems that sealing bubble cap and downcomer pent rations would be difficult.

[googe]

One company did perf plates like that, must not have been very successful though. I agree it would be hard sealing the cap and downcomer ect. I'd be looking at dual flow type plates using sheet. I've done some testing with sheet and plates on my flap plates and they performed pretty good. Doesn't take much to get any sort of new design plate to work, it just needs to hold some liquid and be able to refine the liquid. Do some tasting and see what you can come up with, good fun .

[pulsetech]

The caps and down comers I use have a nut to secure them and would seal well. They are stainless inside with a copper cap. We have a plastic suppliers close by that do cut to size. I might see if I can get 4 plates cut up.

[Hound Dog]

Go for it! Please post your results so we can learn good or bad. Nothing wrong with an experiment not turning out as thought either. It might be a huge success too. You won't know until you try.

[LWTCS]

If the ole boys wont so old they would have liked to mess with a flute.
kinda set in the old ways but aint got fear of new stuff an
how if it makes it better then ole boys all for it.

So I'm tole

You'd be fine goose. Run just a little bit of water to the reflux condenser and just keep thinkin like a pot stiller.

Truth is, running a pot still requires more awareness in a lot of ways.

goose do you reckon them ole boys has a kettle that might work if they had a flute available?

[Snackson]

Browsed this entire thread over the weekend, mainly looking for pictures and skimming through the reading. Once I have more time I will actually read it all. It got me very interested and I started doing some research. I think a bubble cap flute is in my future. Not immediate but I think I will slowly start gathering parts here and there. Thanks to OD, KS and all the others who have posted in here for the inspiration!

[pulsetech]

The caps and down comers I use have a nut to secure them and would seal well. They are stainless inside with a copper cap. We have a plastic suppliers close by that do cut to size. I might see if I can get 4 plates cut up.

Ordered the Plates cut to 119mm OD . all i will need to do is make the 5 holes for my caps and down comer in each one. should be able to test this time next week.
total cost is $20 including post not that this is about saving money. $5 a plate seems good to me seeing they wont need a seal

If it works well with caps i might try a set Drilled as Perf plates. i have not run perfs so that might be interesting also.

I have plenty of copper mesh above mt RC and Below my plates so i am not to worried about losing a little copper. My caps are copper also

[raketemensch]

The caps and down comers I use have a nut to secure them and would seal well. They are stainless inside with a copper cap. We have a plastic suppliers close by that do cut to size. I might see if I can get 4 plates cut up.

Ordered the Plates cut to 119mm OD . all i will need to do is make the 5 holes for my caps and down comer in each one. should be able to test this time next week.
total cost is $20 including post not that this is about saving money. $5 a plate seems good to me seeing they wont need a seal

If it works well with caps i might try a set Drilled as Perf plates. i have not run perfs so that might be interesting also.

I have plenty of copper mesh above mt RC and Below my plates so i am not to worried about losing a little copper. My caps are copper also

I'm really interested in seeing where this goes, especially with the perf plates.

[raketemensch]

I'm looking into building a flute over the Winter (getting some 4" with my Christmas bonus), but I'm not looking forward to building and installing sight glasses.

I'm planning to do the threaded stainless plate tree method, starting with only 3 plates.

Now, most of the posts that I've seen about "are the sight glasses really necessary" generally come back with something like, "They're great for getting used to running the still, then just eye candy afterwards." So the value is in knowing when the plates are loaded, correct?

So, after reading about the rivet-based valve plates, I was thinking about using perf plates, but adding one or two rivets to each of them. This way you would have auditory signals of when the plate is loaded...

Thoughts? Other than "just do sight glasses, they're cool?"

[pulsetech]

The bottom glass is invaluable in seeing the tails before they arrive at the parrot. At first sign of any fog in the bottom glass I switch to smaller cut jars.

[Euphoria]

The bottom glass is invaluable in seeing the tails before they arrive at the parrot. At first sign of any fog in the bottom glass I switch to smaller cut jars.

I too, like having the bottom glass for the same reason. Since I'm also fairly new to using my MIle Hi flute still, I find it to be a helpful aid in making that same determination. And, it's also cool to watch the action-just a side benefit. Beats watching TV!

[goose eye]

Reckon the ole boys could make one but hate to say it but
they ain't got that kinda money that been thrown around.
Heckif you can't run from it then you to partial to it an that
much money ole boys would probably think twice. Ha ha

It's amazing how far y'all have pushed this sport. Never would of
dreamed it play in in the branch while suppose to be work in
So I'm tole

[ufo8mycow]

I am building a 4" flute and am starting with the dephlegmator. I am trying to figure out the best way and have come up with an idea that I dont think I have seen before and I want to bounce it off the flute gods.

A little background I am running a 16 gallon keg with 5500 watt element and an ssr controller and am building a 4"x30" flute with 5 perforated plates and am runnign off city water so the temp will be constant.

I know that one of the issues with a flute is sizing the dephlegmator to be big enough for full reflux and yet not be so big that it is hard to control when you are trying to take product. so my idea sis a dual dephlegmator. A standard shotgun style for total reflux and an additional coiled condenser just below that to use when you are taking product. so that when you are ready to start taking product you will valve off the shotgun and use only the coil. I know than after shutting off the shotgun it will still take some time for all of that water to heat up but after it does I think it will be easily controlled with the coil.

I am thinking of using 3/8 soft copper to make the coil but I need to figure out how many feet I will need.

[pulsetech]

If it was me I would go one of two ways. 1 just build it standard with a shotgun and use a flow meter and needle valve.
2. Build it without a shotgun. Take a look at the CCVM . Use the coil to control your takeoff by moving it up or down.look here http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... =1&t=53006
The flow meter really does make the water control less fiddly because you can see where your at instead of moving the valve 1/16 of a turn and waiting to see the change in output

[pulsetech]

The caps and down comers I use have a nut to secure them and would seal well. They are stainless inside with a copper cap. We have a plastic suppliers close by that do cut to size. I might see if I can get 4 plates cut up.

Ordered the Plates cut to 119mm OD . all i will need to do is make the 5 holes for my caps and down comer in each one. should be able to test this time next week.
total cost is $20 including post not that this is about saving money. $5 a plate seems good to me seeing they wont need a seal

If it works well with caps i might try a set Drilled as Perf plates. i have not run perfs so that might be interesting also.

I have plenty of copper mesh above mt RC and Below my plates so i am not to worried about losing a little copper. My caps are copper also

I'm really interested in seeing where this goes, especially with the perf plates.

I have decided to go with Perf plates first. Should be up and running next weekend I Will post pics as I go

[cranky]

ufo8mycow,
I did this

Which is essentially a Dimroth made from CSST (Dad300 style) as a reflux condenser and have no problems controlling it or getting full reflux and don't have any problem with having to wait to see what adjustments do, Once product starts to flow adjustments are pretty much instantly noticeable.

[Kegg_jam]

I've just test run my CCVM over 3 plates. stayed pretty constant at 88%.

Only problem was it stopped producing at around 78% and I couldn't squeeze anymore out. Would have liked to take out more tails. Thinking on doing a csst deflag that I can shut off and run in pot still mode.

[pulsetech]

I've just test run my CCVM over 3 plates. stayed pretty constant at 88%.

Only problem was it stopped producing at around 78% and I couldn't squeeze anymore out. Would have liked to take out more tails. Thinking on doing a csst deflag that I can shut off and run in pot still mode.

Couldn't you just kill the water to your coil ?

[Kegg_jam]

Not on a CCVM. Not capped.

[pulsetech]

oh yeah of course don't know why that penny didn't drop. really means that it rules out pot sill mode.

Maybe a CSST Coil based Dephlag is a better solution than CCVM. it would be an easy build for most.
with my flute once i hit tails around 80% abv on a 45L charge i normally only get around 200mls - 250mls of tails down to 20%abv
you probably didn't loose much Ethanol but you would loose some good stuff especially on a rum wash