Adding juice to a running ferment

Information about fruit/vegetable type washes.

Moderator: Site Moderator

Post Reply
NormandieStill
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 1737
Joined: Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:17 pm
Location: Northwest France

Adding juice to a running ferment

Post by NormandieStill »

So... started pressing apples this morning. With three of us, we managed to crush and load up around 100kg of apples. The juice is coming off at 1.048 and will be fermented with a champagne yeast to get it as close to dry as possible. The problem is how long it takes to press. We got a pretty good amount of juice off just while loading up the press (About 20L all in) and then by pressing a little got up to around 45L. Since then, I've been ratcheting up the pressure about once every hour or so but I suspect we're now into the realm of diminishing returns. I'm going to keep going until this evening and keep an eye on what comes off to see if it's worth the time and effort.

So all good, except that's about half the apples, and my little "press gang" won't be available until next weekend. Either I drop in some campden and hold out for a week (which for obvious reasons, I really don't want to do), or I start the ferment today on the ~55L of juice, and then top it up next week when we press the rest.

We'll be adding juice to a running ferment which is obviously going to bring some oxygen with it, but given an active fermentation I don't see any obvious risk to the ferment.

I would just split it, but I have one 120L fermenter and no easy way of splitting the ferment out (without tying up a bunch of buckets and a lot of floor space for a few months).

What sayeth the hive mind?
"I have a potstill that smears like a fresh plowed coon on the highway" - Jimbo

A little spoon feeding *For New & Novice Distillers
User avatar
higgins
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 415
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2020 5:16 am
Location: US Southern Appalachia

Re: Adding juice to a running ferment

Post by higgins »

By adding juice to an active fermentation you would be doing the same thing that many mead makers do ... incremental feeding. They sometimes start with a lower gravity must and add more honey periodically so that they don't have to pitch into a high gravity must and stress out the yeast. Some also use incremental nutrient additions to ensure the yeast don't run out of nutrients.

I pressed apples last Friday with 3 friends and got about 15 gal (56L) juice. Mine was also at 1.048. This isn't enough for my purposes, and I don't have access to more apples, so I will be purchasing some 20-25 gallons (75-95L) of juice from a local cidery owned by an acquaintance. I'd rather have more apples and do it myself, but at $4.25 per gallon it isn't too bad.

I went ahead and fermented my 15 gallons, and it is just about done (9 days after pitching). I'll go ahead and strip that, then when I get the remaining juice (probably 18 Oct) I'll ferment that out and do 2 more strips, combining the 3 strips for a spirit run.

In your situation I would go ahead and ferment what you have, then wait an extra week or two before pressing again to give you time to process the first ferment (rack to carboys/buckets, strip, etc) and do the second ferment. But if you have to do it next weekend I wouldn't hesitate to add juice to an active fermentation.
NormandieStill
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 1737
Joined: Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:17 pm
Location: Northwest France

Re: Adding juice to a running ferment

Post by NormandieStill »

Thanks for the input. I did think about processing it quickly, but ideally I'd like to leave the yeast to clean up for a while (Calvados normally spends up to 6 months as cider before hitting the still. Wasn't planning on waiting that long, but I'd like to not hurry things too much).

That said one of the guys is enthusiastic about stripping the first batch and running a second ferment. With a little effort, free apples are easily had around here.
"I have a potstill that smears like a fresh plowed coon on the highway" - Jimbo

A little spoon feeding *For New & Novice Distillers
User avatar
subbrew
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 1275
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2021 1:40 pm
Location: West of the Mississippi

Re: Adding juice to a running ferment

Post by subbrew »

I didn't wait a week but last your I did press and start my cider on a saturday. I finished pressing on either Monday and Tuesday or Tuesday and Wednesday and added that juice to the existing ferment. I had not problems or off tastes I noticed. I let it sit for a couple of months before stripping and then another month before the spirit run. Give it another couple of years and I will let you know if it is any good.
User avatar
Saltbush Bill
Site Mod
Posts: 9675
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 2:13 am
Location: Northern NSW Australia

Re: Adding juice to a running ferment

Post by Saltbush Bill »

NormandieStill wrote: Sun Oct 02, 2022 5:05 am What sayeth the hive mind?
I say there is no reason at all that it wont work.
By the time you add the second lot of juice there should be a great population of active and hungry yeast ready to chomp into any sugars they can get.
User avatar
Demy
Master of Distillation
Posts: 3084
Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2020 1:45 pm

Re: Adding juice to a running ferment

Post by Demy »

Add the juice quietly, no problem. The champagne yeast (usually bayanus) is good but sometimes I have obtained excellent results with spontaneous yeast or with bread yeast that leave some sugar and more aromas. I generally ferment whole fruit, the peel contains a lot of aroma. A tip I can do is: leave some peel aside (cut it very thin) and dehydrate it, then dip it in the finished product for a couple of days ... make a test jar and then tell me the result ....
NormandieStill
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 1737
Joined: Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:17 pm
Location: Northwest France

Re: Adding juice to a running ferment

Post by NormandieStill »

Demy wrote: Mon Oct 03, 2022 12:44 am A tip I can do is: leave some peel aside (cut it very thin) and dehydrate it, then dip it in the finished product for a couple of days ... make a test jar and then tell me the result ....
Interesting idea. Thanks. I was planning on making some with conservative cuts for drinking white (going to be a very interesting balancing act I know). Might be cool to infuse a little of the peel into the white to force in some more appley goodness.

Ferment launched. Just need to see if the starter I made (which was fizzing furiously before pitching) has enough oomph to get going ahead of the wild yeast. Added a little DAP to compensate the nitrogen deficiency which is used to make cidre bouché. Really hoping to get this to ferment dry, even if it takes a while.
"I have a potstill that smears like a fresh plowed coon on the highway" - Jimbo

A little spoon feeding *For New & Novice Distillers
User avatar
Demy
Master of Distillation
Posts: 3084
Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2020 1:45 pm

Re: Adding juice to a running ferment

Post by Demy »

It will be fine, I never worry about wild yeasts, I have often used them to ferment the juice.
Post Reply