Gin questions

[Bradster68]

Iv started to play around with gin. I have a question about the formula Mr Zymurgy uses.
I'll call the ingredients spices to keep it simple, some may be alled botanical,seeds etc.

Recommended proportions
x = Juniper berry
x/2 = coriander
x/10 = angelica cassia, cinnamon, licorice, bitter almond, grains of paradise
x/100 = bitter & sweet orange peel, lemon peel, ginger orris root, cardamon, nutmeg, savory, chamomile

I understand the recipe is tailored to each person's liking.
When you are using say 12 spices is there more to the formula for amounts?
Or does one just willy-nilly spices together and keep notes.
Are Certain spices in the x/10 row in that row for a reason? Or is this just an example.
Every example I see categorizes the same spices in the same row.
Are these spices commonly not used as the dominant spice?
My understanding is as long as you keep to the 20-35g/L you can add as many ingredients as you want in whatever amounts you want.
I just made my first gin using odins.
1 litre of 43%
No maceration time
12g juniper
3g coriander
1 gram cardamom
1/2 of a star anise
2 lemon peels .5 x1.25 (zest only)

Slow heat up,slow run,collected to 440mls.
I'm more curious about the formula question and spices used in the examples.
Just thought I'd share my experience.
Any help or direction is appreciated

[still_stirrin]

… I understand the recipe is tailored to each person's liking…

Indeed. A gin tends to be a “personalized” spirit … “to each … their own”, customized to the distiller’s preference. There is no “right” or “wrong”.

… When you are using say 12 spices is there more to the formula for amounts? Or, does one just willy-nilly spices together and keep notes.

Balance and character. Using more botanicals will add complexity. But using them “willy-nilly” can get things out of balance. Hence, the logarithmic (“X over”) formula. It’s to get you started in the right direction. But, “creative license” is your opportunity, so experiment and find your favorite/signature recipe. But definitely keep notes so you can repeat it.

… Are Certain spices in the x/10 row in that row for a reason? Or, is this just an example.

They’re so-aligned that way because of the intensity of the flavor (and aroma) character that will be extracted, in an effort to keep the contributions “balanced”, at least for the beginning. This allows the distiller to adjust according to his/her preference.

… Every example I see categorizes the same spices in the same row. Are these spices commonly not used as the dominant spice?

Any help or direction is appreciated.

Again, because the spices/botanicals are in the “same row” indicates the relative contribution (by weight) those will add to the gin. So, you can adjust up or down according how you want your (signature) gin to taste.

Incidentally, Odin suggests starting simply, ie - using just a few botanicals in addition to the fundamentals (juniper & coriander). And I have found I prefer my gins that way. I don’t make cocktails with my gin, I prefer it “on the rocks” with a lime zest. For me, it is a fantastic summer beverage; clean, crisp, and refreshing. It isn’t sweet, so it doesn’t make me thirsty … just satisfied. And ironically, it doesn’t make me inebriated either, so I can sip it all afternoon long without drinking too much. Very satisfying.

Just one man’s opinion. There are many gin makers here and they all have their preferences. So, wait for them to join in. And remember, “there’s no right or wrong” as long as you make what you like.
ss

p.s. - edit to add: When making a gin, or at least until you’ve made it often enough to know what you like, don’t make large batches. Start with a liter or 2. Making 5 gallons at a time (like you would a whiskey) is quite fool-hardy. Start small and find your “signature”, then repeat it a few times so you know exactly how you did it. Then, if you find yourself (and your friends) consuming it rapidly, you can increase batch size. But be sure to scale the process accordingly, as Odin has advised.

[Bradster68]

… I understand the recipe is tailored to each person's liking…

Indeed. A gin tends to be a “personalized” spirit … “to each … their own”, customized to the distiller’s preference. There is no “right” or “wrong”.

… When you are using say 12 spices is there more to the formula for amounts? Or, does one just willy-nilly spices together and keep notes.

Balance and character. Using more botanicals will add complexity. But using them “willy-nilly” can get things out of balance. Hence, the logarithmic (“X over”) formula. It’s to get you started in the right direction. But, “creative license” is your opportunity, so experiment and find your favorite/signature recipe. But definitely keep notes so you can repeat it.

… Are Certain spices in the x/10 row in that row for a reason? Or, is this just an example.

They’re so-aligned that way because of the intensity of the flavor (and aroma) character that will be extracted, in an effort to keep the contributions “balanced”, at least for the beginning. This allows the distiller to adjust according to his/her preference.

… Every example I see categorizes the same spices in the same row. Are these spices commonly not used as the dominant spice?

Any help or direction is appreciated.

Again, because the spices/botanicals are in the “same row” indicates the relative contribution (by weight) those will add to the gin. So, you can adjust up or down according how you want your (signature) gin to taste.

Incidentally, Odin suggests starting simply, ie - using just a few botanicals in addition to the fundamentals (juniper & coriander). And I have found I prefer my gins that way. I don’t make cocktails with my gin, I prefer it “on the rocks” with a lime zest. For me, it is a fantastic summer beverage; clean, crisp, and refreshing. It isn’t sweet, so it doesn’t make me thirsty … just satisfied. And ironically, it doesn’t make me inebriated either, so I can sip it all afternoon long without drinking too much. Very satisfying.

Just one man’s opinion. There are many gin makers here and they all have their preferences. So, wait for them to join in. And remember, “there’s no right or wrong” as long as you make what you like.
ss

p.s. - edit to add: When making a gin, or at least until you’ve made it often enough to know what you like, don’t make large batches. Start with a liter or 2. Making 5 gallons at a time (like you would a whiskey) is quite fool-hardy. Start small and find your “signature”, then repeat it a few times so you know exactly how you did it. Then, if you find yourself (and your friends) consuming it rapidly, you can increase batch size. But be sure to scale the process accordingly, as Odin has advised.

Perfect. Thanks for clarifying. I figured there was more to the formula than what I thought.
Iv made odins a few times now and love it on ice.
I'm not a guy who usually adds anything to what I'm drinking. Except ice.
I don't see myself ever making a 12 botanical gin.....but ya never know .
I'll probably play around with a few basic ingredients (ones I get locally and easily).
So for now I'm only doing the one litre recipe as to get a feel for the taste each spice brings. Iv already found out a little less cardamon and how powerful half a staranise is.
I'm kinda ocd for keeping notes and details so that shouldn't be a problem.
Thanks again SS

[howie]

i've put star anise & cardamon in the 1/100 column, so in 1L of 40%, if required in a recipe, i only use 0.16gms now (up from 0.12gms originally)
one recipe i use has now got 0.24gms/L of cardamon, but that's a spicy gin.
(i only weigh the cardamon seeds after extraction from the pod)
i assume you have got a digital scale that goes down to 0.00gms.

[Bradster68]

i've put star anise & cardamon in the 1/100 column, so in 1L of 40%, if required in a recipe, i only use 0.16gms now (up from 0.12gms originally)
one recipe i use has now got 0.24gms/L of cardamon, but that's a spicy gin.
(i only weigh the cardamon seeds after extraction from the pod)
i assume you have got a digital scale that goes down to 0.00gms.

Yes I do have a scale for splitting grams. Being new at this,and sampling one seed of cardamon thinking how strong can it be.....well I was way off.
It'll probably take some time for me to figure this out.
But already I see the potential to create something unique with very subtle changes in recipes. Go figure, another rabbit hole in this hobby.

[The Booze Pipe]

i've put star anise & cardamon in the 1/100 column, so in 1L of 40%, if required in a recipe, i only use 0.16gms now (up from 0.12gms originally)
one recipe i use has now got 0.24gms/L of cardamon, but that's a spicy gin.
(i only weigh the cardamon seeds after extraction from the pod)
i assume you have got a digital scale that goes down to 0.00gms.

Yes I do have a scale for splitting grams. Being new at this,and sampling one seed of cardamon thinking how strong can it be.....well I was way off.
It'll probably take some time for me to figure this out.
But already I see the potential to create something unique with very subtle changes in recipes. Go figure, another rabbit hole in this hobby.

I dug up this topic from my research viewtopic.php?t=73049
Maybe you saw it.

Also some good info being discussed here viewtopic.php?t=92465

I was told to save the anise for absinthe. I did and never missed it! It’s just too strong of a botanical for gin. The cardamom comes across as floural. And I appreciate the citrus of the coriander.

[Bradster68]

i've put star anise & cardamon in the 1/100 column, so in 1L of 40%, if required in a recipe, i only use 0.16gms now (up from 0.12gms originally)
one recipe i use has now got 0.24gms/L of cardamon, but that's a spicy gin.
(i only weigh the cardamon seeds after extraction from the pod)
i assume you have got a digital scale that goes down to 0.00gms.

Yes I do have a scale for splitting grams. Being new at this,and sampling one seed of cardamon thinking how strong can it be.....well I was way off.
It'll probably take some time for me to figure this out.
But already I see the potential to create something unique with very subtle changes in recipes. Go figure, another rabbit hole in this hobby.

I dug up this topic from my research viewtopic.php?t=73049
Maybe you saw it.

Also some good info being discussed here viewtopic.php?t=92465

I was told to save the anise for absinthe. I did and never missed it! It’s just too strong of a botanical for gin. The cardamom comes across as floural. And I appreciate the citrus of the coriander.

Your absolutely right. I will save it for the absinthe. If I can ever find the time. also Bushman recipes are bang on. But actually iv been doing Odin's so far. Iv got lots of fresh berries I picked and can't wait to compare them to the store bought ones.
My life is hectic with house addition and cabin rentals,so the rabbit hole is deep,but these sidetracks keep me from falling too fast. This is my last crazy year and things will finally be wrapped up. So I'm looking forward to concentrating on the rabbit hole.

[The Booze Pipe]

I found this cool graphic to help with flavors
viewtopic.php?t=48221
Have you decided on a recipe yet?