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LWTCS wrote:

Oldvine Zin wrote:50LBS of panela
Just under 5 Gal of dunder
Almost 30 Gal water

15brix.JPG

Had to break out the smaller Brute for the overflow. That brought me to my target of 15 brix and should ferment out at around 10% which is the upper end tolerance for the hefe yeast that I'm using.

hefe.JPG

This is my first time using White labs liquid yeast, really slow in proofing - 1 hour and still no bubbles, good old bakers is so much easier.

OVZ

Yep. Bakers will get you there best.

True, however if you're going for something particular to a certain yeast strain then you have to experiment a bit.
Variety is the spice!

Oh, that's what that other pesky scale is on my hydrometer is....now to convert to Baume and Balling so I can cover all my bases.

Seriously, I saw a start "brix" ( I work in SG) but didn't see a finish reading.

piperdave wrote:Oh, that's what that other pesky scale is on my hydrometers is....now to convert to Baume and Balling so I can cover all my bases.

Seriously, I saw a start "brix" ( I work in SG) but didn't see a finish reading.

Using Brix can be more informative, there's a little math to do but it's not difficult, there are websites with calculators, for example:
http://onebeer.net/refractometer.shtml" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

Last time I ran an AG batch I took the Brix before and after ferment and was confused that the final Brix was so high.
Then I was reminded to do the calculation for final Brix:

Starting Brix at 15, final Brix reading of 5 = final gravity of 0.994 and ABV of 8.6%

Anyone ever run across a lacto in their panela? Hoping it will add a nice flavor to the final product. Sitting at 1.040 around 87F right now using DADY.

Snackson wrote:Anyone ever run across a lacto in their panela? Hoping it will add a nice flavor to the final product. Sitting at 1.040 around 87F right now using DADY.

I use some gnarly looking dunder and I don't boil it so yeah, I've gotten some "infections" in my wash.
I pitch a ginormous amount of yeast so it's the most active bug in the swamp.
It does make your drop unique.

After seeing no activity today I was a little worried that I made the wrong choice in yeast or didn't pitch enough. This is my first time using liquid yeast and have come to learn that compared to dry there are fewer active cells in the liquid kind. So much slower yeast propagation and more needed, White labs recommends 1 vial per 5 gal. With a 35 gal ferment that would be 7 x $7.50, that works out to be more than a 50 lb bag of panela

I only pitched 1 vial for my 35 gal batch and after 24 hours Happy yeast


OVZ

Oldvine Zin wrote:After seeing no activity today I was a little worried that I made the wrong choice in yeast or didn't pitch enough. This is my first time using liquid yeast and have come to learn that compared to dry there are fewer active cells in the liquid kind. So much slower yeast propagation and more needed, White labs recommends 1 vial per 5 gal. With a 35 gal ferment that would be 7 x $7.50, that works out to be more than a 50 lb bag of panela

I only pitched 1 vial for my 35 gal batch and after 24 hours

hefeferm.JPG

Happy yeast


OVZ

That looks AWESOME!!!

OVZ, just opened your bottle and having a drink while wrapping presents. Not having a side by side taste test it's hard to compare but I find it interesting that all three of us (Nerdybrewer) used the same panela and all came out with a different flavor profiles but definitely good rum!

Thanks Bushman, I guess that if we all produced a rum that tasted the same, life would be boring. Your rum had so much more flavor - hoping that some day I'll be able to get that in my drink.

Something about time,oak and experience...

OVZ

Feel a little guilty because I'm not sharing but for me, it's 8 degrees F outside. And I'm do my work outside. Spring can't come soon enough!!!! Great hearing about your guys drinks!

But gotta agree. It's a lesson that takes a long time to learn. "Time, oak and experience".

I have been doing some more research on both yeasts and nutrients for your rum wash. In the book The Distiller's Guide to Rum, under nutrients it states by nature cane juice, molasses, brown sugar, white cane sugar are lacking in nutrients. They suggest adding Go Ferm, DAP, or Fermaid K* to the cane substrate. The percent to substrate in the book is lbs to gallons. DAP and Fermaid K* is 2lbs per 1000 gallons of substrate which is a lot more than we would mix per hobby level thus I did a conversion for others to use. I used a conversion to a 5 gallon wash as adjusting from here to your fermenters will be easy. For 5 gallons it comes to 0.16 oz or just under 1 tsp. For Go Ferm they recommend 2.5 lbs per 1000 gallons which converts to .2 oz per 5 gallons or 1.18 tsp.

Bushman wrote: For 5 gallons it comes to 0.16 oz or just under 1 tsp. For Go Ferm they recommend 2.5 lbs per 1000 gallons which converts to .2 oz per 5 gallons or 1.18 tsp.

Awesome. Very helpful. Thanks!

Funny thing is I just got back from the brew store with a couple ounces of fermaid-k, Pick it up to help a corn sugarhead wash that has been stuck at 18 brix all week, I think that I over did the sugar on that one

OVZ

It's been a few days into the hefe yeast experiment and the ferment is going great, no need for any added nutrients. The smell is fantastic, the banana and clove are just starting to be noticeable. Maybe someday we will have the technology to embed aromas digitally

OVZ

Bushman wrote:I have been doing some more research on both yeasts and nutrients for your rum wash. In the book The Distiller's Guide to Rum, under nutrients it states by nature cane juice, molasses, brown sugar, white cane sugar are lacking in nutrients. .

Having a hard time understanding that statement. Under cane juice all of those products are made from cane juice,as is panela which is more pure than the others. My understanding is the panela still has a lot of nutrients, in my limited experience all of my panela washes fermented fine without added nutrients

OVZ

I haven't said anything about this because my last rum wasn't panela but I used either 1122 or D-47 for my yeast for the same reason you used the Hef yeast, it produces fruity esters. They are also more suited to colder ferments than bread yeast and a lot cheaper than a liquid yeast. My plan when I eventually get around to the panela is to try each of them with the panela and see how it goes.

Get Nutritional Facts and the Health Benefits for Pure Cane Sugar
Nutrition Facts
Serving Size: 1 tsp (4.0 g)
Amount Per Serving% Daily Values
Calories 15 Calories from Fat 0
Total Fat 0.0g 0%
Saturated Fat 0.0g 0%
Trans Fat 0.0g
Cholesterol 0mg 0%
Sodium 0mg 0%
Potassium 0mg 0%
Total Carbohydrates 4.0g 1%
Sugars 4.0g
Protein 0.0g
* Based on a 2000 calorie diet

Took this information on Nutrient Facts for cane sugar off the internet.

Oldvine Zin wrote:

Bushman wrote:I have been doing some more research on both yeasts and nutrients for your rum wash. In the book The Distiller's Guide to Rum, under nutrients it states by nature cane juice, molasses, brown sugar, white cane sugar are lacking in nutrients. .

Having a hard time understanding that statement. Under cane juice all of those products are made from cane juice,as is panela which is more pure than the others. My understanding is the panela still has a lot of nutrients, in my limited experience all of my panela washes fermented fine without added nutrients

OVZ

I've used the Indian version of panela - jaggery goor - for my cachaca run a few months ago - no nutrients required, the yeast loved it and it finished bone dry.

Bushman wrote:Get Nutritional Facts and the Health Benefits for Pure Cane Sugar
Nutrition Facts
Serving Size: 1 tsp (4.0 g)
Amount Per Serving% Daily Values
Calories 15 Calories from Fat 0
Total Fat 0.0g 0%
Saturated Fat 0.0g 0%
Trans Fat 0.0g
Cholesterol 0mg 0%
Sodium 0mg 0%
Potassium 0mg 0%
Total Carbohydrates 4.0g 1%
Sugars 4.0g
Protein 0.0g
* Based on a 2000 calorie diet

Took this information on Nutrient Facts for cane sugar off the internet.

If you asked me to get you Pure Cane Sugar from the grocery store I would buy you granulated white sugar... I would expect that to be virtually devoid of nutrients as above.

Bushman wrote:Get Nutritional Facts and the Health Benefits for Pure Cane Sugar
Nutrition Facts
Serving Size: 1 tsp (4.0 g)
Amount Per Serving% Daily Values
Calories 15 Calories from Fat 0
Total Fat 0.0g 0%
Saturated Fat 0.0g 0%
Trans Fat 0.0g
Cholesterol 0mg 0%
Sodium 0mg 0%
Potassium 0mg 0%
Total Carbohydrates 4.0g 1%
Sugars 4.0g
Protein 0.0g
* Based on a 2000 calorie diet

Took this information on Nutrient Facts for cane sugar off the internet.

The trouble seems to stem from just about anything being allowed to use the label "Pure Cane Sugar".

If you've tasted your Panela you will have noticed it's different from anything you buy at the grocery store that calls itself "Pure Cane Sugar".
Watching the video on Youtube showing how Sugar Daddy's Panela is made shows you that this is the real deal, what all the other "Pure Cane Sugar" products are trying to copy (except granulated white of course).
Heck I'll bet a lot of the impurities in this Panela work as yeast nutrients!

I've never put any extra nutrients in any of my rum washes, my Panela ferments out vigorously and takes about 3 days whether I do a 20 gallon batch or a 100 gallon batch.
I will say I believe the dunder I always add contains nutrients, however that's a product of the Panela and yeast so it's not some added nutrient.
I know there's dead or dormant yeast in there and that's a nutrient in itself.
Panela, water, yeast, dunder and some shells for PH balance - keep it warm and let it ferment out and then settle a while.
Simple and it works.

Oh, and if you like cookies and other baked items that use brown sugar keep a baggie of the panela in your kitchen.
Yumm! Also can be used in making your own BBQ sauce or rubs. I've used it in the rub I put on Salmon prior to smoking it too, it's great for so many things.

I agree Sugar Daddy's panela has more nutrients than what I listed above but I add DAP because I use Hook's rum recipe which includes blackstrap molasses which does not have as much nutrients. I like my flavor as it is not as light a rum as I get with just straight panela.

Bushman wrote:I agree Sugar Daddy's panela has more nutrients than what I listed above but I add DAP because I use Hook's rum recipe which includes blackstrap molasses which does not have as much nutrients. I like my flavor as it is not as light a rum as I get with just straight panela.

Which leads back to what you said before, we all use pretty much the same stuff but we all get different tasting results.
That variety is really a big part of the mystique of the whole thing, make one small change and your rum is yours and is distinct from mine or OVZ's or that of anyone else.
This is a great hobby, even better when you can get together and compare notes and recipes and taste each others product.
Your rum definitely had that taste of molasses and I really liked it.

Cane sugar is extracted from cane juice.
Panela is just evaporated juice, all the business is still in there.

I thought this was an interesting thread exploring different yeasts for rum:
http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... =11&t=7678" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow

MCH thanks for that link, it was an interesting read

OVZ

OK it's been 14 days so far on this hefe panela ferment, started at 15 brix (1.061) pitched with White Labs 300 yeast and keeping the ferment temp at 70º F. Today's reading was 10 brix (1.026 ), about halfway there. This has been my longest rum ferment ever, If the spicy clove notes that I smell now carry over in the final product it might be worth the wait. Time will tell

OVZ

Hey Jimbo - did you do your hefe panela batch??

OVZ

Oldvine Zin wrote:OK it's been 14 days so far on this hefe panela ferment, started at 15 brix (1.061) pitched with White Labs 300 yeast and keeping the ferment temp at 70º F.

hefeferm3.JPG

Today's reading was 10 brix (1.026 ), about halfway there. This has been my longest rum ferment ever, If the spicy clove notes that I smell now carry over in the final product it might be worth the wait. Time will tell

OVZ

And I thought 5-6 days was long! It all should be the same but how many gallons are you fermenting? What's your bill? Are you among the Dunder crew?

Under pitching by so much will absolutely lead to slow ferments that will stress the yeast. If you were making beer this could be a bad thing but in this case it will probably enhance those estery flavours you are looking for. Report back when you run it, it sounds interesting

Started first Panela ferment off yesterday.

Tried to follow Jimbos recipe. (well, at least one of them anyways)
Some of the calcs are guesses. So, don't blame Jimbo if this is off. Not good at math.

40 lb Panela (sugar daddy...thanks!)
25 gal water ( Plus 3 gal to dissolve panela) Total 28 gal
2 Tbsp Calcium Carb (crushed oyster shell)
1 1/2 Tbsp Fermax
1 1/2 Tbsp Epsom salt
1/2 lb Red Star bread yeast (rehydrated half of it, pitched the rest dry)

Pitched at 73 degrees F and put a lamp on it to raise it to 80. OG was 15 brix, but I doubt that is totally accurate?

Bubbling strong this morning, temp at 77, ph at 5
Hoping this turns out yummy. Still have 460 lbs to go

Pottsie wrote:And I thought 5-6 days was long! It all should be the same but how many gallons are you fermenting? What's your bill? Are you among the Dunder crew?

5 Gal of dunder goodness
30 Gal of water
50 LBS panela
Couple of oyster shells

OVZ

GrassHopper wrote: Still have 460 lbs to go

nice

OVZ