Boiler upgrade build - Got my next keg!

[MooseMan]

Ok, so I finally got the big fat keg I've been eyeing up for many months outside a business that I drive past on my journey to and from work.

I've called them, no answer, I've knocked on the door, no answer, I've driven past every single weekday for 2 years and not seen a soul there, and the kegs have been sat outside there for the entire time, covered in dead leaves and brambles.

So this morning as I was on an early start, I reversed up into the corner where the kegs are, opened the boot ready to throw one in and guess what? The damn things are full! No wonder the scrap metal guys haven't taken them...
I don't yet know what capacity these are, but definitely a fair bit more than the std keg I have at the moment. They are quite fat in the middle and look like the old wooden "Firkin" or "Kilderkin" barrels used to, but stainless.
I've spent a lifetime lifting weights for strength so I'm not really your average "Old guy" but holy shit I struggled to get that thing up over the boot lid of my SUV! I'll be getting my son to help me carry it from the car that's for sure!

I'll obviously test fill it when I've got the spear (And the contents, which may even be usable!) out over the holidays, but it seems capacious.

Once I've got it out back later this evening I'll give it a quick clean off and post a couple of pics to see what you guys think. I'm sure someone will recognise the keg type right away.
I've got mostly all of the parts I need for the build so I'll put up pics of them too. I just need to get some threaded rod for the legs/castor supports.

[Yummyrum]

Jezz Moose

I’ll give it to you that you gave them fair time to negotiate ….. but not quite sure snatch ‘n grab was a good option . ……. We not into stealing here .

But seeing as you may have saved an unwanted treasure from a life time of neglect ….. and most apparently , it's owner showed no interest in it , seems fitting you post a pic .

[Wildcats]

Subbed,and ready for your build. We demand pictures!

[MooseMan]

Well this is a bit of a shock!

I got home a while ago, got my son to help me lift the keg out of the boot, rolled it down the drive and gave it a bit of a brush over to get all the crap off.

That's when I saw exactly why I struggled to lift the thing into my car boot!

I didn't even know that std brewery kegs this size existed!?

Here's a couple more pics to show the scale and size of it.

Next to a 5gal corny.

Next to a 1gal Demijohn

It's a big beast and I'm very, very happy with it.
It's going to make a fantastic project over the Xmas holidays to keep me busy and out from under the wife's feet.

[MooseMan]

Ok so I have the following parts already sorted for the build:-

4" tri clamp flange for a cleaning port, top of keg off centre.

2x 21/2" flanges, one for riser attachment, one for element attachment.

Intended bottom drain parts. 28mm valve, 28mm elbow, 28mm stub with flange bashed out for a solid connection in the keg base. (I have a fear of a straight joint giving way and dumping the contents) 2x short straight 28mm sections to be cut when I have dims.

[MooseMan]

The elements I referred to in another thread have a 1 3/4" BSP thread. I had an engineering firm I deal with, drill and tap a 2 1/2" blank cap to fit the threads.

Element threaded into blank cap. The rubber o-ring will be gone and the threads PTFE taped to seal as per my current setup.

Should be far better if/when I need to remove the element for any reason. No need to disconnect the wiring or spin it out of a thread, just undo a Tri clamp.

[Yummyrum]

100litres ….nice Moose .That would be my dream boiler too.

Gonna be a bugger getting the beer out if it . Might be worth buying a proper fitting otherwise it could get messy .
I recon it might be worth saving the beer if you can . It’s unlikely its fit to drink ,but 100 litres of potential whiskey beer right there .

[MooseMan]

100litres ….nice Moose .That would be my dream boiler too.

Gonna be a bugger getting the beer out if it . Might be worth buying a proper fitting otherwise it could get messy .
I recon it might be worth saving the beer if you can . It’s unlikely its fit to drink ,but 100 litres of potential whiskey beer right there .

It's honestly huge Yummy, I could see it was bigger than mine, but it's near enough double capacity!

I wish you were about 15,000k closer mate, cos there's another identical one, also full, just sat there waiting for a friend...

This is going to be a fantastic stripper when I eventually get it running, I've got all kinds of ideas popping off in my head with it.

And yeah I'm definitely gonna keep the contents if they are still alcoholic, no reason why not!

[Wildcats]

Nice!!!! 26 gallons WOW that's gonna be a hella stripper. You could do a 70 gal ferment and 3 strips and a long ass spirit run and Bob's your uncle.

Can't wait to see you get this thing done and pumping out the good stuff. Have you thought about a level gage on the side so you always know how much is in the boiler? Just throwing that out there..

Wish I lived over there I'd definitely have to see about the other one..... You could use it for something. Plus it's probably lonely now that it's twin is gone... Just saying.
Good luck with your build. Plenty of pictures.... Cheer's

[Wildcats]

A level gage is kind expensive if you buy one. But Shady made one out of a some compression fittings and a glass tube....

[MooseMan]

Nice!!!! 26 gallons WOW that's gonna be a hella stripper. You could do a 70 gal ferment and 3 strips and a long ass spirit run and Bob's your uncle.

Can't wait to see you get this thing done and pumping out the good stuff. Have you thought about a level gage on the side so you always know how much is in the boiler? Just throwing that out there..

Wish I lived over there I'd definitely have to see about the other one..... You could use it for something. Plus it's probably lonely now that it's twin is gone... Just saying.
Good luck with your build. Plenty of pictures.... Cheer's

Oh stop it will you!
My head is full of mad ideas for this already without you being the devil on my shoulder.

But yeah, I could do that, couldn't I........

[Wildcats]

Ok so I have the following parts already sorted for the build:-

IMG_20231129_181101_217~2.jpg

IMG_20231129_181200_276.jpg
4" tri clamp flange for a cleaning port, top of keg off centre.

IMG_20231129_181300_222~2.jpg
2x 21/2" flanges, one for riser attachment, one for element attachment.

IMG_20231129_181624_927~2.jpg
Intended bottom drain parts. 28mm valve, 28mm elbow, 28mm stub with flange bashed out for a solid connection in the keg base. (I have a fear of a straight joint giving way and dumping the contents) 2x short straight 28mm sections to be cut when I have dims.

Is the 4" ferrule you have a "short weld" or a long weld? The reason I ask, is because I am waiting on mine to arrive and I ordered the long weld. Because I was worried about having enough room for the TriClamp to fit against the top of the boiler. Probably not a big deal... Just something to think about before you weld or solder it on.

[MooseMan]

Ok so I have the following parts already sorted for the build:-

IMG_20231129_181101_217~2.jpg

IMG_20231129_181200_276.jpg
4" tri clamp flange for a cleaning port, top of keg off centre.

IMG_20231129_181300_222~2.jpg
2x 21/2" flanges, one for riser attachment, one for element attachment.

IMG_20231129_181624_927~2.jpg
Intended bottom drain parts. 28mm valve, 28mm elbow, 28mm stub with flange bashed out for a solid connection in the keg base. (I have a fear of a straight joint giving way and dumping the contents) 2x short straight 28mm sections to be cut when I have dims.

Is the 4" ferrule you have a "short weld" or a long weld? The reason I ask, is because I am waiting on mine to arrive and I ordered the long weld. Because I was worried about having enough room for the TriClamp to fit against the top of the boiler. Probably not a big deal... Just something to think about before you weld or solder it on.

It didn't specify, but looking at it with a clamp on, there seems to be plenty of height there.
Although I've been thinking I can always add a copper sleeve, which may actually make it easier to Solder/Braze them on.

[Wildcats]

Ok so I have the following parts already sorted for the build:-

IMG_20231129_181101_217~2.jpg

IMG_20231129_181200_276.jpg
4" tri clamp flange for a cleaning port, top of keg off centre.

IMG_20231129_181300_222~2.jpg
2x 21/2" flanges, one for riser attachment, one for element attachment.

IMG_20231129_181624_927~2.jpg
Intended bottom drain parts. 28mm valve, 28mm elbow, 28mm stub with flange bashed out for a solid connection in the keg base. (I have a fear of a straight joint giving way and dumping the contents) 2x short straight 28mm sections to be cut when I have dims.

Is the 4" ferrule you have a "short weld" or a long weld? The reason I ask, is because I am waiting on mine to arrive and I ordered the long weld. Because I was worried about having enough room for the TriClamp to fit against the top of the boiler. Probably not a big deal... Just something to think about before you weld or solder it on.

It didn't specify, but looking at it with a clamp on, there seems to be plenty of height there.
Although I've been thinking I can always add a copper sleeve, which may actually make it easier to Solder/Braze them on.

Yep that'll work. Same plan I have. Cheer's

[MooseMan]

Is the 4" ferrule you have a "short weld" or a long weld? The reason I ask, is because I am waiting on mine to arrive and I ordered the long weld. Because I was worried about having enough room for the TriClamp to fit against the top of the boiler. Probably not a big deal... Just something to think about before you weld or solder it on.

If it helps Wildcats.

The Tri clamp thumb screw misses comfortably, and that's with a 16mm upstand below the flange.

This is only resting on top of the keg obviously.

[MooseMan]

100litres ….nice Moose .That would be my dream boiler too.

Gonna be a bugger getting the beer out if it . Might be worth buying a proper fitting otherwise it could get messy .
I recon it might be worth saving the beer if you can . It’s unlikely its fit to drink ,but 100 litres of potential whiskey beer right there .

Jammed a fat screwdriver into the seal this afternoon and it's still fully gassed up. The gas smells like cheap lager, but not nasty at all. It should be fine really as it's been under CO2 the whole time.

I'll de-gas it when I come to get started, and Syphon the beer out once the spear is out of the way.
If I'm lucky, it might make a decent white dog for blending or something.
Worst case scenario it will get stripped and added to the feints corny for refluxing.

[Wildcats]

Thanks for the pictures and feedback MooseMan. Looks like it'll work. I was worried about nothing... It'll be interesting to see how the beer distills.... Cheer's

[bilgriss]

That's nice.

I dropped off a couple of truckloads of recycling at the metal scrap place this week, and there was a bin with four kegs beside me. They're buying and selling by the pound, but didn't have any interest in me taking any off their hands. Yours is a rather good deal.

[MooseMan]

Thanks bilgriss, I'm really rather happy with it in all honesty!
Getting this for free, and having what amounts to lifetime spares of 6kw elements for it, is far more than I could ask for in a hobby that can swallow quite a bit of cash quite quickly, if you decide you need to make rush purchases.

I have to avoid my local scrapyard as much as possible, as I have a tendency to come back with a car boot more full than when I left home.
My wife dreads it when I say I've saved up enough scrap to go weigh in.

[NormandieStill]

I wish you were about 15,000k closer mate, cos there's another identical one, also full, just sat there waiting for a friend...

If I was still in the UK I'd consider it worth the field trip. Not going to be back before next summer I think, and I'm not sure the family will want to add Wales to what promises to be an already busy itinerary!

[MooseMan]

I wish you were about 15,000k closer mate, cos there's another identical one, also full, just sat there waiting for a friend...

If I was still in the UK I'd consider it worth the field trip. Not going to be back before next summer I think, and I'm not sure the family will want to add Wales to what promises to be an already busy itinerary!

Well NS, if you do manage to convince your folks that a nice trip to Wales is worth it, I'll bet the keg will still be there!
Unless someone else on the forum who's close enough asks for it first I guess!

[Swedish Pride]

If you're in Wales shouldn't you be called sheepman.....

On a serious note, seeing that you're a strong fella who's been pumping iron most of your life is go with a 6in fillport.
I'm a weed and I struggle to clean with a 4in port.

Nice score, should be the last boiler you need, maybe use the other one as a thumper?

[MooseMan]

If you're in Wales shouldn't you be called sheepman.....

On a serious note, seeing that you're a strong fella who's been pumping iron most of your life is go with a 6in fillport.
I'm a weed and I struggle to clean with a 4in port.

Nice score, should be the last boiler you need, maybe use the other one as a thumper?

The sheep reference has been made on the odd occasion yes! Got English family!

It's too late now I've bought the parts, but I have checked and my arm will fit in a 4" pipe opening.
That's the difference between musclebound meatheads, and strength lifters, we don't look like Hulk.

I'm really hoping that I won't ever have to change again after this, determined to make it everything I need for the foreseeable.
I'm still going to use my 50L boiler for the reflux still as it's well suited to it, but I do have a couple of ideas for something along the lines of a pre-heater/thumper too.

[Bolverk]

Man I'm jealous. Id love to make a mash ton out of that 100l keg.

[tommysb]

Moose - not meaning to have a go at you, as what's done is done, and you were probably ignorant to the following -

But that keg *likely* belonged to the brewery that filled it, not the owner of the yard it was sat in front of. You probably weren't taking the keg from an abandoned yard, you were taking it from the brewery who owned it.

Since you're in the UK please have a look at:
https://www.kegwatch.co.uk/

There's a whole industry scheme for trying to identify and return kegs that belong to breweries.

[MooseMan]

Moose - not meaning to have a go at you, as what's done is done, and you were probably ignorant to the following -

But that keg *likely* belonged to the brewery that filled it, not the owner of the yard it was sat in front of. You probably weren't taking the keg from an abandoned yard, you were taking it from the brewery who owned it.

Since you're in the UK please have a look at:
https://www.kegwatch.co.uk/

There's a whole industry scheme for trying to identify and return kegs that belong to breweries.

No offense taken tommy.

So despite trying all ways to get in touch with them, over several weeks, in order to "Buy" the keg, I would have been asking the wrong people in any case! Hah!

Well, it's twin and another, normal sized keg are still sat there and probably will for years to come unless someone like me happens by. It's an open access yard, no gates or anything so unless they have simply forgotten where they delivered it, the brewery clearly don't want them that much.

In fact there's another place near me, big industrial park, that have a massive yard full with hundreds/thousands of stacked up kegs, and there are always half a dozen just left outside the gates along the kerb and in the bushes, so despite that website appearing to be pro-active, it doesn't seem that the industry is?

[tommysb]

so despite that website appearing to be pro-active, it doesn't seem that the industry is?

This is getting a bit off-topic, apologies, but I was quite heavily involved in a small UK brewery at some point in the past, so trying to raise a bit of awareness about the issue.

In likelihood - a 100L keg belongs to some huge macro producer, with millions in revenue who won't miss such a thing, and it wasn't going to be recovered as it's not worth their time and can afford the loss.
Small breweries really DO feel it when their kegs aren't returned, go missing, or are converted into BBQs/plant pots etc and resold on facebook marketplace. The irony being, that the small guys don't have resources to go around repatriating kegs (or casks), but feel the loss of them much more than big guys! It's a problem in the industry, but one where schemes like kegwatch are the 'best' solution that exists at the moment (probably).

Taking it after it's been sitting there some years is pretty much harmless, and yeah, morally I don't think you did anything wrong. Nice to get some use out of it! Rant over, no offence meant here at this end either.

[MooseMan]

Short update.

I got the spear out on the weekend, syphoned out the contents which turned out to be a crap flavourless lager (Bit of a sour taste but otherwise just meh) and decided to run a boiler full of it and gave the rest to a mate to drink/run.

I got a low yield as expected, 1.5gal low wines (@30% total) from 45lts.

But anyway, I got a surprise when the spear came out!

It's got a cast in section under the flange, reinforcing the spear fitting.
Not really an issue to me as I'll be flipping the keg, but never seen it before.

[Wildcats]

Looks like you're probably going to have to cut that out. Seems like it'll be in the way of a heating element. Might be able to reach it with a die grinder.

[MooseMan]

Looks like you're probably going to have to cut that out. Seems like it'll be in the way of a heating element. Might be able to reach it with a die grinder.

That was my first thought too, I was a bit dejected as it would be a pain to get done neatly.

But because these kegs have a domed base and top, the cast part is actually not even level with the top seam, so with an element in the tightest possible position at the seam, (Basically as low as I can safely get it) it should still clear it by a decent amount.