Booner's Casual All Corn

[Zacher]

Hats off to you Woodshed for posting this almost 10 years ago. I followed this as much as I could but had to post the story. I bought 100# of corn from an Amish farm a few months ago for $20. Really wanted an all corn recipe, found this one and went to work. My grain mill would not grind the large kernels so I tried my food processer, which died on the spot so I looked around and spotted my coffee grinder. Well, it took 3.5 hours at 5oz per grind and after 3-4 overheats I finally had 20# of coarse corn meal. I boiled 9G of water and mashed in to my 10G Home Depot cooler which brought the temp down to 178F. I added the SEBStar, stirred and let it sit for a few hours. When it got down to 165F I added alpha amylase , stirred and left it overnight. In the morning it was down to 145F so I waited until it got to 138F and added the glucoamylase, stirred and let that sit for several hours. I strained and pressed out all of the liquid to yield 7.5G of wash which came in at 9.75%! I tossed in some DADY and cannot wait to run this. Thank you for posting this recipe and for the guidance. To have a resource like this Forum is amazing. One question I have is to oak or not to oak? I guess I'll have to decide when I taste it....

Next week on to UJSSM......

[Zacher]

Ran this last night and blended this morning. Had to at least have a sippy and was very pleased. Have to make dinner for the in-laws tonight but will be sampling more afterwards for sure. I think I'm going to leave most of it white and just oak one jar to experiment. Just wanted to thank Woodshed again and highly recommend this recipe.

-Zacher

[Zacher]

So Santa left me a 5L medium char oak barrel under the Christmas tree. I have about 2.5L of Booner's left after the holidays (a couple of jars went missing) and was thinking about making another batch to fill the barrel. I really like this white but would appreciate some input from those that have oaked this recipe. How does it age on the oak? I'm torn between this or making a single malt to fill it. I want to buy a heavy char barrel for any bourbon. Any advice is appreciated! Thanks.

Edit: Upon looking at my post above, I should have included the OG not just the % at 1.000. The OG was 1.075.

[Brock O]

Lads,

Apologies I haven't read the 22 pages..

Key to this being Liquid Amylase...which I can't get here in Australia, has anyone had success with power form ?

[Sporacle]

The powders work fine, just check the dates
60 bucks will get you enough liquid alpha and gluco to last a long time
https://beerco.com.au/products/benzyme-aa

[Whitecap72]

I did a second ferment on the corn(sour mash), put a gallon back in from the still after running, heated up some water,put a little sugar and honey I and pitched yeast at 90 degrees. Re ran about 6 days later. Only got 3 jars, started at 130 and ended at 70. Kept it you g till I got a nice big jar of 50 to pour in the thumper for the next full ferment.

[Zacher]

Made a second batch of this and just ran it. Unbelievable. But I was out of glucoamylase and my wash came in at 7% vs 9.75% using it. Already bought more for the next batch. Everything else was pretty much identical. Could not tell a flavor difference and got about a gallon at 80 after proofing. My tails cuts at 70 and 60 got cloudy so I have a nice jar saved for the next run like Whitecap. Love this recipe.....

[Rudy2153]

This sounds awesome. One question though. Would dry enzymes work the same or does it have to be liquid?

[Rudy2153]

Dry enzymes not fry!! I have fat fingers!

[NormandieStill]

In general powder enzymes have a lower active temperature range and may well be denatured at the temperature at which the corn is cooked. But you can maybe use some sacrificially to help thin the porridge before cooling it down and adding the proper dose. Check the packets of your enzymes to see where they are happiest.

[Rudy2153]

If I hold the temperature in the proper range for the right amount of time then I should get good conversion then right? I want to use what I have available right now before I buy something new.

[NormandieStill]

In order to get proper gelling you'll need to keep it hot at first. When it does help, you then end up with something the consistency of porridge. Being able to add some alpha at this point to thin it makes life easier.

Other than that, yeah. You just need to maintain the temps and pH that the enzymes ask for in order to let them do their thing.

[Rudy2153]

I’m having a hard time finding the proper temp. It’s not on the package. I have LD Carlson powdered amylase enzymes. Anyone know the temp for this?

[bilgriss]

You'll get a number of temperature recommendations from people, most likely, but the important thing is to wait until your mash drops below 150. My own personal recommendation would be give it a few more degrees, and try to keep it around 145. YMMV

From a Homebrew reseller:

Amylase enzyme is a naturally occurring enzyme that is used to aid in the conversion of starches to sugars in the all grain brewing process. It is especially helpful in lighter beers with delicate malt character. This enzyme will begin to denature at temperatures above 149 F (65 C). At temperatures around 158 F (70C), the enzyme will denature after about 60 minutes. When the temperature reaches 194 F (90 C), the enzyme will denature in 5-10 minutes. Obviously, it is very important that the mash temperature not go above 158 F (70 C) if amylase enzyme is used.

[Zacher]

If I hold the temperature in the proper range for the right amount of time then I should get good conversion then right? I want to use what I have available right now before I buy something new.

I think the problem here is holding the porridge at temp without scorching. The high temp amylase starts to break down the starches earlier. Then you can add some alpha at ~145F to boost the process. I found that adding the glucoamylase at ~100F broke down the last of the bonds to get full conversion. When I used them all I got a wash at 9.75% vs 7% without the glucoamylase. If you can hold the temps, the alpha should work fine without the high temp alpha after you have done the gelatinization, but IMHO that is the challenge.

Making sure we are talking about cracked corn and not flaked maize which is already gelatinized.

[Chucker]

When doing a corn mash I’ll use half of the planned total amylase in with the corn during the high temp steeping/gelatinization just to aid a bit in thinning. The LDC isn’t high temp and I know I’m not getting the best out of it at that point but it’s just to keep things a little more mobile as the mass cools.
After the temp gets below 150 I put the rest in along with the glucoamylase. By now I’ve adjusted pH and ensured enough calcium to favor the enzyme. This just gets left in the fermenter overnight with a blanket over it to cool slowly. Removing the blanket in the morning will result in enough heat loss that it’ll soon be at pitch temperature.
I’ve never done a starch test as the change is quite obvious and with the amount of grains and water used I’m hitting expected OG. Besides, at temps of under 125 F it’s all on borrowed time if I don’t get yeast started soon, so there’s little I could do to correct a conversion problem.

[Rudy2153]

If I hold the temperature in the proper range for the right amount of time then I should get good conversion then right? I want to use what I have available right now before I buy something new.

I think the problem here is holding the porridge at temp without scorching. The high temp amylase starts to break down the starches earlier. Then you can add some alpha at ~145F to boost the process. I found that adding the glucoamylase at ~100F broke down the last of the bonds to get full conversion. When I used them all I got a wash at 9.75% vs 7% without the glucoamylase. If you can hold the temps, the alpha should work fine without the high temp alpha after you have done the gelatinization, but IMHO that is the challenge.

Making sure we are talking about cracked corn and not flaked maize which is already gelatinized.

Yes cracked corn, milled pretty fine.
I was planning on using a 10 gallon orange igloo drinking water cooler to put the porridge in after the cook and the temp lowered to 150 to hold the temp, but after a little reading on here I’m not sure that’s a good idea so I’m probably going to put it in my fermenter wrapped in blankets

[Zacher]

"Yes cracked corn, milled pretty fine.
I was planning on using a 10 gallon orange igloo drinking water cooler to put the porridge in after the cook and the temp lowered to 150 to hold the temp, but after a little reading on here I’m not sure that’s a good idea so I’m probably going to put it in my fermenter wrapped in blankets"

This is how I got my best result(the cooler). Add boiling water to the milled corn to gelatinize. Check out my previous post to see my process if you want to try it out and adjust as needed RE: enzymes.

[WillC]

Good day!
After a while of running rum, i am ready to start back on corn.
I got a 50 pound bag of whole kernel Yellow Tuxpeño from Mexico. I am going to grind it to a rough grind.
Now this is much much more than i have ever tried. I have a blue 55 gallon drum with top ready to go.
Math. 1.8/ gallon. 50 pounds = 90 gallons of water?
I want to use 45 gallons of water, leave a bit of room to ferment on some grain. So my math comes out to 25 pounds of corn.
Other than that the directions are pretty much the same. Cook, enzymes at proper temp. After last enzyme i usually wrap up the cooker and leave over night. Drop over into fermenter top off with water and pitch it with a pile of my yeast. I do ferment in my finished basement. Its rather cool so i sterilize an aquarium heater and drop in than cover.

**** PH. My new calibrated PH meter reads 5.6 at 76 F. My meter compensates for temp. Bit low? Adding corn will raise or lower it? If i need to adjust PH what is optimum for all grain corn ferment? Adjust PH just prior to pitching yeast?

TDS is 016

[ozark_jake]

I think you want 1.8 pounds/gallon, so it's 50/1.8 = 27.8 gallons.

[WillC]

I think you want 1.8 pounds/gallon, so it's 50/1.8 = 27.8 gallons.

I multiplied. lol
Damn lol. Thanks

[Seafarer]

I just wanted to drop a thank you for @woodshed. This recipe has given me (total novice) the confidence dip my toes into the world of corn whiskey and the results are fantastic! I write this as I’m currently mashing in my third batch. Thank you so much for sharing this technique!

[fiery creations]

Sorry I don’t feel like reading 22 pages,,, did a few.


Did the consensus end up
Being that the cracked corn also needs to be milled and not “straight out of the bag?”


I’ve got some steeping about to hit 148 and add GL. So far it just seems like water with large chunks of corn in it.

[fiery creations]

Edit-

Followed the recipe to a T. Kept pH values as close to the middle of the range but even after an overnight sit I’m still failing the starch test and only have 1.036. Is this normal? Should the GL keep working on the starches in the fermenter?

[ozark_jake]

In my first batch I mashed one five-gallon bucket using cracked corn "straight out of the bag" just to see. Like you, I got 1.03, then it immediately got infected. I properly milled the grain for the other five buckets, got 1.067 in all of them and ultimately some nice corn whiskey. So yeah, mill your grain.

[fiery creations]

In my first batch I mashed one five-gallon bucket using cracked corn "straight out of the bag" just to see. Like you, I got 1.03, then it immediately got infected. I properly milled the grain for the other five buckets, got 1.067 in all of them and ultimately some nice corn whiskey. So yeah, mill your grain.

A lot of these “tried and true” recipes could really benefit from having their main post updated if they were changed and/or improved over a dozen + pages. I’m all for reading but it’s a lot to sift through to and easy to miss things. “ straight from the bag” left me with most of my pieces of corn still extremely hard after hours in the pot.


Spent nearly two hours hand grinding corn for the next batch. Didn’t realize when I bought my grain mill most of them can’t do corn

[Bushman]

A lot of these “tried and true” recipes could really benefit from having their main post updated if they were changed and/or improved over a dozen + pages. I’m all for reading but it’s a lot to sift through to and easy to miss things. “

That would be nice but who decides which of the comments should be updated. Also the Mods and Administrators spend hours monitoring and keeping the forum running smoothly. If it takes you a long time to read through a thread you can imagine the time spent reading then going back and editing the OP’s post not to mention they may not want the changes.
Just my thought on the topic. Let’s not turn this into a topic of discussion and get off track from the original thread.

[fiery creations]

Woodshed, I would think.


Anywho. Is it normal to fail a starch test using this method?

If I have good OG, should I even worry about it or assume it will continue working while fermenting?

[Twisted Brick]

Sorry I don’t feel like reading 22 pages,,, did a few.

This hobby requires much reading but there are ways to streamline one's reading commitment. There are a myriad of short threads on the Forum that outline the steps involved in converting corn successfully. The same problems you encountered are common so have been addressed by members many times. Fittingly, they can be easily searched and read through. Concepts like corn strike temp, optimum milling size, corn gel time, enzymes, etc are covered. Just select the search terms you want.

For the benefit of others reading through this thread for advice on avoiding problems before they occur, a simple Google search like these examples will locate HD threads discussing corn conversion:

homedistiller mashing cracked corn

homedistiller problems with corn conversion

homedistiller low starch level of feed grains

homedistiller grinding corn

[fiery creations]

Sorry I don’t feel like reading 22 pages,,, did a few.

To learn this hobby requires as much reading as you have capacity for but you don't have to read through 22 pages. There are a myriad of short threads on the Forum that outline the steps involved in converting corn successfully. The same problems you encountered are common so have been addressed by members many times. Fittingly, they can be easily searched and read through. Concepts like corn strike temp, optimum milling size, corn gel time, enzymes, etc are covered. Just select the search terms you want.

For the benefit of others reading through this thread for advice on avoiding problems before they occur, a simple Google search like these examples will locate HD threads discussing corn conversion:

homedistiller mashing cracked corn

homedistiller problems with corn conversion

homedistiller low starch level of feed grains

homedistiller grinding corn

See I did that and everything I read talked about grinding corn. But then reading something in the “tried and true” section that said otherwise and to add straight from the bag prompted me to do it that way instead.


No big loss. I got something and learned always grind. It’s the contradicting info from reading so much that gets me