those bastards

USarmy21 · Post by **USarmy21** » Fri Feb 18, 2005 11:45 am

good points everyone but im done with this topic. i basicly just wrote a whole book.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Fri Feb 18, 2005 11:49 am

Temperance, please (the good kind, not the no booze kind). I only meant to point out that too much of anything can be bad. You say yourself, Uncle Jesse, that moderation is a good thing. I was as amazed as anyone that find that water can kill you (other than drowning)!

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Fri Feb 18, 2005 7:36 pm

theholymackerel wrote:Conspirancy theory about the FDA is bush-league stuff.

Yup. Bush league.

If governments had a history of trurth and honesty, 'conspiracy thoeries' would have no soil to take root. Yet, looking over history , the people 'in power' have acted in ways that do not agree with their words.

And I still don't know what "B17" is.

MyDBear · Post by **MyDBear** » Fri Feb 18, 2005 11:02 pm

level Joe wrote:USarmy21;
Guns kill,

Dont ya think that this is just a lil bit out of context,cuz I sure as hell do, every thing else that ya said in that post was ok,But this,(Guns Kill)I think that this statement needs ta be put in its propper perspective, If I were ta lay a loaded gun down on a table, and if no one touched it, and I came back even years latter it would still be there just as i left it. Guns Don't Kill people, People kill people

Sorry but I had ta coment on this it erks the hell out of me when some one says Guns Kill

level Joe · Post by **level Joe** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 6:02 pm

MyDBear wrote:
level Joe wrote:USarmy21;
Guns kill,
Dont ya think that this is just a lil bit out of context,cuz I sure as hell do, every thing else that ya said in that post was ok,But this,(Guns Kill)I think that this statement needs ta be put in its propper perspective, If I were ta lay a loaded gun down on a table, and if no one touched it, and I came back even years latter it would still be there just as i left it. Guns Don't Kill people, People kill people

Sorry but I had ta coment on this it erks the hell out of me when some one says Guns Kill

No guns themselfs dont, nor do cars it's the person behind the wheel, beef dont it's the fat, sex dont its the viruses, sunlight dont its the radiation, loved ones dont inraged ones do, fire dont its the heat, water dont its the lower ratio of electrolites that stop the heart. I was only trying to generalize to make the point and not to be all incusive or exclusive. I could have said bullets kill and maybe I wouldnt have sparked a fire.

level Joe wrote: Im gona have sex, drink, smoke, own a gun, not take my vitamins, and make babies if I want

The NRA is fine in my opinion but I'm not a member.

MyDBear · Post by **MyDBear** » Sun Feb 20, 2005 7:46 pm

point taken

AkCoyote · Post by **AkCoyote** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 3:06 pm

First, for LevelJoe, I whole heartedly concur. Well said.

As for B17, the FDA doesn't make money on the sale of drugs. They are a government regulatory agency, nothing more.

The FDA is not a proponent of any drug, herb, vitamin or mineral. Drug companies present their research to the FDA and the FDA approves/denies permission to sell in the US. Is the process totally above board? Probably not, but nothing in the business world is totally honest. If B17 does help cancer, the FDA will never say so because there will be no way to control its use. Likewise, the drug companies won't promote it as there is no profit motive.

IMHO we have become too dependent on government and technology and need to take more responsibility for our own well being. If I had cancer and thought B17 might be a cure, neither the FDA or anyone else would stop me from obtaining some. I seriously doubt, however, that there is a major conspiracy to keep it off the market.

Just my 2 cents worth.

AkCoyote

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 4:07 pm

good points but say if there was something that cured cancer 100% of the time the FDA would most likly ban it and make up something saying it piosonous or has to many side affects. yes vitamin b17 might be piosonous but out off all the reading i did on it i havnt read anything about people dieing from the vitamin and only heard that the people actually beat the cancer. cigarettes just like millions of other non banned products have piosons like cyanide and ammonia in them and they havnt been banned from the US. many times in the past there has been many cover ups were the government made up dumb obvious lies and silenced the witnesses just like some have been with the vitamin b17 thing. and i didnt really mean the FDA is behind it all its who ever gets the profits from the drugs been sold. there is drugs being sold today that do nothing but make people think that they actually do something for them and the FDA is still allowing it to be sold knowing it doesnt do anything and are still geting profits from the buyers of those expensive pointless drug. what im trying to get across is that people are so much better off not relieing on the FDA and their drugs.

Post by **Tater** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 4:38 pm

ive read green tea has many health beneifits as a cancer stopper same as blueberrys fda aint stopped them

USarmy21 · Post by **USarmy21** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 5:06 pm

yea but no one is aloud to write on the side of their product that it cures cancer no matter how affecttive it is and if it cured cancer 100% of the time. if they do the FDA comes into their store with guns and take the products.

USarmy21 · Post by **USarmy21** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 5:50 pm

Back in the fifties, Dr. Ernst Krebs proved beyond doubt that B17 was completely harmless to humans in the most convincing way possible. After testing the vitamin on animals, he filled a large hypodermic with a mega-dose which he then injected into his own arm! Drastic perhaps, but the adventurous Dr. Krebs is still alive and well today.

The vitamin is harmless to healthy tissue for a very simple reason: Each molecule of B17 contains one unit of cyanide, one unit of benzaldehyde and two of glucose (sugar) tightly locked together. In order for the cyanide to become dangerous it is first necessary to 'unlock' the molecule to release it, a trick that can only be performed by an enzyme called beta-glucosidase. This enzyme is present all over the body in minute quantities, but in huge quantities (up to 100 times as high) at cancerous tumour sites.

USarmy21 · Post by **USarmy21** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 5:55 pm

what about danger to the rest of the body's cells? Another enzyme, rhodanese, always present in larger quantities than the unlocking enzyme beta-glucosidase in healthy tissues has the easy ability to completely break down both cyanide and benzaldehyde into beneficial body products. Predictably perhaps, malignant cancer cells contain no rhodanese at all, leaving them completely at the mercy of the cyanide and benzaldehyde.

Yttrium · Post by **Yttrium** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 6:54 pm

So this weekend I was walking to my local grocery store and along the way there is one of those natural suppliments stores. I've actually been in there twice, once looking for amylase, and once looking for live yeast(Both of which they didn't have in sufficient quantities). Anyways I went in and asked a guy who worked there(probably was the owner) about B17. He said appricot seeds to have some of it in them, but its fairly little. Supposedly the appricot seeds sold before the ban were much more bitter due to the higher level of cyanide. He said yes it is banned in the USA, but if you want, there are free clinics in Tijuana Mexico where you can get B17.

Although I'm firmly behing the FDA in regulating the claims made on products, I'm also in favor of letting people choose to do dumb things with their lives.

Now for all this talk about the FDA being out to kill you, here's a the CDC's chart for life expectancy:
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr53/nvsr53_06.pdf

The key things to point out are that the life expectancy in 1900 was 47.3 years, in 1950 it was 68.2, and in 2000 it was 77.9. The average human life in the USA is now about 65% longer than it was in 1900. If the FDA is trying to shorten your life, they've done a miserable job.

Next, there has been talk of the FDA and drug companies not wanting to cure diseases. If this is the case, I would ask you to explain Polio and Small Pox. People's memories are short, we forget that these illnesses have been all but erradicated from the earth.

USarmy21 · Post by **USarmy21** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 7:45 pm

i never said they were out to shorten my life i said they were just out for the money. ok imagine you work a for a drug company and one day a "dumb" fucker like me comes up with a cure for everything. what happens to you??? you get fired and who wants to get fired??? obviously not the FDA so why would they want some "dumb" guy like me coming up with a cure for every illness??? seriously if i was in theirs shoes i would be doing the same thing. i admit when money pops up it changes my decisions. you can keep explaining all your opinions but until you can prove drug companys dont want any money at all nothing will change my mind on all of this.

USarmy21 · Post by **USarmy21** » Mon Feb 21, 2005 8:11 pm

Is there a treatment for polio?
There is no "cure" for polio. Persons infected with polio need supportive therapy, such as bed rest and fluids. Standard precautions should be taken to avoid passing on the virus through any contamination from the patient's stool.

as for small pox....... small pox is a serious illness. there is prevention but not enough for the world at the time. if small pox was exposed to the USA many live would be gone and the economy would start falling just the drug companys paycheck.

There is a vaccine against smallpox and it was a key tool in the eradication of the disease. The vaccine does not contain the variola virus which causes smallpox , but a closely related virus called vaccinia. When this vaccine is given to humans, it protects them against smallpox. However, it can have very serious side effects, which in extreme cases can be fatal. It has therefore not been recommended for the general public since smallpox was eradicated. It is used to protect researchers who work on the variola virus that causes smallpox and other viruses in the same virus family (known as orthopox viruses). It could also be used to protect anyone else judged to have a high risk of exposure to smallpox. The vaccine cannot be used in people whose immune systems are not functioning properly.

USarmy21 · Post by **USarmy21** » Tue Feb 22, 2005 7:55 am

your focusing on the wrong points. i was just tryign to say that drugs from drug companys dont do much for you and your better off on your own. but then yttrium made points about how my points were false and then that got me into it and that probably made me seem paraniod. and by the FDA i dont just mean the FDA i mean who ever is making the money of the drugs being sold.

MyDBear · Post by **MyDBear** » Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:06 pm

I've been following this thread off and on just ta see where it would go,whell here it is.

Dear Mr USarmy21:
Ever since this thread that you have brought up. All ya have been talking about is the Money. Money this and money that, Ranting & Raving bout this vitimin & that vitimin and how much ya hate (dislike) the FDA.

And then ya say some thing like this.

USarmy21 wrote: seriously if i was in theirs shoes i would be doing the same thing. i admit when money pops up it changes my decisions.

IT seems ta me that ya turned inta same thing that ya hated.

You ought ta take THM's advice I think that you realy need one of theese.

http://zapatopi.net/afdb.html

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Feb 22, 2005 5:40 pm

what the fuck is up your ass theholymackerel??? i was just talking about what i thought and then yttrium said i was wrong and we got into a debate and it stayed a debate and those little comment you made werent in the debate. why dont you read all of my post and yttriums and make your judegments. i know i sound like a actavist thats out on the streets everyday protesting to un ban vitamin b17 but im no were near that. when someone says im wrong it gets me worked up and start geting all into it. why dont you be a man and join the army instead of complaining about my post. and mydbear i was just speaking the truth. im sure alot of you would do the same thing the FDA is doing if you were in their shoes but not many can admit that.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Feb 22, 2005 5:42 pm

if your gona complain about my post dont even bother writing it because i dont fucking care

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 10:30 am

anyone can join the infantry im going to basic this summer to try and get into the army RANGERS and i can already pass the physical requirment test. the army rangers are alot more tougher and they risk their lives 20 times more then an infantryman. when did you join and did you fight in a war??? im gona be joining when theres all this shit with iraq,afghanastan,iran,north korea and even china. and it seems like you been geting a little worked up over a couple words from what i said. quit acting immature and act like an ifantryman

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 10:36 am

what rank did you make it to and how lond did you serve???

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:19 pm

you didnt answer my questions. maybe your avoiding them so you wont look bad. were you in a war??? how long did you serve??? waht rank to you retire at??? this attitude mgiht seem whiney to you but you dont know me and you dont know how aggressive and serious i take things that when i want to accomplish something. i was being aggressive and proving my point and sticking with it and you came along with your whiney attitude and starting complaining about how i was wrong. and i already know what i have to do to become a ranger. im gona get a fucking A on the physical fitness test. i can do well over what the requirments are. so answer my questions now and only my questions and not your whiney opintions

Post by **Tater** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 4:25 pm

mack looks like we got another kid playing with moms and dads pc. lol

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 5:28 pm

speaking of dads i am your daddy tater

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 5:31 pm

you didnt answer my questions theholymackerel...........

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 5:36 pm

you didnt answer my questions theholymackerel...........

Post by **Tater** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 5:48 pm

lol see holy a kid

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 6:49 pm

you looking at me as the dumbass..... your the one aruging with a "kid". i am 21 this april

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 6:52 pm

i dont want to argue with any of you and im not the person that is going to start an arguement. why cant you guys be like uncle jesse or knuckle head. their the few people that just talk and dont act like kids.

Post by **Tater** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 9:59 pm