PH of 3.8? WTF

[Hellnoh2o]

Ok, so going to put this out there. I have 10 gallons of wash that I put together with some back set of a previous wash. When I started it is was haulin ass but now it has stopped. I did add some Apple pie moonshine that tasted terrible to it maybe that's what caused it to nose dive. But it was in the beginning with everything else. Any ways guess from what I have been reading I need to add some baking soda to bring the ph back up right?

[StillLearning1]

What was the SG/FG?

What type of wash did you make?

What was the alcohol content of the apple pie you added to it?

[Jimbo]

3.8 pH is normal after ferment starts. Your problem isint pH related

[GrassHopper]

+1 on what StillLearning1 said. You added apple pie to a fermenting wash? How much....what alcohol content? At what point did you add it?

[Hellnoh2o]

I added the Apple pie at the beginning, this was not a well thought out action. It was about a gallon of 60 proof. My sg was 1.100 and when I taste it I can still taste the sugar and honey in it so I know there is work to be done. Going to bring up.the ph and start again I guess. I hate to throw out 10 gallons of potential

[StillLearning1]

I don't know much about much but my guess is there was too much alcohol for the yeast to handle.

[Kegg_jam]

I don't think the ph is a show stopper. Would have been better to throw the apple pie in the boiler after your ferment was done. Not sure your best options.

[InglisHill]

You could try splitting the batch and diluting it down a bit, or, some turbo yeast may ferment it out.

I didn't just suggest that did I?

Yep, it seems I did.

[GrassHopper]

I agree with Jimbo. A PH of 3.8 is low, but not enough to kill your yeast. I have started many ferments at 4 and they finished. But, the fact remains that you have a stalled ferment if still sweet to taste. Which indicates it is not finished. Well, you have nothing to lose but go forward and try to get it to finish out or run it sweet.....which could cause problems with your still. So, add some calcium carbonate, I have used oyster shells (a bag from the feed store will last you forever). Quick lime (calcium oxide) or Hydrated lime (calcium hydroxide) works as well. I avoid sodium based bases, but that is just me. Others use it with success. I currently use postassium hydroxide. I would shoot for 4.5 and wait for something to start ( about 12 hrs) and if nothing then re-pitch the yeast. What is your current gravity? That will tell how far into the ferment you are.

[InglisHill]

I agree with Jimbo. A PH of 3.8 is low, but not enough to kill your yeast. I have started many ferments at 4 and they finished. But, the fact remains that you have a stalled ferment if still sweet to taste. Which indicates it is not finished. Well, you have nothing to lose but go forward and try to get it to finish out or run it sweet.....which could cause problems with your still. So, add some calcium carbonate, I have used oyster shells (a bag from the feed store will last you forever). Quick lime (calcium oxide) or Hydrated lime (calcium hydroxide) works as well. I avoid sodium based bases, but that is just me. Others use it with success. I currently use postassium hydroxide. I would shoot for 4.5 and wait for something to start ( about 12 hrs) and if nothing then re-pitch the yeast. What is your current gravity? That will tell how far into the ferment you are.

1.10 he said just up there a bit

[Jimbo]

A pH of 3.8 is NOT low after fermentation is underway. 3.1 would be low be still survivable for yeasts. Mashes should be done at 5.2 to 5.6. But after you pitch yeast it will drop to 3.8-4.2 pretty quick. Thats perfectly normal. If youre heavy handed on the backset, or making a sour beer, it will ferment all the way down to 3.0. Sour beers are often 3.1-3.3 pH and they fermented out just fine.

Seems there's a LOT of confusion on here about how pH works throughout our process. Someone needs to write an education post on pH, please, maybe one of our chemists.

Hellno's problem is likely that he dumped a gallon of apple pie shine in with his ferment But he also didnt say what his wash was. If a sugar wash it's gonna needs something for nutrient or it will stall.

[Jimbo]

Slides 6 and 15 are helpful. http://www.weyermann.de/downloads/pdf/W ... H_2010.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

Dont forget to defizz the test sample by shaking or whisking before measuring pH. The carbonic acid from the CO2 will hork up your reading.

[Kegg_jam]

So I was wondering....

Supposing the ferment stopped because of the added alc or whatever. If the sweet ferment was stripped wouldn't the left over backset then be sweet and fermentable again if diluted and PH adjusted...?

[Jimbo]

So I was wondering....

Supposing the ferment stopped because of the added alc or whatever. If the sweet ferment was stripped wouldn't the left over backset then be sweet and fermentable again if diluted and PH adjusted...?

haha sure. And it would be inverted to glucose and fructose as well, which helps. Just be sure to aerate the hell out of it again, since boiling drives out all the O's

[Brutal]

Whatever you do, GO EASY ON THE BAKING SODA. Go slow a little at a time and mix carefully. Give it time to work. DO NOT get aggressive or impatient when adding baking soda! You do and you're gonna need more than a mop. Don't ask how I know...

This wash started out with too high of a gravity. Adding in the apple pie on top of that means you brewed up a wash with a higher than normal potential abv. If that gets down to 1.00 that's 12.9% plus the alcohol from the Apple pie. The high % might have killed your yeast. If they do make it that high they will definitively burn up some nutrients.

I would try adding a starter of 1118, a couple handfuls of oyster shells, and some kind of good nutrient.

[planohog]

I added about 3/4 tbl spoon to 12 gallons, it was 3.8 came up to 4.0 and the action started right up.
thanks for the warning.

[Bolverk]

I added about 3/4 tbl spoon to 12 gallons, it was 3.8 came up to 4.0 and the action started right up.
thanks for the warning.

Using baking soda is kinda outdated info, it has a lot of sodium and can hinder your fermentation. Instead use pickling lime (canning second of your local grocery store). Not only is it more effective, but it won't cause other issues.

[planohog]

Good To know, ill get some next time , checked on it today nearly 1.000

[shadylane]

I added the Apple pie at the beginning, this was not a well thought out action. It was about a gallon of 60 proof. My sg was 1.100 and when I taste it I can still taste the sugar and honey in it so I know there is work to be done. Going to bring up.the ph and start again I guess. I hate to throw out 10 gallons of potential

Was the 10 gallon wash OG 1.100 after adding a gallon @ 60 proof.
If it was, this sounds like a yeast torture test.

Side note, Ya I'm answering a 10 year old post.

[Pure Old Possum Piss]

What in the world possessed you to add some apple pie to the working ferment?

[30xs]

I added the Apple pie at the beginning, this was not a well thought out action. It was about a gallon of 60 proof. My sg was 1.100 and when I taste it I can still taste the sugar and honey in it so I know there is work to be done. Going to bring up.the ph and start again I guess. I hate to throw out 10 gallons of potential

Was the 10 gallon wash OG 1.100 after adding a gallon @ 60 proof.
If it was, this sounds like a yeast torture test.

Side note, Ya I'm answering a 10 year old post.

[shadylane]

How much sugar would be needed to raise the SG to 1.100 ?
Starting with 9 gal water and a gallon @ 60 proof.
Alcohol is much lighter than water so the mixture before adding sugar is going to be considerably lower than 1.000
I bet one of the math literate folks here could guesstimate how many pounds per gallon of sugar was needed.

Reading between the lines I think the OP added the 60 proof to a wash that was already OG 1.100 but just for shits and grins let's assume he started water and alcohol.

[SW_Shiner]

How much sugar would be needed to raise the SG to 1.100 ?
Starting with 9 gal water and a gallon @ 60 proof.
Alcohol is much lighter than water so the mixture before adding sugar is going to be considerably lower than 1.000
I bet one of the math literate folks here could guesstimate how many pounds per gallon of sugar was needed.

After some quick maths,
Not taking into account rounding and any else that will affect the gravity, or volume, like contraction/temp.
9gal water + the 1 gal of 60p = ~10gal @ 3%ABV with SG 0.995
10kg sugar to raise to SG 1.100. Or about 2.2 pounds of sugar per gallon.

Rough but i think its close at least, unless i've forgotten something.

[shadylane]

Thanks for the math. I was thinking the added alcohol would have made a bigger difference.
Guess that proves math out performs guesses.

[SW_Shiner]

So did I at first. The poof and gal threw me for a bit.
I have noticed that a lot of the sugarhead recipes that come from elsewhere seem to fall pretty close to 2-3 pounds per gallons of sugar. Makes me wonder if some people tried to take info from here to make them but got mixed up with all grain recommendations for volumes.

[shadylane]

I have noticed that a lot of the sugarhead recipes that come from elsewhere seem to fall pretty close to 2-3 pounds per gallons of sugar. Makes me wonder if some people tried to take info from here to make them but got mixed up with all grain recommendations for volumes.

Just my 2 cents worth, somewhere around 1.5 pounds per gallon of "fermentable" sugar is good.
More than that can cause drama. Because yeast will begin making make more alcohol and CO2 than is good for it.
Adding extra alcohol to the wash water like the OP might have done would make drama more likely.
As the abv of a fermenting wash increases, yeasts tolerance to heat, low pH and nutrients becomes progressively more critical.