Shady's Sugar Shine

[Zacher]

So the stripping run is kind of like a mini-spirit run? Hold back the tails and cut it off as soon as they are present?

[NZChris]

So the stripping run is kind of like a mini-spirit run? Hold back the tails and cut it off as soon as they are present?

Not in my shed.

I take off a foreshot, then run until the total low wines collection reaches 40%. Some stop at 50% then add water.

[Tōtōchtin]

So the stripping run is kind of like a mini-spirit run? Hold back the tails and cut it off as soon as they are present?

Not in my shed.

I take off a foreshot, then run until the total low wines collection reaches 40%. Some stop at 50% then add water.

I thought you would run until total low wines were at 28% ,because you didn't want to add water that would dilute your work.
Tōtō

[MooseMan]

So the stripping run is kind of like a mini-spirit run? Hold back the tails and cut it off as soon as they are present?

Not in my shed.

I take off a foreshot, then run until the total low wines collection reaches 40%. Some stop at 50% then add water.

I thought you would run until total low wines were at 28% ,because you didn't want to add water that would dilute your work.
Tōtō

As Shady's is intended for neutrals Toto, running deep into the tails does more harm than good, it's better to stop before the more bitter components come over, and add water for the spirit run to clean up what you've stripped even more.
Water helps to hold back tails.

[Tōtōchtin]

That makes sense, I guess I should wait to post until I had my coffee first. Thank you.
Toto

[Zacher]

So the stripping run is kind of like a mini-spirit run? Hold back the tails and cut it off as soon as they are present?

Not in my shed.

I take off a foreshot, then run until the total low wines collection reaches 40%. Some stop at 50% then add water.

Could you run out the rest to use as feints in a whiskey?

[MooseMan]

So the stripping run is kind of like a mini-spirit run? Hold back the tails and cut it off as soon as they are present?

Not in my shed.

I take off a foreshot, then run until the total low wines collection reaches 40%. Some stop at 50% then add water.

Could you run out the rest to use as feints in a whiskey?

Actually, what I do is run the late tails from that type of wash, into another vessel, to be kept for an all feints run when there's enough.

[Tōtōchtin]

So the stripping run is kind of like a mini-spirit run? Hold back the tails and cut it off as soon as they are present?

Not in my shed.

I take off a foreshot, then run until the total low wines collection reaches 40%. Some stop at 50% then add water.

I thought you would run until total low wines were at 28% ,because you didn't want to add water that would dilute your work.
Tōtō

As Shady's is intended for neutrals Toto, running deep into the tails does more harm than good, it's better to stop before the more bitter components come over, and add water for the spirit run to clean up what you've stripped even more.
Water helps to hold back tails.

After my coffee I would think you are leaving behind alcohol. The off flavors you would leave behind taking tight cuts on the spirit run. Never been around a neutral run so that's my thinking without hands on experience.
T

[MooseMan]

Yes totally correct Toto, if you stop a strip run too early, your are leaving alcohol behind.
So what I do is (And this sounds more complex than it is) strip until I feel the tails are getting really bitter and nasty, then call that done for the "Neutral strip" of low wines, usually around 40-45% ABV total.
I then switch to a "Feints" jug and continue to strip until I'm at 10% at the spout. All of that will eventually be run as an all feints neutral when I have around 10gal to make it worth while doing.

[PoolGuy]

I have been following this thread with interest. My goal is a nice clean neutral, starting with old reliable SSS. I apologize if this is more of a distilling question than a SSS recipe question, but it is SSS we are talking about.

Originally I was stripping down to 20% off the spout, yielding low wines around ~40%. Knowing that I was leaving behind alcohol, I now strip down to 10% off the spout, yielding ~35% low wines. I don't bother discarding foreshots, leaving that task for the spirit run. I then typically dilute down to maybe 23% - 27%, giving me a charge that fills my boiler up to maybe 7/8 full (thus leaving a bit of headroom).

My spirit run is low and slow in a packed column, pulling off cuts at 95%-96%. The cuts can be quite tight and predictable batch to batch. Tails appear nicely "all of a sudden". I save foreshots for starter/cleaning fluid, collect heads and tails for feints, and save the hearts for vodka/gin/"whisky"/etc.

So my strips are hard, fast, deep (10%) and carefree. My spirit run is where I take my time.

This thread suggests that I spend more time on my strips, discarding fores and even making some rough tail cuts.

Question: Would discarding fores and not going as deep with my strips improve my product? Or can I continue to put the separation burden on the spirit run?

Question: Is it appropriate to dilute my low wine charge down to 25% or so? Thus "holding back tails"?

I am getting good product, but always looking to improve!

[NZChris]

So the stripping run is kind of like a mini-spirit run? Hold back the tails and cut it off as soon as they are present?

Not in my shed.

I take off a foreshot, then run until the total low wines collection reaches 40%. Some stop at 50% then add water.

I thought you would run until total low wines were at 28% ,because you didn't want to add water that would dilute your work.
Tōtō

This is sugar shine, not whiskey.

[NZChris]

So the stripping run is kind of like a mini-spirit run? Hold back the tails and cut it off as soon as they are present?

Not in my shed.

I take off a foreshot, then run until the total low wines collection reaches 40%. Some stop at 50% then add water.

Could you run out the rest to use as feints in a whiskey?

Sacrilege. I wouldn't dilute my whiskey flavors with sugar shine.

I have run it out and added it to the next still charge, but only because I run a preheater which is stripping more alcohol than the main pot by that stage. When there is nothing in the preheater, I just shut down at 40%.

[shadylane]

I strip a sugar wash until a film of oil begins to appear on top the low-wines.

[Zacher]

Reporting back on my first attempt, the pH stabilized around 3.9 so I let it run out without adding any more pickling lime. Left it in the garage at about 80F over the weekend and when I tested it yesterday it was at .995. Smells great so I think I got a clean fermentation and can't wait to run it. Will strip with slight reflux and then spirit with packed column and as much reflux as possible. So far, so good!

[deanodeano]

Can someone please explain the chemistry/science regarding how the multivitamins slow down the fermentation?

[Zacher]

Can someone please explain the chemistry/science regarding how the multivitamins slow down the fermentation?

The multivits provide nutrients for the yeast so you get a full fermentation. Not sure I saw where they slow it down?

[deanodeano]

OK, regardless, I am curious about the science behind vitamins helping in the fermentation process,

[kennstminet]

Here are 800plus pages to read. This should include answers for you.
https://vdoc.pub/documents/fermentation ... t6vgcm1g20

[shadylane]

So the stripping run is kind of like a mini-spirit run? Hold back the tails and cut it off as soon as they are present?

Not in my shed.

I take off a foreshot, then run until the total low wines collection reaches 40%. Some stop at 50% then add water.

I do it different.
Instead of having a cutoff point based on ABV, I let the wash decide when it's time to end the stripping run. I use the sense of smell and sight to decide when to stop.
The only time I normally use a proof and trailes hydrometer is for getting the bottling ABV right.

[Zacher]

Would you consider using feints from other runs in the spirit run? I have about a gallon of different whiskeys and some rum feints.

[Yummyrum]

Would you consider using feints from other runs in the spirit run? I have about a gallon of different whiskeys and some rum feints.

In my experience , you can’t clean up Rum feints in a packed reflux column . They will always have a light Rum flavour . I use this to advantage and just do an all Rum feints run .

However , I wouldn’t put it in for a neutral . But I guess it all comes down to what you like .

[Zacher]

Thanks Yummy, I was kinda expecting that for the rum but wanted to ask anyway. What about all grain, bourbon or all corn feints?

[NZChris]

Thanks Yummy, I was kinda expecting that for the rum but wanted to ask anyway. What about all grain, bourbon or all corn feints?

If you want to know what to do with your flavored feints, there are quite a few good threads already. I don't put them in my neutral because the flavors will be there to stay, whether I like it or not. The result would be more like vodka, but a bottle of vodka will survive in my drinks cabinet for years.

[Zacher]

Thanks Yummy, I was kinda expecting that for the rum but wanted to ask anyway. What about all grain, bourbon or all corn feints?

If you want to know what to do with your flavored feints, there are quite a few good threads already. I don't put them in my neutral because the flavors will be there to stay, whether I like it or not. The result would be more like vodka, but a bottle of vodka will survive in my drinks cabinet for years.

So now I have to ask a newbie question. What is the difference between sugar shine and vodka? Isn't vodka considered a neutral as well?

[Salt Must Flow]

Thanks Yummy, I was kinda expecting that for the rum but wanted to ask anyway. What about all grain, bourbon or all corn feints?

If you want to know what to do with your flavored feints, there are quite a few good threads already. I don't put them in my neutral because the flavors will be there to stay, whether I like it or not. The result would be more like vodka, but a bottle of vodka will survive in my drinks cabinet for years.

So now I have to ask a newbie question. What is the difference between sugar shine and vodka? Isn't vodka considered a neutral as well?

When I search "definition of vodka", I get answers like this. American vodka typically has an ABV of around 40%. Potato vodka, wheat vodka, and grape vodka. A colorless liquor of neutral spirits distilled from a mash (as of rye or wheat). Sugar shine is just so easy to make, no mashing involved.

[Zacher]

When I search "definition of vodka", I get answers like this. American vodka typically has an ABV of around 40%. Potato vodka, wheat vodka, and grape vodka. A colorless liquor of neutral spirits distilled from a mash (as of rye or wheat). Sugar shine is just so easy to make, no mashing involved.

So Salty, just to push a little on the semantics, would you then say sugar shine is a "mash-less Vodka"? They are both still considered "neutral" right? Both are ethanol, just one distilled from simple sugar and the other distilled from converted sugar from starch? Sorry guys, I'm a little anal retentive...

[Saltbush Bill]

Would you consider using feints from other runs in the spirit run? I have about a gallon of different whiskeys and some rum feints.

Personally I wouldn't , keep them to run with washes or mashes of the same kind, rum fients with rum wash, whisky with whisky.

you can’t clean up Rum feints in a packed reflux column .

I'm with Yummy there , with Mollasess Rum you wont get rid of just refluxing, its the taste/ smell that just keeps on giving.

What is the difference between sugar shine and vodka? Isn't vodka considered a neutral as well?

Yep I'm confused to , always have been, it seems to depend on who you ask, which of the many definitions that you google, which country that definition is given for or is from, is it a legal definition for a certain country ,or just an overall dictionary definition.
Ask 20 people you will likely get 20 different answers.
To me Neutral is "neutral" as flavorless as I can get, Vodka to some people seems to be something else to others its not.
Then you have all of the little craft distilleries and bigger commercial places trying to put their own twist on what "vodka" should be so that they can gain some marketing ground.

[shadylane]

So now I have to ask a newbie question. What is the difference between sugar shine and vodka? Isn't vodka considered a neutral as well?

Good sugar shine and vodka are close enough that legal rules would be needed to separate the two.
I read somewhere that vodka has a tiny amount of the character left from what it was made from, and neutral spirits are supposed to have nothing.
Sugar shine depends on a whole bunch of things, it's some were between Icky and neutral.

[NZChris]

Some vodkas are far from neutral. This ancient version would have had as much flavor as gin.

viewtopic.php?t=92136

[Zacher]

Thanks for humoring me about that one. I'll go with Sugar Shine and leave it at that!

My 12G is still in the fridge. Hoping to do the stripping run soon. Will report back.