Novices should probably not attempt to be innovative

[Yummyrum]

If you can't all discuss the topic without having a go at each other I'll lock it .

[Pikey]

Sorry Fivey - but I called "BS" on the original story without any other evidence than - it is simply not possible for a back street mechanic to do what they said he did !

The story was clearly wrong on so many levels !

And yet you still persist with ;

........... What experienced welder would try to do what he did?

C'mon mate you're a bright lad - He didn't "Do it" at all ! (Venerable source or not ! )

You know, I’m guessing the full story disappeared in a bang and we’ll never know. Maybe the truth of the story doesn’t support my thesis. Would you like me to say you were right all along? Here you go: you were right all along. The newspaper article does not stand as good evidence for what I was endeavouring to prove.

I’m sorry I even linked the story.

Now, putting aside the newspaper story entirely, perhaps you would like to comment on my argument on it’s own merits? Not challenging it by assuming I am against self-learning or giving things a go, but addressing the question of: Is it important to ‘know stuff’ (however acquired) in order to break new ground in a given field?

Throughout this conversation, I have endeavoured to be reasonable and give ground to salient points you and others have made. You have been rather obdurate however, even when I have put up what I think are reasonable responses to some of the things you have challenged me on. Can you give me something? Anything? Even of the form ‘you are right about A but also B is true.’ This isn’t a cage fight.

My God give it a rest! Admit that you are wrong and move on. I expect that you were captain of your debate team but I have been called a troll here for much less in my opinion.

I've just been through all 50 of his posts - and there is NO evidence in any of them that he has ever done a fermentation - or much less a "Distill"

You may feel you have been called a "troll" for less - but I genuinely feel that this thread is both unnecessary and provocative - without any real point - except I would really like to know the result of the investigation into the NZ Welder who was killed in the first implication post that stillin' is dangerous.

Several of his posts require Kareltje to "Do more research" - whereas we know Kareltje's research is immaculate !

I call "Troll"

Lock it if you must YR - but it would be good if we could get a result from that "fake news" first !

[Saltbush Bill]

the first implication post that stillin' is dangerous.

Stilling can be dangerous, There are many and varied things that can go wrong no matter how careful you are, or how much common sense is used.
Have you never had a still fire? or a boka flood and spew high abv alcohol down over the boiler, the naked flame heating it and other surroundings.
Or maybe the top site glass of a Bubbler / Flute cracking mid run and dribbling high 92-93% abv down the boiler and onto the gas ring below?
The list of things that can go wrong is almost endless.
None of the above have ever happened to me , But they have happened and do happen to many many people, some here and some on other forums, whats more they will continue to happen.

[The Baker]

Without getting into the foregoing much at all...

There was talk of inexperienced people making dangerous errors.

Like most old saws, the proverb, 'Familiarity breeds contempt' is valid on many levels, emotional and practical.

The stupid and dangerous things done by 'experts' are legion, and were the death of many of them. Didn't follow the rules and procedures.

Geoff

[Pikey]

the first implication post that stillin' is dangerous.

Stilling can be dangerous, There are many and varied things that can go wrong no matter how careful you are, or how much common sense is used.
Have you never had a still fire? or a boka flood and spew high abv alcohol down over the boiler, the naked flame heating it and other surroundings.
Or maybe the top site glass of a Bubbler / Flute cracking mid run and dribbling high 92-93% abv down the boiler and onto the gas ring below?
The list of things that can go wrong is almost endless.
None of the above have ever happened to me , But they have happened and do happen to many many people, some here and some on other forums, whats more they will continue to happen.

Thank you for your input !

[Edit - you wanna play with the silly buggers - go for it ! ]

[Edit 2 - I still call "TROLL" ! ]

[jb-texshine]

I like you Fivey, you argue well.

Indeed his use of language is very effective - SOmething I have noticed in the "new adults" is the ability to present excellent arguments for or against something which they believe is correct, in a way which can be quite frustrating for those of us more used to critical appraisal of facts.

Since there is so much of it prevailing on the Internet forums, it must be something which is taught in schools nowadays - and taught well !

What is the subject called please ?

Debate. There's classes, clubs and competitions...
Competitive arguing is what it amounts to.

[Pikey]

I like you Fivey, you argue well.

Indeed his use of language is very effective - SOmething I have noticed in the "new adults" is the ability to present excellent arguments for or against something which they believe is correct, in a way which can be quite frustrating for those of us more used to critical appraisal of facts.

Since there is so much of it prevailing on the Internet forums, it must be something which is taught in schools nowadays - and taught well !

What is the subject called please ?

Debate. There's classes, clubs and competitions...
Competitive arguing is what it amounts to.

Please give us a lead !

[WIski]

The world will never be totally "SAFE". There is risk in everything we do. There are countless common things people do everyday that are much more dangerous than distilling and aren't illegal. One of the easiest validations people use for control of an issue is playing the "SAFETY CARD". We need to call bullshit on this "Safety" issue. We're making houch not stuffing acetylene and oxygen in containers or boiling 4 gallons of vegetable oil over an open fire and plopping a frozen turkey in it. You can make rules, regulations, procedures, and laws but in the end Darwin will always come into play.

[Saltbush Bill]

or boiling 4 gallons of vegetable oil over an open fire and plopping a frozen turkey in it.

Instead we choose to boil a compound that is as volatile as gasoline in the top of some of our stills.

[MichiganCornhusker]

Sorry, Yummy, I don’t mean to step on your toes but I can’t take it anymore.