Leftover marble floor tile as pH buffer?

[Steve Broady]

I’ve read several accounts of people using scraps of marble as a pH buffer in their fermentation vessels. My question relates to the safety of using marble floor tiles in that way, given that they have some kind of reason to fill in the cracks. I have a whole bunch of leftovers and scraps from my bathroom remodel, and if I’d course I’m looking at them and wondering if they’re safe to use. If it matters, they’re labeled “Crema Marfil Spain”

If it’s not safe, so be it. But I know there’s a wide range and depth of knowledge here, so I figured someone might know exactly what resin is being used and whether it’s safe to put into a fermenter.

[elbono]

If it's REAL marble it is basically fossilized sea shells that got real hot a few millennia ago. There's a lot of engineered marble out there that's marble dust and glue.

I got some real marble at a fancy tile shop that seems to work well. Makes it easy to measure how much gets used up.

[ecir54]

I use this marble rock from home depot

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Vigoro-0-5- ... /100583677

and a tea strainer from amazon



enough to last a long time

[Steve Broady]

As far as I’ve been able to determine, it’s real marble. But it’s also full of cracks, which makes it a total pain in the ass to work with. I’m having to wet saw every single cut, and even then it wants to break on me. I know that the cracks in the tiles are filled with some kind of resin, but I don’t know anything about it and whether it would be inert in typical fermentation conditions.

It’s beautiful on the bathroom floor, but not sure if it’s good for fermentation as well. And I figured I couldn’t be the only person who’d ever wonder that, so it was worth asking. I know there are better sources, but I wanted to know if this stuff is safe to use.

[NZChris]

I don't know that there are better sources. As long as it is natural marble and not a modern composite, it shouldn't be any better or worse than the large shells I pick up off the beach or the chunk of limestone rock I found.

Whatever I use, I keep records of the weights before and after the ferment, and the pH every time I check the SG, so that I can adjust my method for the next ferment if I need to. That said, I don't think I've ever needed to make adjustments.

[Yummyrum]

Well unless it's teflon resin , …… you know the answer …..it’s a synthetic

[Steve Broady]

Well unless it's teflon resin , …… you know the answer …..it’s a synthetic

I know people use HDPE and a variety of other synthetic materials in their fermentation vessels, which of why I even bothered to ask. There’s no way I’d have it in contact with the spirit side of things, obviously.

[Yummyrum]

Well unless it's teflon resin , …… you know the answer …..it’s a synthetic

I know people use HDPE and a variety of other synthetic materials in their fermentation vessels, which of why I even bothered to ask. There’s no way I’d have it in contact with the spirit side of things, obviously.

Thats a fair call Steve ….. it is low ABV .
I think maybe its going to come down to what you would consider safe .Personally , I get the Heebie jeebies with the idea . Logic tells me its probably OK . But …… I dunno

[Steve Broady]

Personally , I get the Heebie jeebies with the idea . Logic tells me its probably OK . But …… I dunno

I have the same feeling, to be honest. But, I’m a frugal person who hates seeing useful stuff go to waste. Before I throw away perfectly good material away, I figured I’d ask the collective wisdom here to see if anyone knows the answer for certain. As I’m sure you can imagine, there’s not a lot on the Internet about whether floor tiles are safe to put in your beer.

[Yummyrum]

Hee hee , I hear you Sir .
I remember getting an Ikea Kitchen bench a few years back . cut out a big section where the sink went .

Off cut was European Oak and smelt absolutely divine … and asking similar questions as it was all laminated .Hell I was prepared to cut out the glue sections … it smelled so good .

[bunny]

I don't know that there are better sources. As long as it is natural marble and not a modern composite, it shouldn't be any better or worse than the large shells I pick up off the beach or the chunk of limestone rock I found.

Whatever I use, I keep records of the weights before and after the ferment, and the pH every time I check the SG, so that I can adjust my method for the next ferment if I need to. That said, I don't think I've ever needed to make adjustments.

Hi Chris!
I'm curious about your records.
Could you share some of those numbers that tell how many grams of CaCO3 were consumed, type and size of ferment batch, and your starting water hardness?

Do you have an acceptable finished pH range that you use so as to not need to adjust amount of CaCO3 available during the ferment?

[30xs]

Are you sure there is a binder in it? I’d try taking a torch to it. Marble isn’t going to burn or smolder. If there’s no reaction to getting it good and hot maybe you’re just seeing the veins in the marble veining instead of resin. Just an idea.

[Steve Broady]

I’d try taking a torch to it.

I haven’t tried torching it, but I did use one tile as a buffer between the kitchen stove and my boiler. The marble discolored quite a bit, and the tile more or less fell apart. From a single 12” square, I ended up with several jagged pieces which broke apart along all the veins and seams in the tile. There are also a few spots where I can see what appears to be a different material on the back side of the tile. And finally, I read somewhere that it’s not uncommon for such tiles to be bonded together with resin. While I don’t KNOW that I’m looking at resin, it sure seems likely.

[NZChris]

I don't know that there are better sources. As long as it is natural marble and not a modern composite, it shouldn't be any better or worse than the large shells I pick up off the beach or the chunk of limestone rock I found.

Whatever I use, I keep records of the weights before and after the ferment, and the pH every time I check the SG, so that I can adjust my method for the next ferment if I need to. That said, I don't think I've ever needed to make adjustments.

Hi Chris!
I'm curious about your records.
Could you share some of those numbers that tell how many grams of CaCO3 were consumed, type and size of ferment batch, and your starting water hardness?

Do you have an acceptable finished pH range that you use so as to not need to adjust amount of CaCO3 available during the ferment?

I do a lot of different ferments, some without shells, and the amount used up varies. I've reweighed shells I'd put in grape ferments and they have been covered in crystals and heavier than when they went in. I have the notes from similar ferments available if I need to know anything when putting a ferment down. I don't often try to adjust the pH during a ferment, I mostly just record what it is. The advantage of using large chunks rather than crushed or powdered, is that it behaves more like a buffer than an ingredient and you can turn your brain off and let them look after the pH for you.

I have no idea what my water hardness is and many of my ferments use little, or no tap water.

Any pH that lets the yeast do its' job is good for me. Higher is better for bacteria if you want infections for ester creation.

[lest1]

you can get limestone for water purification cheap as mate give that a run

[bilgriss]

Looks natural to me

https://www.fox-marble.com/quarries/cre ... oto-spain/

https://marmorama.es/crema-marfil/

I assume you'd want to smash some up to get some surface area, after cleaning it and avoiding those patches you mentioned.

[NZChris]

Looks natural to me

https://www.fox-marble.com/quarries/cre ... oto-spain/

https://marmorama.es/crema-marfil/

I assume you'd want to smash some up to get some surface area, after cleaning it and avoiding those patches you mentioned.

I wouldn't do that unless what you had already tried wasn't working. Keep good records of what you do and the pH results.

A small exposed surface area of CaCO3 behaves more like a buffer than a large exposed surface. Unless you have hung it in a bag, one or two chunks is a lot easier to remove than a pile of small pieces if the ferment is dead and you have to put off stripping because life got in the way.

[PDBRadley]

A quick and easy way to check natural stone tile for fillers is to look at the backside of the tile. Usually the voids are left unfilled on the back. If there are visible voids then the tile face contains epoxy fillers. If the tile has a polished finish, sometimes the factory uses chemical hardeners or polishing compounds. If polished you should grind off about 1/16th to 1/8th of an inch of the surface to expose the natural stone (wear a mask). This might also remove any filler since it is not usually completely through the stone. Crema Marfil sometimes contains small voids along the veining so that's the first place to look. It's more work and risk than it's worth given the alternatives available in the suggestions above. Your next decorating project should incorporate tumbled marble tile. All you need is a hammer to process the scrap material.