How much are you shootin in your thumper?

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How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Runamuckr » Mon May 21, 2018 4:51 am

Those that shoot the thumper, what "volume" are you shootin?
Are we talkin 2 ounces, a pint, one whole can of frozen concentrate??

I'd like to go the chamber route, valve under a 2X12 inch stainless spool. I can fit a bit over a pint of liquid in the spool. My plan is to flavor a pint of 40 proof clear, heat, fill, cap, open valve at desired point during run, close after shot, and carry on. Not much different then the 2 valve pipe system posted on here (don't remember exactly who) just on a bigger scale to hold a bigger shot. I like the idea of the chamber to keep vapors contained. Don't care what gets trapped in the chamber, just tryin to keep it isolated from the open flame.

Is a pint to much? If I recall the valved pipe was 3/4 inch copper, don't recall the length of the chamber, but couldn't of held more then an ounce or two.
Aside from the obvious, is there such thing as shootin to much liquid?
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Wild Bill » Mon May 21, 2018 5:28 am

I was going to do similar and saw pintoshine posted about the dual valve config. In the end I decided to employ the kiss method. Cut heat pull relief on boiler to vent pressure and pull big ass cork on top of thump head tee and shoot. I used 4 cans of frozen concentrate apple for a 5 gallon run. I ran off fores and heads before shooting. Works great ! My amounts were based off jednecks advice in clear apple pie thread.
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby kindsun » Mon May 21, 2018 6:04 am

If I may ask, what is "shooting" a thumper?
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Wild Bill » Mon May 21, 2018 7:02 am

Making an addittion to the contents of thumper during the run to add a desired flavor profile. Usually done after fores and heads have been run off so as not to waste the addition on those portions of the run.


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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby kindsun » Mon May 21, 2018 5:26 pm

Thanks!
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby pfshine » Mon May 21, 2018 9:05 pm

I made one a while back, might be the one you're talking about. It worked great never had a problem with it. It was made for a smaller 6 gallon still and 3gal thumper. I made it 3/4" with several Chambers so I didn't disturb the boil much at all and could shoot it multiple times throughout the run. This allowed for even flavoring throughout the run and even changing flavor mid run. The stuff in the chambers was concentrated stuff so it doesn't need much space.
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Wild Bill » Tue May 22, 2018 4:10 am

Yes it probably was you Pfshine. My apologies for the wrong acknowledgement. I may still build something similar if I get into more flavored concoctions.
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Runamuckr » Tue May 22, 2018 5:15 am

Yes Pfshine, thats exactlywhat I was referring to.
You don't cut off your heat befor opening valves correct?

My thought is to have something highly concentrated by flavoring a pint of spirit. Could try less if the flavor is right. With the valve and a cap(tri-clamp) at top of pipe, I can hit it again if needed. I'd like to avoid opening the system, cutting the flame, eliminate the potential for steam burns.
With such emphasis on steam coming out of the condenser being bad juju, I'd like to keep a closed system.
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby pfshine » Tue May 22, 2018 8:43 am

Runamuckr wrote:Yes Pfshine, thats exactlywhat I was referring to.
You don't cut off your heat befor opening valves correct?


No need to kill the heat because no vapor escapes the airlock.
I would caution against using spirits in the closed chamber for any length of time for fear of over pressure from it boiling in the tube. Water based would not have this problem as it would not be hot enough to boil. If you do want to use a spirit for shooting it I would say do it fast. Open top valve, fill, close top valve, open bottom valve.
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby OtisT » Tue May 22, 2018 1:39 pm

Thanks all. The timing of this post is great for me. :-)

I just finished my new thumper head with a vapor bypass. Luckily I had not cleaned it yet. After reading this thread I decided to cut up my new thumper head and add a way to add liquid during the run. Great idea guys. I just finished my re-work. :-)

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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Kareltje » Tue May 22, 2018 3:59 pm

Nice contraptions!
But when one wants to shoot more voluminous things, like a pound of berries? Or 5 pounds?
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby OtisT » Tue May 22, 2018 7:55 pm

Kareltje wrote:Nice contraptions!
But when one wants to shoot more voluminous things, like a pound of berries? Or 5 pounds?


Bananas! :-).

Ya, it doesn’t do everything. I will eventually get around to welding a clean out ferrule on my thumper. Until then, just liquids for me. :-)
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby pfshine » Tue May 22, 2018 8:25 pm

Kareltje wrote:Nice contraptions!
But when one wants to shoot more voluminous things, like a pound of berries? Or 5 pounds?


For that much I would just use a gin basket.
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Kareltje » Wed May 23, 2018 2:32 pm

pfshine wrote:
Kareltje wrote:Nice contraptions!
But when one wants to shoot more voluminous things, like a pound of berries? Or 5 pounds?


For that much I would just use a gin basket.

Yeah, but isn't the point of shooting a thumper to get rid of the foreshots and the heads before you add the tastefull ingredients? When using a ginbox the first taste of the ingredients is thrown away with the foreshots.

With large amounts one could make a valve system: vent the first vapours and after the foreshots and heads are vented (not into free air, of course, but condensed and trown away) , direct the other vapours through the ginbox or thumper.
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Runamuckr » Wed May 23, 2018 2:51 pm

Thanks Pf.

I intend to keep what ever I'm adding warm and filling the chamber when I'm ready to shoot it.
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Runamuckr » Wed May 23, 2018 4:18 pm

Wild Bill,

4 Cans of concentrate, it takes that much to get a good apple flavor?
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Wild Bill » Wed May 23, 2018 8:27 pm

Everybody’s taste is a bit different but yes 4 cans seems about right along with apple pie spice and a gallon of water heated up before shooting.
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby pfshine » Thu May 24, 2018 5:50 am

It's relative. I haven't used apple juice concentrate but imagine that 4 cans of the stuff would be way too much for say a 2-3 gallon thumper but not a 15 gallon one.
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Runamuckr » Mon Jun 11, 2018 3:14 pm

Anybody used the concentrated "extract" stuff, like for baking??
Does the "alcohol" ingredients boil off? Bad taste?
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Jimy Dee » Sun Jul 08, 2018 12:25 pm

As a pot and thumper man myself, I never shot anything into the thumper. are there any tried & true style "recipes" for shooting the thumper?
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Runamuckr » Sat Apr 06, 2019 2:08 am

Just to do some updating on this subject.....


What I've tried:

Concentrate juices: charged at beginning of run

Apple, as we know, works out pretty well.
Peach works well, but doesn't seem to stick around long. Drink fast :crazy:
Cucumber. Yes cucumber. Juiced. works well, but takes a lot.
Kiwi juice. Yup. works like peach juice.

Macerations: both charged at beginning and shot.

Buterschotch candy. Slowly disappears, but damn good.
various candies all work, take a good amount, but don't hang around long. Again, drink fast.
Fruits made to into syrups work well.


Injections:

Still playing with these, but the extractions for baking seem promising.
small amounts mixed with sprits and injected seem to be an art. I'll update as I perfect it :mrgreen:
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby OtisT » Sun Apr 07, 2019 12:01 pm

I’m not familiar with the term Injecting? Is that shooting the thumper mid run, just as hearts start coming? Something else?

Tell me more about your butterscotch spirit. How much, how you made it, etc.

I was just looking at extracts at the local spice shop and Butterscotch was one. I love butterscotch. If candy works, the extract should work too but it would not be sweetened like the candy is. What spirit did you use for this one? When looking at those extracts I was thinking about back flavoring a spirit, not distilling with it.

Distiller Dresden was making some rums with extracts and backsweetened. Hazelnut was one, and some others. I will say they smelled absolutely wonderful. The taste was unique and I’m kind of on the fence on the taste aspect. They were not as sweet tasting as they smelled and I was thinking that the taste of those should match the smell, so if your going to sweeten it a little you may as well add more sugar and make it a damn sweet cordial. ( In addition to drinking I have a sweet tooth too.)

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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Allmyexsliveinhell » Sun Apr 07, 2019 2:53 pm

Some of those amoretti brand concentrates would probably be great for this purpose.
https://amoretti.com/products/blood-orange-craft-puree
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Runamuckr » Sun Apr 07, 2019 5:40 pm

Hi Otis.

Yes by injecting I meant shooting my thumper.

All this experimenting was done using UJSSM with corn as the grain. I also sour mash for 7 generations before starting over with fresh grains, but I do replace spent grains along the way and I use roughly 12 ounces of backset in each new ferment. I strip with a pot still and I do pull a pint or two of hearts from my stripping runs for my personal use. The rest is saved for a spirit run. I do 6 gallon ferments, and charge the boiler with 5 gallons of stripped product cut to roughly 30% for spirit runs. Thumper is always used on the spirit run and of course for the following experimentations. My fients from spirit runs get saved for one last run. The hearts from that last run is what I use for macerations, candy, fruit and so on. The fients from that final run are never put back in my boiler. Its evident that they are highly concentrated heads and tails, so I see no need to continue running them. They make it to the fire pit, lawnmower, carb cleaner, and anything else I see fit.

That said, lets get to it.

Regarding the candy....

Aside from butterscotch, I've used several others, peppermint, various jolly rancher candies, any type of hard candy that was individually wrapped. I used the same process regardless of flavor. Here are my notes:

4 pints 90 proof clean hearts.
Each pint get 6 pieces of candy, let dissolve, shake/stir at random. I usually let sit a week or so, no real reason, that's just how it happens to work out.
I charge my thumper with those 4 pints and 4 pints or water at the beginning of the run. I like to start with a gallon in my thumper. Gets me about 3 inches up on my spear and leaves plenty of room for fill. Run as usual.

Results:

Cuts are easier after a day of airing 24 hours, at least for me. Strong smell of candy, fills the nose quite nicely. Some heads/tails will reveal themselves few days later so I don't actually do any blending for about a week.
Flavor is subtle, sweet but not over powering, and lingers in the mouth a bit. After I've blended, I dilute some to 80 proof and some to 40 proof. Both will loose the subtle taste over time, the nose will slowly weaken as well but over a longer period of time. Longest I've kept a jar on the shelf is 5 weeks. While its easy to tell what flavor it is with a sniff, I felt I really had to search to taste it on the pallet.
This applies to any "candy" I have tried. Peppermint and cinnamon hang around longer and seem a bit stronger up front.
I haven't played much with adding more or less candy. I typically make these when I know it will be drank quick.
Macerating fruit ala panty dropper style yielded slightly better results IMO, bit stronger, never kept any past three weeks but was hanging on well at that point.

What I'm doing with extracts and my notes thus far:

I've currently only used 3 flavors. Peach, lemon, and blueberry. My extracts are from a company called olive nation and list alcohol,water, and natural fruit extract as the only ingredients.
Adding them to spirits, seems to give an off aroma and taste. Almost chemical like. I don't care for that method, though I'll play with that again in the future. My only guess is the alcohol in the ingredients. Heres why I say that....

Fores and heads!

When I add the extracts to the thumper at the beginning of the run, my fores are more pungent so to say, as are my heads. However the whole process smells heavenly while distilling. :mrgreen: Not saying I get "more" fores/heads, just more foresy/headsy.

For this I add 1 ounce of extract to a pint of the same 90 proof spirit I use for maceration, I charge with 4 pints spirit extract mix and 4 pints of water.
Same process for cuts apply from using candies. Bit harder to cut right off still, for me, but easier after airing. Again, heads and tails seem to show up after a few days in the first and last jars of what I kept as hearts initially. With the extracts, I find myself keeping a bit deeper into tails as theres some good flavor there. Its more on the nose aroma then on the pallet flavor, but it does linger on the tongue a bit.
Still some playing to do with this regarding amount, airing, blending. But it seems promising.

I've shot extracts mixed with spirit(1 ounce extract in 1 pint spirit) into the thumper as I was coming to the end of my heads. Thumper charged with 30% low wines at beginning of run. Havent shot straight extract yet.
I may be tainted with the chemical taste from my trials adding extracts to final product, but I can detect the chemical almost instantly after I've shot it, though it disappears quickly, and more so with some airing. So far this seems to yield a slightly stronger flavor, both on the pallet and nose. But also seems to be showing the same rate of disappearance over time. I've only done 4 runs using the shooting method to date, so more to do on this.

Something worth mentioning that seemed interesting.

My fients jugs from these runs. Heads/tails combined. I've made all fients runs with straight water in my thumper. Keeping flavors separate, and candy, extracts, and fruit juice separate. The extracts seemed completely undetectable after a fients run charging the thumper with water. Even though the jug had aroma and taste before dumping it in the boiler. The candy and fruit, while obviously weaker after thumping through water, still carried a bit of aroma after the fients runs. Minimal taste on the pallet. Not too surprised as I've cleaned up some really nasty stuff with my thumper charged with water. Just found it odd that it removed the extract, but candy and fruit still tag along to the jar.

As with everything on here, your mileage may vary. I'd be interested in hear how your trials go with any of this.
Feel free to ask any questions, I'll do my best to answer promptly and completely.

PS. I haven't run any of this using the dimroth setup. All this was done with my liebig. If it matters.

Forgot to mention. My goal is to keep everything white. I don't oak or age on/in anything other then clear glass jugs.
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Allmyexsliveinhell » Sun Apr 07, 2019 6:37 pm

Now I'm gonna have to modify my thump keg. Guess I like the large cork idea. If I wanted to switch to valves I could upgrade over time.

I'm moving this week though so I guess I'll have to wait. Gives me time.to think I guess though I'd rather be modifying and thumping along.
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby goose eye » Tue Apr 09, 2019 10:30 am

Now you know the ole boys
secret . you decide where them path leads.

you reckon any good likker was made a while back?


So I'm tole
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby LWTCS » Tue Apr 09, 2019 11:02 am

goose eye wrote:Now you know the ole boys
secret . you decide where them path leads.

you reckon any good likker was made a while back?


So I'm tole


goose do you reckon the ole boys would charge the thumper with anything at all prior to shootin? My thoughts are to prevent any off flavors in the heads cut getting left behind prior to the addition of the flavor shot.
So basically run vapor through the thumper as dry as possible to allow as much heads as possible to make its way to the worm, then "shoot" enough preheated charge to cover the vapor inlet.
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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby goose eye » Tue Apr 09, 2019 12:30 pm

Lwtcs you gotta remember the ole boys was doin what was frowned on hear back when it won't kool.
It all depends on the fruit or grain. Some hide some don't.
Of them that don't time an air help some .
Now if you had a bonded outfit then yes ole boys would squeeze it down best they could . time is money an at some point is that deminishin returns. You ain't gonna get it all an everybody off flavers ain't the same.
Now this is just the ole boys opinion on bygone days on makein christmas.

I ain't never made no likker
An ain't gonna in the future.

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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby OtisT » Tue Apr 09, 2019 2:33 pm

Thanks runamucker for all the details on your candy runs. :thumbup:

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Re: How much are you shootin in your thumper?

Postby Runamuckr » Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:59 am

No problem Otis.
Id like to hear your findings should you try it.
Any adjustments, additions, etc.

Goose, sadly, I aint had anything from a while back, but I imagine it was a fine drop.
I ever get a hole big enough in my thump to get my hand in for cleanin, I'll be playin with some fruit, whole, mashed, puree, might even have a go at some veggies to.
I'd like to keep some around long enough to see what happens as it sits. I've read some fruits seem to drop off and then return after time.

LWTCS

I haven't tried a dry thumper at startup yet. Anything coming from the boiler will condense in the thumper until brought back up to its boiling point and all equalizes, at which point your fores then heads will make its way to your worm. you'll be pushing hearts to your thumper before your fores start to drip. Not sure theres any way to avoid it without some serious equipment. If you looked into your thumper as soon as your fores began to drip, I'd be willing to bet theres a good gallon or so of liquid in your empty thumper. You'd have to have your thumper, and any piping in the output path at the same temperature as your steam in order to prevent it from condensing. I'm guessing you have no problem pullin your fores and heads when running a normal pot still. The thumper is just a second pot still that uses the vapor from your pot as its heating source. I find it just as easy to get the same results with a thumper as with a pot still when it comes to cuts. It just drives a bit differently. Don't rush the thumper coming on line or you'll smear it all together. I drip my fores as slow as possible. While my heads are dripping I'll gently/slowly increase my drip to a fine stream and have it dialed in before my heads are done. After that I don't touch the flame unless I want to push my tails to speed things up a bit at the end of the run. I run my pot just like this on my stripping runs also. Any time I shoot my thumper, I'm into my hearts, 100-150 mL at least.
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