Home Distiller

joeymac wrote:Sugar head...uses grains for flavor, body and nutrients but then sugar is added directly to the wash to boost the alcohol content...A sugar head can use the "spent" grains from a previous all grain wash to flavor the next wash and then sugar is thrown in to allow the yeast to continue making alcohol.

Just a bit of clarification...the added sugar doesn't directly boost alcohol content...it increases the fermentable sugars.

For example, if you add sugar enough to raise the OG to 1.100, then it likely won't all ferment out/dry, leaving residual sugars in the ferment. But, adding sugar to a sugarhead will add fermentable material for the yeast to consume to the extent that they can (within their metabolism and the environmental conditions would allow, i.e. - alcohol tolerance, temperature, pH, and nutrients available).

RedwoodHillBilly wrote:
Use the google search at the top of the page. Click on HD Google Search, then add a space then sugar head. You will be rewarded with many threads.

Thanks ( again ) RedwoodHillBilly. I've been using the site search tool, and not the google one. This will help me a lot in the future. "

joeymac wrote:
A sugar head can use the "spent" grains from a previous all grain wash to flavor the next wash and then sugar is thrown in to allow the yeast to continue making alcohol.

Thanks joemac. The specific section of quote above cleared up some stuff I was reading here and in some other threads. It's all becoming more clear. I must be sobering up I just picked up ingredients to start a 15 gallons ferment of Honey Bear Bourbon, and now I think I will try this sugar head method once that ferment is spent. Time to grab a drink and do some reading up on this.

You'll also see people refer to a "gumball" or "gumball head" which as I understand it is to use the spent grains from an all grain mash/wash for flavor and adding sugar for the yeast to consume and produce alcohol. I believe this specific term comes from a tried and true recipe from Jimbo.

After reading this thread➡➡ http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 11&t=66219 about how oats smooth a drink,
stopped at the grain shop and will add oats to the next run of Honey Bear and apply them per the recipe option. Lets see what they do.
Back in a week or so.

Still Life wrote:After reading this thread➡➡ http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 11&t=66219 about how oats smooth a drink,
stopped at the grain shop and will add oats to the next run of Honey Bear and apply them per the recipe option. Lets see what they do.
Back in a week or so.

Recommendation. Add the oats, instead of substituting. If you are using cracked corn, then sub. But with corn meal, and I know that's what you are using, you have plenty of room in the 'ol fermenter for the extra grains, and you won't lose any corn sweetness.

You just caught me in time, SoCD! Thanks! Yep. Fine corn meal.

ShineonCrazyDiamond wrote:
Recommendation. Add the oats, instead of substituting. If you are using cracked corn, then sub. But with corn meal, and I know that's what you are using, you have plenty of room in the 'ol fermenter for the extra grains, and you won't lose any corn sweetness.

Hi SCD. Which group does Flaked Maze fall into? Would it be like corn meal, where I would add oats, or with cracked corn where I would substitute with oats. Thanks.

Well my fourth batch of HBB is happily bubbling away This one and the previous two have had consistent mash results, either I'm getting better at mashing or this is just an easy recipe to get right,(not really sure that it's me). I've hit 1.073 SG on all of those batches with about a little less than 2lbs of combined grain per gal of water. Now that I've proved that this is a repeatable recipe for me it's time to play around with it, going to add oats to the next batch and buy a few more barrels.

OVZ

In my time away from distilling I've been getting my ingredients to make a hella stock of this bourbon.

I now have enough to make 300 gals of mash, who knows how much HBB. I guess it all depends on cuts.

Soon as I get my new rig built I'll be underway, looking forward to hearing the thumper thump, propane blasting and the smell of likker running from the worm.

OVZ, how long will you keep the HBB in the 5 gal barrel?

Shine0n wrote:
OVZ, how long will you keep the HBB in the 5 gal barrel?

Thinking about a year, but I will be tasting as it progresses

OVZ

This recipe is next on my list. Sounds tasty and I have a new 3 gallon barrel waiting.

ShineonCrazyDiamond wrote:Honey Bear Bourbon

7lbs cracked corn ( or 5 lbs corn meal!)*
.5lb Honey malt
1 lb white wheat malt
1 lb red wheat malt
1lb pale malt
Handful of oyster shells

*optional- substitute 1 lb of rolled oats for 1 lb of corn/meal if you prefer, for more mouth feel.

Put the corn, honey malt, and oats if using, into a 6 gallon bucket. Fill bucket up with boiling water. Wrap in blankets, stirring as frequent as you like. Mine takes about 3 or 4 hours this way to naturally hit mashing temp, so I stir 2 or 3 times during this time.

The honey malt helps the corn keep thin while gelling (except corn meal. Ain't nothing thinning that out. You are literally creating polenta), and adds a front end honey flavour. It's awesome.

Anyways, when the mix hits around 153, add your two wheat malts and pale malt. Wrap up again, for a couple hours. When done, chill the wort, add oyster shells (ph autopilot), and pitch yeast. Done.

I always strip and spirit, but the single foot head to hearts transition will have you lapping it off the spout!

-SCD

What type of yeast and how much? Also, what is it with the oyster shells. What do they do and where do you get them?
I'd be keen to give this recipe a go.
Cheers.

Hey ausibatla! Just got done responding to you on your other thread.

Honey Bear:
Regular old baker's yeast is what I use. Yep, the stuff from the grocer like Fleischmann's, Red Star, whatever. Nothing fancy. It does like a warm 30~32°C environment. But will work cooler in a pinch. Just a little slower.
About 80~100 grams, or 1/3 cup for us Yankees --it's cheap.

The oyster shells are a pH buffer. If the mash is too acidic, the shells dissolve and bring up the pH to a good level and stop dissolving. Perfect self-regulation.
I bought mine online https://www.amazon.com/Pounds-Natural-C ... ells&psc=1
They feed crushed oyster shells to poultry to strengthen eggshell formation, so farm suppliers may carry it. Just a small handful. I keep mine in a small brew bag in the mash for removal/re-use until gone. Been months of re-use so far.

Also, aerate your mash just before pitching the yeast. That's just whisking it till the liquid froths and has a small dissipating foam on top. Yeast needs oxygen for its aerobic phase.
After you pitch the yeast, LEAVE IT ALONE. No stirring or jostling or peeking required until it's done fermenting.

You're going to make a good bourbon if you go Honey Bear. Plus, with a proven recipe, it's easier to troubleshoot if you run into a problem.

+1

Honey Bear. Oats:

Took ShineonCrazy Diamond's advice and went with 1-lb. of additional oats. I use fine corn meal and have room for it.
Stick with the recipe's option corn replacement if using cracked corn.

Double blind test.
No oats Honey Bear vs. Oats Bear.
My wife had no idea what I was experimenting. She knew to serve #1 and #2 into Betty Boop or South Park shot glasses in either order, without any mixing.
Both samples were hearts of hearts.

BOOM there was no doubt.
Betty Boop.
#1 sample.
The oats.

A depth of throat coating ---and the word 'smooth' does it no justice. A washing sweetness. The grain is amplified. A nasal, eucalyptic quality.
I'm terrible at description, but the oats addition is polished perfection. I can't stop wanting more.

Try it, you guys. See what oats do to this drink.

Thanks, SoCD!

All of mine is on oak so I have no more white
Man I can wait to get back to local work, It's driving me fuckin crazy.

OtisT wrote:

ShineonCrazyDiamond wrote:
Recommendation. Add the oats, instead of substituting. If you are using cracked corn, then sub. But with corn meal, and I know that's what you are using, you have plenty of room in the 'ol fermenter for the extra grains, and you won't lose any corn sweetness.

Hi SCD. Which group does Flaked Maze fall into? Would it be like corn meal, where I would add oats, or with cracked corn where I would substitute with oats. Thanks.

Hey Otis! Sorry, just saw this post. If you are using flaked, I would treat it like corn meal. Just add the oats.

Still Life wrote:Honey Bear. Oats:

Took ShineonCrazy Diamond's advice and went with 1-lb. of additional oats. I use fine corn meal and have room for it.
Stick with the recipe's option corn replacement if using cracked corn.

Double blind test.
No oats Honey Bear vs. Oats Bear.
My wife had no idea what I was experimenting. She knew to serve #1 and #2 into Betty Boop or South Park shot glasses in either order, without any mixing.
Both samples were hearts of hearts.

BOOM there was no doubt.
Betty Boop.
#1 sample.
The oats.

A depth of throat coating ---and the word 'smooth' does it no justice. A washing sweetness. The grain is amplified. A nasal, eucalyptic quality.
I'm terrible at description, but the oats addition is polished perfection. I can't stop wanting more.

Try it, you guys. See what oats do to this drink.

Thanks, SoCD!

Hey Still life. Thanks for reporting back! Always nice to have experienced shared, but especially blind tests . I'm glad you liked it. It adds another depth for people wanting something nice to oak.

Glad you enjoyed!

You bet, SoCD.
I'm especially lucky I've got a bulk grain shop that carries all the ingredients.
When I tell them the myriad of grains are for bourbon and not "what beer are you making?" they look puzzled.
Oh, what those guys are missing!

ShineonCrazyDiamond wrote:
Hey Otis! Sorry, just saw this post. If you are using flaked, I would treat it like corn meal. Just add the oats.

Thanks SCD.

Still Life wrote:You bet, SoCD.
I'm especially lucky I've got a bulk grain shop that carries all the ingredients.
When I tell them the myriad of grains are for bourbon and not "what beer are you making?" they look puzzled.
Oh, what those guys are missing!

I usually tell them when they ask is that I'm making a bourbon style beer

OVZ

Couple of questions. I've been doing sugar washes for the last year and UJ's sour mash and have had very predictable results. Never cared for the stingy after bite. Saw this recipe and decided to give all grain a shot and this recipe seemed the one to start with. Ive mash 4 - 6 gallon buckets and dont feel like i'm getting the results I should based on what other members have wrote here. First 1 I followed the recipe to a T using the corn meal from the same place shineon bought his and all the other ingredients from my local brew shop. OG was 1.040 finished out in 2 days a little over 001. Used a pre packed whiskey distillers yeast form the brew shop. also used amylase enzyme from BSG which goes in at 165. Second batch little higher OG still finished out in 2 days. Water is definitly at 212 and comes to rest at 190 sits for 4 hours stirred 3 times pitch enzyme at 165 and other grains at 152 to 154 thins out like water. pitching yeast at 84. Only change on 3rd and 4th batches was I let set over night resting at 190 woke up to 148 to 150 and then added grains and enzyme and let rest all day till home from work and pitched a whiskey distillers yeast that I got in bulk and made a yeast bomb with some of the mash. Same results finished in maybe 3 days. I still let it set for 5 days but the results didnt change. Checked PH of my water with the paper strips and was a 6 to 6.5. Never finishes down to .099 never higher than 1.050. Not sure what to change in my method to achieve better results that I see on here or am I just expecting to much. Sugar washes are very predictable but feel like i'm all over on the all grain. Burned off 1st 2 batches and started off at 110 proof and ran to 40 proof in about 2 hours. sweet front bitter back taste. Running a mile hi stainless 8 gallon electric with just copper packing. Sorry so long just seeing if i'm the right track and what I can do to improve. Thanks for any help.

Sounds like you're "cooking" the corn and resting properly.

Is your 165°F amylase dose per its instructions?
Different brands have different dose temperature. (Mine is 152° to 158°F, for example.)

Member der wo here presented me with a chart indicating 140°F for the grains to go in, instead of the prescribed 153°. He showed they'll work longer at the lower temperature.

I use baker's yeast, but don't see the whiskey yeast as a problem. (I think your whiskey yeast is not a turbo & has enzymes in it too.)

I hit 1.06+ regularly. Others are hitting 1.065, so something looks faulty in your conversion, but can't put my finger on it.
I'm new at this, and my notes have betrayed me before, so I'm going to let others with more experience chime in with advice before I give bad.

It is a fast finisher for me, too. But I let mine sit for 5-6 days regardless.

Yes i'm definitely not hitting 1.060+ The first 2- whiskey yeast packets I used had nutrients added in and not a turbo. The 2 last batches were a 1lb bulk distillers whiskey yeast with no yeast nutrients thats why I did a yeast bomb with the mash before I pitched. The enzyme bottle says 165 or below. I was wondering if maybe it was my 50lb corn meal bag I bought and the age maybe. Always used cracked from the feed store on my ujs. I have enough grain for 2 more 6 gallon batches and just wondering what I could change to get different results before I start cooking it up again. Also did a iodine test and it seemed to look right from what I can tell that Ive read on here. Conversion just seems low even taking in to account the temp adjustment on the hydrometer. Ive also read about peoples yeast bombs just blowing up in a jar but mine bubbled and it worked but not like that. Also tried it with sugar water and same result. Just not sure what results to expect with this new territory.

renegade -
I use Bobs Redmill cornmeal (buy it in 25lbs bags), for enzymes I use both the hightemp and the GL from Enzymash - past few batches I've consistently hit 1.07ish using 2 lbs grain to 1 gal water. And playing a little Pink Floyd in the background helps the conversion

Good luck with your next batch

OVZ

Still Life wrote:Honey Bear. Oats:

Took ShineonCrazy Diamond's advice and went with 1-lb. of additional oats. I use fine corn meal and have room for it.
Stick with the recipe's option corn replacement if using cracked corn....

BOOM there was no doubt.
Betty Boop.
#1 sample.
The oats.

What kind of oats...
Rolled?
Steel Cut?
Oat Malt (milled fine or cracked)?

joeymac, I wish I knew more about the grain to help you.
The shop had a bin simply marked "oats", and we ran the whole grain through the mill just like the wheat.
Sorry.

If you had to grind them, they weren't flakes (which is scary I usually find there). Doubt they were rolled or steel cut, and I have never seen Malted oats at a brew store. I would guess you got whole oats? But again. Never seen anything but steam rolled oats at a hbs ( looks like, and basically is, oatmeal).

If you were at a brew shop, and they were whole... I think it's most likely they were Fawcett Malted Oats. They are not uncommon in well stocked brew shops.

If you were just at a grain / feed store ... then they were likely whole grain oats.