Jimbo's Electric Conversion

[Haus]

Great, Thank You Sir

[ELT]

It was available stateside on Amazon but after folks bought a few last week they jacked the price from $22 up to $35 or so. For that markup it's worth waiting 2 weeks to get it from Hong Kong.

[bearriver]

Perhaps not... I have one from eBay and the power supply to the fan blew up. I then filed for a replacement over a month ago, but still haven't received it. At least when buying from the Amazon store you can expect any issues to be resolved promptly.

[Haus]

So found the one on Amazon here:
http://www.amazon.com/RioRand-Rectifier ... +Regulator" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
Just below is the "frequently bought together".
Are the other two of these the correct components also?
I can just get all of it at once.
I don't mind paying the little extra to get it state-side.

[cranky]

So found the one on Amazon here:
http://www.amazon.com/RioRand-Rectifier ... +Regulator" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
Just below is the "frequently bought together".
Are the other two of these the correct components also?
I can just get all of it at once.
I don't mind paying the little extra to get it state-side.

I always find it funny what Amazon shows as "frequently bought together" It's a good indicator of just how many people are making their own "water" purifiers

[Hound Dog]

Yea right along with the "also bought" below that where you scroll through sanitary clamps, hydrometer and yeast for those "water purifiers"

[The KYChemist]

What makes me curious, is this... How many of those buying the "often bought together" purchases have their project come to fruition and/or do so safely? I've noticed that also.

[S-Cackalacky]

So found the one on Amazon here:
http://www.amazon.com/RioRand-Rectifier ... +Regulator" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow
Just below is the "frequently bought together".
Are the other two of these the correct components also?
I can just get all of it at once.
I don't mind paying the little extra to get it state-side.

If you look at the shipping dates, it would appear that it's probably being shipped directly to you from China anyway. It would appear that Amazon is just acting as middleman and sucking up an extra $15 profit. You could order 2 on ebay for an extra $5 and use the spare while you negotiate the exchange of a faulty one, or eat the cost. For $35 Amazon probably just absorbs the cost of any faulty controllers being returned and you wait another month (or more) for a new one which is probably also being shipped directly from China.

[cranky]

It's funny because I try not to buy anything from China, much less directly from China but if I do buy something directly from China I trust Amazon more as a middle man than ebay. Lately I have made a few minor purchases on amazon and it took less time to receive than anything from the US. Fortunately I haven't had to return or replace any of them so I can't say how that works out but I have had very good experiences from China via Amazon and Bing rewards gives me a $5 Amazon gift card every 20 days so my purchases on Amazon are basically free anyway.

[Haus]

OK, so a sanity spot check.

I want to get the controller and the element on Ebay/Amazon. The "frequently bought together" unless that was sarcasm and I am having a Sheldon moment.
I don't yet have the 220 wired on the breaker box and not to sure when that may happen, depends on availability of someone else, so I'll just proceed on the 110 assumption for now.
I do have 2 separate 110/20A circuits already in garage, direct home runs to the box.
I can still use that controller & element at a reduced rate on 110. (1375W-ish)
I can if I so choose add an extra 1500W element on the keg on a 110 with an on/off switch wired in to speed up the initial heat time then cut it off.
I want to use ULWD only.
Other than one other question does that sum it up cleanly?

220, what is the safe Amp on that once I get there? I see 5 220s in the box, four 30s, a 50 and a 60 already in it.

[Jimbo]

yes the new model 10,000W SCR, and the Camco 5500W ULWD is what you want.

You need a 25A breaker on 220 to drive one of those elements, 50A if you ever plan to drive 2 at the same time off the same circuit, and appropriate guage wire for whichever you choose.

[Haus]

So if memory and math serves me correctly, total possible wattage on the circuit would/could be 7000W (5500 + 1500) divided by 220 = 31.818.
Which is slightly over 10 gauge rated up to 30 Amp.
So 8 gauge would be appropriate, assuming maximum potential.

[Jimbo]

8 guage will be fine, 10 guage will be fine as well if your run isint too long. Its actually 5500W at 240. Youll get slightly less power at 220. My house is 238V. But we're splittin hairs here. 23 A, 25A for the one element.

You wont need both elements in one tank if youre at 220. I thought you were running 110, so using the second element to speed things along., 1375 is pretty low for a 15g tank. If you can get going on 220 right away, that 5500W screams at full power.

[Haus]

Yea, sorry after I read that, I thought that, it wasn't clear at all.
I was planning ahead to the 220.
I was calculating using both elements at 220.
So if one will do it, 1 5500W + 25A + 10 Gauge will actually get it done, that is what I will go with.

[ELT]

For those that would prefer to keep their entire install 240 volts - below is the link to a 240 volt 80mm cooling fan for $15.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/220V-230V-240V- ... 1819&rt=nc" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[Haus]

So I was just over at Hell, some call it Lowes, and the guy has now got me totally jacked up on the wire.

8/2 w/ground or 8/3 w/ground?

Found the 25A breaker finally.
Element, clamps... all showed up.
Controller delivery is a bit disappointing. July 9. Package tracking has it in a bottle cast adrift headed for Gilligan's Island where it will glance of it and make its way to Hawaii. Get caught in the current up to the Aleutians where the Alaskan Bush People will decide to keep it or send it on...

[still_stirrin]

So..Lowes...guy has now got me totally jacked up on the wire....8/2 w/ground or 8/3 w/ground?...

8 gage 2 conductor wire with a ground will work from your controller to the element. (+V, -V & ground)

You may need the 8 gage 3 conductor with ground from your dryer plug/breaker panel depending if it is a 220 V with a separate neutral (most homes are wired that way now per contemporary electrical codes). (+V, -V, neutral, and ground)
ss

[ELT]

Just to improve so unclear info above - you can't add the wattage of a 5500 watt 240 volt element and a 1500 watt 120 volt element (was totaled above at 7000 watts - it doesn't work that way when It comes to amperage).

If you have a 5500 watt element at 240 volts it will pull about 23 amps on EACH of two phases. For this you need 10 gauge wire which is good for up to 30 amps for NEC. Most wire is good for 300 volts or 600 volts - either will do fine for voltage.

Now that 120 volt 1500 watt element will draw 13 amps on ONE phase. You have to add this to one phase - 23+13=36 amps. For this you need 8 gauge. If you use copper THHN 90 C wire it is good for 55 amps. If you use NM-B or UF-B it is only good for 40 amps at 8 gauge. Google can assist with NEC amperage charts.

Now if you have found a 1500 watt 240 volt element then it is 23+6.25= about 30 amps. This is good with 10 gauge indefinitely. You can run the wire size RIGHT up to the maximum amperage all day long or for weeks with no heat gain - that is the purpose of the wire charts and is required in industrial wiring.

[Haus]

This is what I am thinking. Can I get another set of eyes. Have I missed or left out anything?
Have everything but the ammeter, not sure how that is wired.

[HDNB]

scrs are not wired that way. *edit* oops...i read scr, i typed scr...but the brain said SSR..please disregard, as i have not wired an SCR.

ammeters use a clamp (wire just passes through) (just one of them).... the wiring as drawn would be for a voltmeter

the plug to your boiler is backwards, the female goes on the hot side and the male goes on the boiler side. for safety when unplugged, if energized.

the rest looks good tho!!

[ELT]

Not all ammeters use clamps - the one sold by uxcell on amazon (30 amps version) is a straight pass thru - as in you cut the wire you are measuring and hook it to the 2 posts on the back of the meter - that's it.... Much better than having one with a dc shunt but not as good IMO as having one with a donut CT.


+1 on that plug - it would be like playing Russian Roulette with the electrons.... But they always win.

[Haus]

Plug corrected and added ground to 100 outlet.

[Swedish Pride]

I got all excited and blew my load early didn't I...

got a fancy 5500W element, got a 10,000 w SCR.
looked at the circuit board, the breaker on the sockets are only rated 20 amps

fack it, not the worst 230v here x 20 amp is 4600w, good enough
looked at cable and plugs and sockets, hang on just a sec... nothing rated higher than 13amp

for jebus sake 13 x 230v is 2990w, just over half of what I was shooting for
Looks like its going to be a long heatup time.
Actually can you even do that, run a 5500w element on a 13amp socket, or will i set the house on fire/ will it just keep tripping the fuse?

here all electricity is 230v , hot, neutral and ground, so not sure how to translate the "2 hot" part of the wiring in this discussion.

[Jimbo]

You shouldnt have 13A rated wire (guage?) if you have a 20 amp breaker. Thats a recipe for a fire.

Best thing you could do is add a 25A breaker to your panel and set up your gear right there with a short wire run of proper guage wire.

If you plug into that and turn it up youll blow your breaker. These things draw 23A at full power

[sltm1]

Jimbo, most houses are wired with 14/2, isn't that pretty light for that load no matter what size breaker you use? I'm learning about electricity one miserable little bit at a time. In fact I went to Home Depot yesterday, bought a 2000w 110v and after doing the calc's on the home page discovered even a 20 amp breaker would be a mite weak for that load....so the new element sit's in a drawer and now 1375 off a 5500 seems just fine to me, not like I have any pressing engagements when I run the still, so the slow heat up is what it is.

[Swedish Pride]

All sockets on one floor are on one 20A breaker, the wall sockets and plugs are 13A, the cable is 16A, go figure, not sure why it's done like this but then again i'm no electrician.

I have a 32A feed for the stove but there is no plug for it and don't want a loose cable hanging about with the kids in the house.
Even at that, I've been looking for plugs and sockets that are rated 25A but none to be had.

Would it be doable to plug it in the socket and have a inline 13A breaker, or is this a good way to kill myself?

[Hound Dog]

All sockets on one floor are on one 20A breaker, the wall sockets and plugs are 13A, the cable is 16A, go figure, not sure why it's done like this but then again i'm no electrician.

I have a 32A feed for the stove but there is no plug for it and don't want a loose cable hanging about with the kids in the house.
Even at that, I've been looking for plugs and sockets that are rated 25A but none to be had.

Would it be doable to plug it in the socket and have a inline 13A breaker, or is this a good way to kill myself?

By Emerald Isle, I don't guess you mean North Carolina USA? What the heck are they doing with electricity over there? I've seen some pretty sketchy stuff in the Caribbean before but you guys have been settled for a while right?
Do you have a picture of your electric panel?

[Swedish Pride]

Don't get me started man, coming from Sweden to here it's like a developing country, but sure not a hope of persuading my SO to move back to Sweden so here I am

I tried a pic but could not make out what it is myself, guess my 30€ phone is not up to the job.

Either way, I think I have two options.

1 have a cable from the stove, not mad about that idea.
2 get a 3000 w element, biggest we can have on the wall sockets, I know that it works as I have a 3kw kettle for the gallons of tea we consume in this house.

Not mad about 3000 w element but beats burning the house down.

[Jimbo]

Run a cable from the stove, 30A will power that 5500W element full tits. Use a female socket on the end of the wire, like this. Perfectly safe.

3 or 4 prong, dont matter, just buy the mate for the kettle side.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/2308421343 ... =82&chn=ps" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

[Hound Dog]

Run a cable from the stove, 30A will power that 5500W element full tits. Use a female socket on the end of the wire, like this. Perfectly safe.

3 or 4 prong, dont matter, just buy the mate for the kettle side.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/2308421343 ... =82&chn=ps" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

+1. Seems like it will be safer than the rest of the electric in the house