SPP Packing

[kiwipete]

I use these:

the mesh is pretty wide to ensure that vapour flow is not restricted...

[bitter]

After playing today with SPP definitely wonder why I did not do it 10 years ago.

steady 172.3 to 172.4F and 3.2 LPH right from about 10% TSFFV I think I can run faster but just learning to drive.. and higher percentage boiler charge will up numbers too.

B

[Matt64]

I am looking to try stainless SPP in my 64mm internal diameter copper column. Column height is 2.8 metres.

I found this supplier in the UK:
https://do-it-at-home.co.uk/en/distilla ... 22358.html

Dimension of one spring is approx: 10/3 mm

Any comments on the SPP size? Is it too small?

It will be supported by https://do-it-at-home.co.uk/en/distilla ... 10801.html

[Bushman]

I have not used SPP packing but have read different sizes for different diameter columns. If you have a way to prevent them from falling through to the boiler I think you will be fine.

[Salt Must Flow]

I am looking to try stainless SPP in my 64mm internal diameter copper column. Column height is 2.8 metres.

I found this supplier in the UK:
https://do-it-at-home.co.uk/en/distilla ... 22358.html

Dimension of one spring is approx: 10/3 mm

Any comments on the SPP size? Is it too small?

It will be supported by https://do-it-at-home.co.uk/en/distilla ... 10801.html

That kinked wire pad will work fine for keeping the SPP from passing through it, but that pad still needs supported by something beneath that will NOT restrict the falling reflux and cause the column to flood. If you go back a couple pages here you'll see many good recommendations for this. Copper mesh works great to support the packing too.

As far as SPP size goes, below are the most common recommendations:
SPP diameter = 1/10th to 1/12the the diameter of the column.
SPP length = 1/10th to 1/12the the diameter of the column.
SPP wire diameter = 1/10th to 1/12th the diameter of the SPP.

Now I've also read somewhere that SPP length should be no longer than 150% of the diameter of the SPP. I'm not sure if the length is quite as critical as the other dimensions.

I previously corresponded with a Russian SPP maker and they use a smaller dia wire with their larger SPP and that forces the user to run at a significantly higher power than if they used the typical recommended size. Smaller wire provides less mass and a more open SPP = more power required they said.

[Matt64]

Thanks for the info. On that basis of a 64mm ID column, the 10/3 mm is slightly too long and slightly too small on the the diameter. It is what I can obtain in the UK though, so I guess that I will have to try it to see.

[bitter]

For those looking for SPP in north America my buddy is selling some as he makes it. He made mine and super happy with it. I posted in classified details.

[Salt Must Flow]

For those looking for SPP in north America my buddy is selling some as he makes it. He made mine and super happy with it. I posted in classified details.

I saw that link, thanks. I wish he listed the specifications for the SPP he makes.

[bitter]

For those looking for SPP in north America my buddy is selling some as he makes it. He made mine and super happy with it. I posted in classified details.

I saw that link, thanks. I wish he listed the specifications for the SPP he makes.

SPP is about 6.5mm and 2x the length of the diameter

[bunny]

He needs to do a little more work on his ad.
Is that $100 Canadian or US/liter?
Will he ship to the states or just Canada?

[champagneave]

Thanks all for your tips on the ads content requirements.

[bitter]

He needs to do a little more work on his ad.
Is that $100 Canadian or US/liter?
Will he ship to the states or just Canada?

100 CAD per liter plus shipping. And I believe he will ship to USA

B

[30xs]

I checked with Manu and he has it available $43 per liter. Size seems a little small for 3”. 2.4mm diameter, 2-3mm length, 0.025 wire size.

[bunny]

He needs to do a little more work on his ad.
Is that $100 Canadian or US/liter?
Will he ship to the states or just Canada?

100 CAD per liter plus shipping. And I believe he will ship to USA

B

Say Bitter, did you ever find time to try to determine the HETP of this stuff?

It looks really good.
Maybe a little long by some peoples standards.
It should scale well.
Any thoughts on other sizes?
Since it appears he may be the only source at this time, I'm sure others may be interested.

I personally have a lifetime supply of micro SPP. (manu's)

[TwoSheds]

I checked with Manu and he has it available $43 per liter. Size seems a little small for 3”. 2.4mm diameter, 2-3mm length, 0.025 wire size.

I talked with Manu a while ago too and his price is good, but shipped to the US it's about the same $100/liter. Maybe shipping has gotten better. Even combining an order didn't seem to save a lot on shipping, but if someone arranges a bulk buy I'd be interested.

Otherwise I'm starting to consider making my own.

[elbono]

I checked with Manu and he has it available $43 per liter. Size seems a little small for 3”. 2.4mm diameter, 2-3mm length, 0.025 wire size.

I talked with Manu a while ago too and his price is good, but shipped to the US it's about the same $100/liter. Maybe shipping has gotten better. Even combining an order didn't seem to save a lot on shipping, but if someone arranges a bulk buy I'd be interested.

Otherwise I'm starting to consider making my own.

I'm in the same boat. When do checked (back in April) he said ocean frieght would be the cheapest but was having issues, I assumed COVID related.

I would definitely be interested in a bulk buy, even considered doing one by myself and selling on ebay. I have a 2" column so his size seems good for me.

Making some is on the some day list, may be a few years before it makes it to the top.

[bitter]

Say Bitter, did you ever find time to try to determine the HETP of this stuff?
...
Any thoughts on other sizes?

I never checked the HETP but with 51" in a 3" Boka I can hit about 97% I say that as I don't have a lab grade alcoholmeter to be sure. that was running at 3.2 LPH in the 3" Boka with 20% in boiler at the time. Running slower did not matter.. I could hit same number running much faster but required more increase power as things went and my condenser is small and with SPP need to run higher power condenser coil. Once I get my coil replaced and do cleaning runs I will try to play maybe around Christmas.

I am going to do some making pure whiskey so that will be super interesting also to see how clean a whiskey wash/or mash is coming out. 97% whiskey lol anyone ... I will cut to about 55% for aging as I like the additional sweetness that comes through from the toasted white oak... and also less water to get to the 46% that typically is my sweet spot for flavor and allowing a little water to open things up nice.

Ian Smiley is local maybe pick his brain..

B

[Hebden]

Hi all,

Please can someone help calculate SPP volume on actual experience rather than theoretical.

I have calculated 5.57L using an online calculator, but that is actual volume, SPP will not fill every gap and I do not necessarily understand how the seller calculates volume.
Wouldn't be a massive issue if it didn't need importing from abroad, but unfortunately, it does.

I wonder if anyones practicl experience says you need more or less than the liquid equivelant with SPP?

Spec:-
Specification is 3" column (71.2mm internal) x 1400mm height
SPP = 4.2mm x 4.2mm x 0.25mm

[RC Al]

Without specifying the seller, your only going to get conjecture, it would depend on how much the individual seller shakes and the diameter of the measurement jug when packing. A frugal seller would use a narrow cylinder and you would get "just" enough, one who hasnt thought it through using a wide jug would be sending a tiny fraction more.

Look for reviews of the seller, if their volume is off, people would winge somewhere.

Maybe contact the seller and ask or just grab 6l and hope your ok (i recon so).

[Salt Must Flow]

Hi all,

Please can someone help calculate SPP volume on actual experience rather than theoretical.

I have calculated 5.57L using an online calculator, but that is actual volume, SPP will not fill every gap and I do not necessarily understand how the seller calculates volume.
Wouldn't be a massive issue if it didn't need importing from abroad, but unfortunately, it does.

I wonder if anyones practicl experience says you need more or less than the liquid equivelant with SPP?

Spec:-
Specification is 3" column (71.2mm internal) x 1400mm height
SPP = 4.2mm x 4.2mm x 0.25mm

Generally speaking, volume is volume. As mentioned previously, the actual volume depends on just how settled the SPP is. With all of the random packings I've used, the volume doesn't drastically change after shaking/settling it in. Just get a little bit more than you think you'll need.

One claimed benefit to using SPP, they say the column doesn't have to be as tall due to its efficiency in comparison to other packings which require a taller column. If that's a fact then you shouldn't need as tall of a column that you have or as much SPP to fill it.

[Hebden]

Generally speaking...

Thanks Salt, appreciated.

[bunny]

Hi all,

Please can someone help calculate SPP volume on actual experience rather than theoretical.

I have calculated 5.57L using an online calculator, but that is actual volume, SPP will not fill every gap and I do not necessarily understand how the seller calculates volume.
Wouldn't be a massive issue if it didn't need importing from abroad, but unfortunately, it does.

I wonder if anyones practicl experience says you need more or less than the liquid equivelant with SPP?

Spec:-
Specification is 3" column (71.2mm internal) x 1400mm height
SPP = 4.2mm x 4.2mm x 0.25mm

Can you please post a link to your source of SPP?
If not able please just tells us the Who, What, and Where (and how much $) of your source.

[Hebden]

Can you please post a link to your source of SPP?
If not able please just tells us the Who, What, and Where (and how much $) of your source.

There's two places in Poland and one in UK.

https://do-it-at-home.co.uk/en/distilla ... 02120.html

https://destylatorymiedziane.pl/en/acce ... cking.html

https://pracowniametaloplastyczna.pl/

[elbono]

I believe the third one is the Polish language version of stillforyou (Piotr). Almost always "out of stock", but I got a liter and it's good stuff.

The second one has extremely good pricing until you add shipping if you're in the US.

I thought the first one only shipped inside UK but I rechecked and royal mail will get a liter to me for less than 60 USD total. Shipping on 2 liters more than doubled the total so I ordered 1 liter. I'll report back when I get it.

It seems if you're in the US like me the options are still very limited. I have severe headspace limitations so SPP is the only option for neutral unless I move outdoors.

[30xs]

Tan onto some .045 stainless mig wire for $10 per 10# roll. Would it be worth trying, or too heavy for making SPP?

[CopperFiend]

Tan onto some .045 stainless mig wire for $10 per 10# roll. Would it be worth trying, or too heavy for making SPP?

I tried mig wire. It doesn't work (at least for me) as it isn't annealed so when you wind it around your mandrel it springs back partially and this makes the SPP useless. I use annealed stainless steel wire that is normally sold for wiring beehive frames.

[elbono]

I thought the first one only shipped inside UK but I rechecked and royal mail will get a liter to me for less than 60 USD total. Shipping on 2 liters more than doubled the total so I ordered 1 liter. I'll report back when I get it.

It turns out they won't ship to the US even if their website lets you order it.

Options are still very limited in the US.

[Hebden]

Hi Guys,

If anyone is running a SPP packed column that wouldn't mind lending a hand, I would appreciate it. My situation is that I am a total novice, I am not getting past fores and heads.

Running a VM Reflux Colum, total height to take-off tee = 1500mm, RC on top:-

3" packed colum = 75mm Copper Mesh & 1250mm SPP of 4.2mm x 4.2mm x 0.25mm guage & 75mm Copper Mesh
50L Boiler & 5500w element
Charged with 25L of 32% Low wines

My ferment went well ish and alcohol ~8% before Pot Still Mode to low wines, shotgun leaked hence 32% Low Wines not being higher, this also tricked me in to ending the Pot Still mode early as I thought I was collecting at ~15% when I stopped collecting.

So with the 25L charge, I ruined my first attempt at refluxing by going too fast at 3L collected, everything was acetone tasting.

2nd Run with collections poured back in, I go slower:-
~30mins full reflux
Power 2750w
1hr 21mins to collect 1st 500ml
2nd 500ml & 3rd 500ml collected at 1hr each (500ml/h)
Closed gate valve and found my RC knockdown limits - (I have read this whole thread and wanted to find "flood point)
All jars were circa 96.8%ABV - temp corrected
Vapour Temp was 172.9f
RC Water out temp ~81.9f-84.4f

Note: After finding "flood" point, which probable didn't equalise as things started to vent the top safety hole, I collected more of the same in a full flooded state.

3rd Run, collections poured back in again, this time I heat slower and open valve in smaller increments
Power 1400w for 45 mins
Power 2750w for 35 mins
Gate valve opened after 1hr 20mins
1st 500ml Jar took ~90mins - 96.8%ABV - Vapour Temp 173.3f - RC water out temp 82.1f
2nd 500ml Jar took 57 mins - 96.8%ABV - Vapour Temp 173.3 - RC water out temp 83.2f
3rd 500ml Jar took 59 mins - 96.8%ABV - Vapour Temp 173.3 - RC water out temp 83.6f
4th & 5th Jar just the same - stopped at 2750ml
Currently under full reflux as I write.

So, after reading all 14 pages of this thread in the past and starting again last night, I read Odins comment regards the "mass" of SPP, hence my ultra slow warm up and 1st jar, my theory doesn't seem to have helped.

ps: No cuts in stripping run & I did a taste teste @~20ABV on my 2nd run product, it tasted like it smelled, acetone.

pss I cannot seem to remember anyone discussing Fores and Heads treatment within this SPP community, mostly what I gathered was Flood the column, yes I got that, run high power, yep, but to do those, I need to get past fores and heads right?

[bunny]

Hi Guys,

If anyone is running a SPP packed column that wouldn't mind lending a hand, I would appreciate it. My situation is that I am a total novice, I am not getting past fores and heads.

Running a VM Reflux Colum, total height to take-off tee = 1500mm, RC on top:-

3" packed colum = 75mm Copper Mesh & 1250mm SPP of 4.2mm x 4.2mm x 0.25mm guage & 75mm Copper Mesh
50L Boiler & 5500w element
Charged with 25L of 32% Low wines

My ferment went well ish and alcohol ~8% before Pot Still Mode to low wines, shotgun leaked hence 32% Low Wines not being higher, this also tricked me in to ending the Pot Still mode early as I thought I was collecting at ~15% when I stopped collecting.

So with the 25L charge, I ruined my first attempt at refluxing by going too fast at 3L collected, everything was acetone tasting.

2nd Run with collections poured back in, I go slower:-
~30mins full reflux
Power 2750w
1hr 21mins to collect 1st 500ml
2nd 500ml & 3rd 500ml collected at 1hr each (500ml/h)
Closed gate valve and found my RC knockdown limits - (I have read this whole thread and wanted to find "flood point)
All jars were circa 96.8%ABV - temp corrected
Vapour Temp was 172.9f
RC Water out temp ~81.9f-84.4f

Note: After finding "flood" point, which probable didn't equalise as things started to vent the top safety hole, I collected more of the same in a full flooded state.

3rd Run, collections poured back in again, this time I heat slower and open valve in smaller increments
Power 1400w for 45 mins
Power 2750w for 35 mins
Gate valve opened after 1hr 20mins
1st 500ml Jar took ~90mins - 96.8%ABV - Vapour Temp 173.3f - RC water out temp 82.1f
2nd 500ml Jar took 57 mins - 96.8%ABV - Vapour Temp 173.3 - RC water out temp 83.2f
3rd 500ml Jar took 59 mins - 96.8%ABV - Vapour Temp 173.3 - RC water out temp 83.6f
4th & 5th Jar just the same - stopped at 2750ml
Currently under full reflux as I write.

So, after reading all 14 pages of this thread in the past and starting again last night, I read Odins comment regards the "mass" of SPP, hence my ultra slow warm up and 1st jar, my theory doesn't seem to have helped.

ps: No cuts in stripping run & I did a taste teste @~20ABV on my 2nd run product, it tasted like it smelled, acetone.

pss I cannot seem to remember anyone discussing Fores and Heads treatment within this SPP community, mostly what I gathered was Flood the column, yes I got that, run high power, yep, but to do those, I need to get past fores and heads right?

For the sake of argument, just keep collecting the way you have been this morning. You have to reach the end of the heads sooner or later. Why there appears to be so much, I really don't know.

[Hebden]

For the sake of argument, just keep collecting the way you have been this morning. You have to reach the end of the heads sooner or later. Why there appears to be so much, I really don't know.

I thought the same, but too late, I been equalising at 4600w (RC can't handle much more) for a good 45mins, going to collect a little and see, it will be acetone.