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sungazer wrote:I have done my research on Flutes and that I guess is why I am asking the question as personally I don't really find the attraction. Ok you say a versatile still, and I will give you that they look very fancy and scientific with all the sight glasses ect. I also understand the first motivations to build one being a scaled down version of a commercial built still. However for me I would rather have several stills each for designed for different jobs. I also think that for the cost of the build of some of these stills that you could easily build 5 different stills. So while I don't begrudge anyone building what they want I am just interested in the why. From that I may learn something more.

A flute with plates is especially better than packing in a commercial application because of it's ability to hold a heavier amount without packing down. The flute with the sight glasses has the cool effect + built modular it has more versatility with the product you produce. The site glasses also help in how the run is progressing so you can make adjustments. I have been to micro-distilleries with fancy stills that have lights on each site glass to make viewing a little easier. I use packing as for a hobby stage I find it easy to control with less chance of puking. There are both positives and negatives to having multiple stills, one of the negatives is space and storage.

sungazer wrote:I have done my research on Flutes and that I guess is why I am asking the question as personally I don't really find the attraction. Ok you say a versatile still, and I will give you that they look very fancy and scientific with all the sight glasses ect. I also understand the first motivations to build one being a scaled down version of a commercial built still. However for me I would rather have several stills each for designed for different jobs. I also think that for the cost of the build of some of these stills that you could easily build 5 different stills. So while I don't begrudge anyone building what they want I am just interested in the why. From that I may learn something more.

I have run a "flute" plated column for the last 3+yrs, it has served me well the whiskey,Rum that comes out is very clean and a efficient use of the mashes/washes I make,as far as Vodkas/neutrals a packed section added to the top of 3 plates will make a very fine Vodka/neutral, all made modular and not 3-4 stills to do the same,expensive maybe unless ya add all the money,time of up keep making3-4 stills,cleaning up keep and storage of and gear for changing that many stillheads,all said and told is your gear,time, money and what you want to deal with this is in not a sell for plates just my game and what I enjoy

Guess I might as well put in my .02. I have multiple columns, a pot head that I haven't used since I built the flute because the flute puts out full flavor high ABV in a single run. My boka has also been sitting unused not because of the flute but because of the 3.5" I.D. CM I built exclusively for neutral. None of them take up much room and for the most part just look like unfinished steampunk projects when stored. I like a dedicated column for different things but it is all about the time, a single 3-3.5 hr run in the flute instead of multiple stripping runs then a spirit run to get the same results and the results aren't the same. 2 runs in a pot still have less flavor than a single 92% flute run and I can strip with it if I want to. The big CM reduced my neutral run from 16+ hours down to 6-7. It takes minutes to attach either column to the boiler so that saves time over taking a modular apart to try to reassemble it to do what the CM can do. As far as cost, the most expensive thing for me was the Boka and pot heads, the CM and flute were done very cheaply, although I did spend a lot on solder

It really AL depends on when you are going modular. Cranky had his pot still,boka and cm (ithink) before his flute. And his columns are not only functional but art as well.

If it were me starting out. Knowing what I know now, I would use modular with trI clamps. I wouldn't solder in the plates. Instead use sandwich plates between sections as that way you can have a pot still
A plated column, a packed column. A combo of the two.

A modular setup allows you to do that. You don't even have to make it a flute. You just make everything modular. Sectioned column. Delflag and product condenser. (Shot gun is my preference ) very versitile setup.

If I had the ability to do so from the beginning it is what I would have done as the cost of building my own flute so far has been less then what I spent to buy parts and material to build multiple columns. At least that's how I lol at it.

Yak

I just finished plumbing up my perf plate flute today, and start the cleaning runs tomorrow. As everyone around here knows, I'm as amateur as it gets, and yet I managed to cobble this together in about a month. The only soldering I did was the down comers and a connector on my product condenser, the rest either bolts or clamps together.

The condensers are both CSST, no shotguns, but I should still be able to knock down 5500 watts pretty easily. They also took less than an hour to put together.

It's all modular, and can be reconfigured a ton of different ways. I'm considering ordering another 12" spool for a packed section, since I could just clamp it in above the 2, 3, 4 or soon 5 plates, but I have yet to feel the need to make neutral.

There were setbacks here and there, but nothing major. All told I put between $600 and $700 into it, and I would do it again in a heartbeat. I'd much rather build it myself from copper and save money, but I would never find the time to get it done, and it was at least $1k less than buying one.

Thanks all interesting replies I can see how some of the factors that everybody has mentioned applies to them and other people. A lot of those actually don't apply to me so I guess that takes those factors out of my initial thinking when thinking about it.

bearriver wrote:I can only can speak to my appeals, but I am throwing down my tax return for a Still Dragon Dash. I respect the product and the people behind it. The dash series is a good value as a prospective buyer, plus they have a forum full of support and brilliant minds. They also have a solid return policy.

All purchases are decided ultimately by our emotions. It's all about how you feel... If you don't "feel right" about it then more research is needed. You never know what piece of the puzzle you might stumble across.

I am in the market to buy not build. My only concern are the plates the only copper contact? Nothing in the dephlag or shotgun? Is that amount of copper enough? Bearriver, any reviews you can give me? I also like the eye candy factor of the crystal dragons. Thanks! [FACE WITH STUCK-OUT TONGUE AND WINKING EYE]

There are plenty of users here and about that can confirm there is an adequate amount of copper in the vapor path.

But SD also offers copper tees and copper dephlegs for those who may feel comfortable with more copper in the vapor path.
I really do not subscribe to copper being on the downside of the vapor path,,but that is another thread entirely. Perhaps Dad will chime on this issue later?

Very happy to point you toward professional, licenced distillers that have medal winning spirits rendered from the baseline Dash column.

Not trying to be salesy at all though it may appear to that way.

The drinkability of finish product has much more to do with the fermentation protocal and the person driving the distiller.

I'm almost positive that quality spirits can be rendered from any of the "store bought" systems that are typically discussed within these forums. Just as high quality spirits have been rendered from garage contraptions.
Let's not get too distracted by the shinny bits. Distilliation in it's simplest form is nothing more than evaporation.

LWTCS wrote: Let's not get too distracted by the shinny bits.

But we're magpies

biggybigz wrote:I am in the market to buy not build. My only concern are the plates the only copper contact? Nothing in the dephlag or shotgun? Is that amount of copper enough? Bearriver, any reviews you can give me? I also like the eye candy factor of the crystal dragons. Thanks! [FACE WITH STUCK-OUT TONGUE AND WINKING EYE]

You could configure for more copper contact, but it's really not necessary. Even a little copper apparently removes the nasties, and all of your product will be in contact with the plates multiple times before it exits.

The plates are the only copper in my flute, unless you count the PC. I'm quite happy with the drop.

Both of my stills are stainless steel. In my pot still I use a rolled up wad of copper mesh stuffed into the Lyne Arm just above the boiler. In my relux flute still I just use the copper plates with downcomers to do the job. Works great as is.

Since everyone else is going hard here, I'll throw my hat in the ring.

I dont think you can beat copper for any still. Stainless steel works, thats well proven, but does it work as good as copper?

Not if you want to make the best you can.

A modular flute is hard to go past for quality of product, ability to make many products, but to add an edge it should be all copper.

And no TTB worries. We have no need to tell em anything, now or later. And the aussie $ is favorable at the moment.

I don't think it takes that much copper really and he plates and caps are copper so that gives a good area for lots of contact. I guess if you wanted more could put some copper meshing above the deflag.

Be nice to see a side by side comparison of exact same still design and build one with copper and one with stainless.

The guy he bought this from also has copper t's but they are a bit more per section.

B

bitter wrote:I don't think it takes that much copper really and he plates and caps are copper so that gives a good area for lots of contact. I guess if you wanted more could put some copper meshing above the deflag.

Be nice to see a side by side comparison of exact same still design and build one with copper and one with stainless.

The guy he bought this from also has copper t's but they are a bit more per section.

B

Well, thought thought he had a car, but he only had a horn.

Theres lots of posts that say "you only need a little bit of copper to make it good", unfortunately, the main posters that have said this also have owned and run copper stills, and its a ruse.

Theres only a handful of guys that have run both copper and stainless stills and can give true comparisons. Some now sell chinese stainless stills so have a vested interest.

Old saying prevails, never ask a barber if you need a haircut...

I come back to the same old thought...why dont the big guys run stainless stills? And I dont mean some up and coming distiller from uppercomeback west, but the real big guys.

I have run both.
Both make very good spirits.

Here is a "little" operation from uppercomeback west.

And here is an original big boy that has dominated it's sector for a very long time.
It is the largest privately held, family-owned spirits company in the world.

LWTCS wrote:There are plenty of users here and about that can confirm there is an adequate amount of copper in the vapor path.

But SD also offers copper tees and copper dephlegs for those who may feel comfortable with more copper in the vapor path.
I really do not subscribe to copper being on the downside of the vapor path,,but that is another thread entirely. Perhaps Dad will chime on this issue later?

Very happy to point you toward professional, licenced distillers that have medal winning spirits rendered from the baseline Dash column.

Not trying to be salesy at all though it may appear to that way.

The drinkability of finish product has much more to do with the fermentation protocal and the person driving the distiller.

I'm almost positive that quality spirits can be rendered from any of the "store bought" systems that are typically discussed within these forums. Just as high quality spirits have been rendered from garage contraptions.
Let's not get too distracted by the shinny bits. Distilliation in it's simplest form is nothing more than evaporation.

Good info. Are there discounts for being an HD member?

Having seen EG's stills first hand with their pressed in copper flanges I can say they just ooze quality. My still is a hand made all copper still, its quite a few years old with copper tees and SS ferrules. It was how they were done then and it works but it's not the best method and more joins means more potential leaks. SD look good but I have never seen a copper one, I would like to see there full copper version
Although flutes have a reflux condenser I wouldn't call them a reflux still per say, they are damn vercitile and with a small add on can be a reflux still but in normal configuration could be better described as a multiple (say 5) box thump still.
Hands up who would like to see goose eye and tater run a flute me, I would
The flashiest buggy only seemed cool til the worst car come along, these stills make life easier and shine cleaner

@LWTCS, Lets not get into a pic posting session, I was just saying the more well known brands that make brown spirits use copper stills.

Dont get me wrong mate, I'm not bagging out stainless stills, they are a great cheaper option.

There is a noticable taste profile difference between stainless and copper stills though.

But I must ask why SD now has some copper/stainless hybrids available if SS is as good as its made out to be?

Whoa! Hold on a sec.

I may just have to start drinking Jack Daniels if I get to look at those copper beauty's posted above....

Drink enough they all start to resemble something close to that.

Kegg_jam wrote:Whoa! Hold on a sec.

I may just have to start drinking Jack Daniels if I get to look at those copper beauty's posted above....

Flash car don't make a good driver

Copper's traditional, and with all the romance around whiskey, no one wants to rock that boat.

That doesn't mean it's superior. People love their traditions.

raketemensch wrote:Copper's traditional, and with all the romance around whiskey, no one wants to rock that boat.

That doesn't mean it's superior. People love their traditions.

So copper does nothing, just tradition hey
With all due respect dude that is a pile of steaming crap. What large corporations and multi-nationals care about is money lots of money and by extention their product. If they could make the same product spending a whole hell of a lot less they would have done it yesterday. Let's keep the red herring fishing yarns for the liars bench hey

Getting a little riled up?

No one is arguing that copper doesn't help, we know that it removes sulfur, but I have yet to see any data behind how much is necessary.

raketemensch wrote:Getting a little riled up?

No one is arguing that copper doesn't help, we know that it removes sulfur, but I have yet to see any data behind how much is necessary.

From my taste buds hes just telling you the truth.Guess what we should do is all you fellas with ss outfits toss some copper in vapor as well as a fair amount into boiler with mash/wash. I use several pieces of copper 3/4 couplings mostly or tubing cut about that size around 20 or so in my ss keg boiler.My head and worm are copper. Test and report back

All of my plates and down comers are copper, I wouldn't run completely without it. I'm just not sure how much you would need before hitting a point of diminishing returns.

raketemensch wrote:Getting a little riled up?

No one is arguing that copper doesn't help, we know that it removes sulfur, but I have yet to see any data behind how much is necessary.

Nar mate not riled at all just having a case of deyamoo seen is bullshit before. If you haven't seen any data then you sure weren't looking, in fact you would have to be deliberately avoiding threads not to come across it on this forum alone. For just a couple of the very very many threads on it with dozens upon dozens of links search I vote copper out of stills thread or the horrors of copper in the descending path. Both those threads make like minded ridiculous statements adequately refuted
Edit posted same time as Tater (edit 2.and rack,.gosh you guys are quick)

Well, choosing a flute is important as I have been running a 2"potstill on a 13 gal milk can for 3 years. I feel like I have that down pat and want to step up when it comes to a column. I have read quite a bit and I am sure that I could read more. I'm am not rushing a purchase. Every time I turn around, I find a new place to buy from.

It's a hard decision when I can't pick it up and Jack around with it. I've never tasted a drop from a flute nor operated one. I've had the $$$ and been shopping for a month. Just can't seem to pull the trigger on what I want. I would like to try and save a buck or two if possible, that is where SS draws me in. I would not want ALL SS of course. Seems like some say copper plates and bubble caps are enough. Some say that it is not enough. I'll continue reading! Cheers!

Seems to me I read something about a study that showed having some copper in the boiler was most effective. But then there is always a study about something or another slanted in the direction that suits your need...

I like copper, it's easy to work with. Stainless is damn sexy too...