No Cuts for Bourbon. For Real?

[Bee]

I toured a small distillery that makes very nice bourbon using a batch process on a 4-plated still. I asked them about cuts and they insisted that they barreled everything that comes off the still from heads to deep, negligible alcohol content tails. No alcohol goes down the drain.

Do you think that's for real? I tasted their bottled white dog product and it tastes for all intents & purposes like what comes off a home still where head & tail cuts are made.

I do not understand how that can be done without the cloudiness and off-flavor of tails or the heat from heads.

[Ridgeback816]

I know some distilleries vent their foreshots and probably early heads on batch doubling runs I am guessing it's possible for a distillery to use a heavy char barrel to clean up some deep tails and/or use chill filtering

[Renhoekk]

Do you think that's for real? I tasted their bottled white dog product and it tastes for all intents & purposes like what comes off a home still where head & tail cuts are made.

Did you see any fermentation happening at this small distillery?

[Yummyrum]

I think they are telling you porky pies …… and you know it .

[Dougmatt]

Do you think that's for real?

No

[Stilljoy McFlavour]

Often distilleries use intricate schemes where all- or a percentage of heads and tails are added to the low wines for a future run. However, even then some heads should be discarded because of the buildup of high alcohols.
However, I do not doubt that they try to maximize ethanol production and usage for their bourbon.

[cranky]

I'm guessing it's a semantics game, like "All I do is a reasonable fores cut", which to us sounds bad but if the "fores" are as "reasonable" as to include what we would consider to ordinarily be heads, it's actually doing the same thing, just calling it something different.

That said, I remember reading from one of the now ex members here that he never did heads cuts either, he said bourbon didn't need it but I think he did the same "reasonable" fores cut thing too.

[Bee]

One thing I did notice is that the takeoff valve on the top plate was turned off. Clue?

Oh, and what is a "spinner plate"? He said there was one of those in the onion dome.

[Twisted Brick]

Oh, and what is a "spinner plate"? He said there was one of those in the onion dome.

I think it was Myles who made a spinner plate that (somewhat) worked. It is a horizontal, vapor-driven rotating fan blade (pinwheel) made to direct the center-most vapor to the perimeter of the onion, supposedly increasing passive reflux.

[Chucker]

Another possibility to consider is that they may have been employing a little bit of business ‘shell game’ where what was being distilled might be partially something that’s already been distilled.
Bourbon may have a certain definition, and they may have a bit of a constraint over what they call ‘their own’, but the balance may be getting rounded out by adding GNS into the mix and redistilling. They could be letting someone else do the cuts for them to the point where they need some substantial heads from their portion to make up the lack in the high proof fraction.
It’s only speculative on my part that they do this or if that’s “the trick” behind what they are telling you. But it is a method for small distillers to keep the lights on and enhance their return on investment while they are working to establish a market share. Not many operations could endure procurement and startup costs if they have to wait for years to have a revenue stream.

[Renhoekk]

Another possibility to consider is that they may have been employing a little bit of business ‘shell game’ where what was being distilled might be partially something that’s already been distilled.

That’s what I’m thinking too - I asked OP if he saw any fermentation at the distillery, because I suspect they are buying drums of white dog and running it through their still so they can claim that they made a craft product. Happens quite a bit - there are big suppliers that produce beverages on an industrial scale that supply other distilleries with ready-to-go spirits. The distilleries need to run it through their stills in order to say they manufactured the final beverage, otherwise they are just a bottling company.

[Bee]

No, no neutral added. Had a very nice mashing setup, controlled temp, etc. Ground their own grain.

The place did use a wholesaler for one line of booze, just like High West. They were very open about it, advertising it.

[NcHooch]

I wouldn't be surprised. Yall ever heard that saying "Heads for bite, and tails for character" ?
I think your whiskey will be smoother without heads and and can have good character without a big load of tails, but that's me .
Also, Don't overlook the fact that a good working plate still can produce pretty good product until the "beer" is almost completely stripped.
And finally, 8 years in a barrel does amazing things.