Why do I need copper in my still?

[Salt Must Flow]

You want plumbing lead-free silver solder and a propane torch.

[Yummyrum]

You want plumbing lead-free silver solder and a propane torch.

Absolutely . There isn’t a snowflakes chance in hell of using Soldering iron to solder a still . Those bits you showed are for soldering PCBs as was the 0.8mm solder .

Its all about transferring heat . You can’t expect a 35watt soldering Iron with a small copper tip to transfer heat into a 1/2” copper pipe . The pipe will be sucking the heat and conducting it away faster than the Iron can supply it.

That is why we use gas torches like Propane or MAPP as they can apply the necessary heat ( hundreds of watts) required to allow the joints to heat up enough to melt the solder.

The heat source and solder size must be applicable for the job .

[sadie33]

I've never had any perceivable issue with any of my stainless setups. You can put copper in the boiler and/or copper mesh in the base of the riser or column. Stainless is cheaper (if I'm not mistaken), tougher, generally doesn't corrode and would likely last virtually forever. Copper is easier to solder in comparison to stainless, but when I need structural parts welded, I take them to a local guy who TIG welds for me.

when you say you can put copper in the boiler, do you mean make the boiler out of copper or do you mean like putting 5 copper elbows on the bottom of your boiler?

[Saltbush Bill]

Just throw some bits of copper into the boiler.

[sadie33]

Just throw some bits of copper into the boiler.

thanks

[Salt Must Flow]

I've never had any perceivable issue with any of my stainless setups. You can put copper in the boiler and/or copper mesh in the base of the riser or column. Stainless is cheaper (if I'm not mistaken), tougher, generally doesn't corrode and would likely last virtually forever. Copper is easier to solder in comparison to stainless, but when I need structural parts welded, I take them to a local guy who TIG welds for me.

when you say you can put copper in the boiler, do you mean make the boiler out of copper or do you mean like putting 5 copper elbows on the bottom of your boiler?

You can just toss anything that's copper inside of the boiler. It can be pieces of copper pipe, copper fittings, etc... It doesn't really matter. I've never done that personally. I just take 4 rolls of copper mesh and insert them in the lower portion of my riser. Some say it is best for copper to be inside the boiler so an alternative to having a copper boiler is to just toss copper bits inside of it.

My stills are 100% stainless except for the product condenser, my reflux condenser and the copper pipe for my bottom drain. Copper mesh has always suited me just fine.

[Saltbush Bill]

You can't have to much, I would suggest that copper in the still column or head itself is enough, but some in the boiler is also useful.
Alternately build or buy a copper still.

[Yummyrum]

I have always had a staino boiler and copper riser and Pot head … or Copper column packed with Staino scrubbers and Copper head / condensers .

I’m missing what Copper in the boiler is/does
.

But then …… I was happy doing turbo washes , until I switched to TPW ….. back then .


Still not sure why copper in boiler is so desirable . Iff’n my booze was so bad that after a decade , relo's prefer it over Shop
Bought ……( which is stastically made in copper pots ) why is Copper on boiler so important

[Salt Must Flow]

I have always had a staino boiler and copper riser and Pot head … or Copper column packed with Staino scrubbers and Copper head / condensers .

I’m missing what Copper in the boiler is/does
.

But then …… I was happy doing turbo washes , until I switched to TPW ….. back then .


Still not sure why copper in boiler is so desirable . Iff’n my booze was so bad that after a decade , relo's prefer it over Shop
Bought ……( which is stastically made in copper pots ) why is Copper on boiler so important

Within the last couple of years this article has been cited as to why copper is supposedly ideal in the boiler. Whenever anyone discusses stainless stills and ways to introduce copper, that article is often cited because it lists some data. I've never bothered to add copper to my boilers just for sake of increasing copper exposure in the boiler.

[Saltbush Bill]

I've never thought it 100% necessary Yummy.
Just that a bit extra in the boiler can't hurt.

[NZChris]

Having copper in the boiler isn't 100% necessary, I only use it to make better product. I don't remember where I found my research on it, but it predates that new study by at least forty years.

[kennstminet]

I Found this document very interesting:
The Impact of Copper in Different Parts of Malt Whisky Pot Stills on New Make Spirit Composition and Aroma

The Impact of Copper in Different Parts of - Harrison.pdf

(2.1 MiB) Downloaded 176 times

The summary states:
[quote.... ]In these laboratory scale distillations, copper was found to reduce the level of this compound best when placed in the wash still condenser or spirit still pot.....[/quote]

For this reason, I always use copper product condensers and pipes. During spirit runs, I add pieces of copper to my SS boiler.
During stripping runs, the copper product condenser is on duty, during spirit runs the copper in the boiler takes the job. The copper condenser is always there and does not hurt during spirit runs.

I noticed that @saltmustflow had already linked to that document.

[howie]

'Still behind the bench' series goes through the above PDF.
there are also the 'flavourtown' series by this chap.
on other videos, he also says that you can also limit undesirable esters by correct fermentation in the first place.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIzBiwF-pYU

[DAD300]

It all depends on how good your ferments are.

Buy a bag of 1/2" copper pipe connectors and put a handful in a SS column. That way you can take them out and clean them.

[LWTCS]

I have always had a staino boiler and copper riser and Pot head … or Copper column packed with Staino scrubbers and Copper head / condensers .

I’m missing what Copper in the boiler is/does
.

But then …… I was happy doing turbo washes , until I switched to TPW ….. back then .


Still not sure why copper in boiler is so desirable . Iff’n my booze was so bad that after a decade , relo's prefer it over Shop
Bought ……( which is stastically made in copper pots ) why is Copper on boiler so important

Here is an article that explains why copper in the kettle can help mitigate ethyl carbamate from forming in the finished spirit: https://distilling.com/distillermagazin ... perations/

Though the article refers to continuous distillation, my takeaway is that exposing your beer as early as possible to the reactive properties of copper is best for the optimal cumulative effect of EC reduction.

[Yummyrum]

That is good to know . I was hesitant to make some new copper heat exchangers for mine and was thinking Stainless would be better for beer . But after hearing this I will happily continue .

[NormandieStill]

Last autumn i had a batch of apple juice spontaneously ferment before I managed to sterilize it for bottling. I let it go to add to the brandy stripping runs. Those wild yeast made some great flavour but they also made a lot of sulphur. A bit of DAP stopped the sulphur production but the smell didn't clear until I stuck a length of clean copper pipe into the bucket. In about a week it was smelling clean.

I also had copper mesh in the vapour path but since that experience I've also had a handful of copper offcuts in the boiler for insurance purposes.

[humjogo]

If you want in traditional way, use copper.

[airhill]

A quick question re copper in the still; whats the difference between putting copper in the boiler and the lyne arm or just adding some to the final product swirling it around for a while and then straining it out?

[VLAGAVULVIN]

Compared to the new make from the 100% stainless stills, the conclusion was that copper reduced sulphury and "meaty" notes.
Copper worked best when it was 1) in the condenser on a stripping run, and 2) part of the pot on the spirit run.

More or less like this?
.

.
On the other hand...

He hadn't put any in and thought he was making good product.

I wouldn't say I have problems with my nose. But either there is no difference on home stills or I happen to ferment with a minimum of formation of sulfur compounds.

In short, I have copper sponges in the steam line of the stripping distillation and a copper dome with a copper condenser on my spirit run. Do I care of sulphur? Not much.

[Homebrewer11777]

That Harrison paper is interesting. I wish it included the impact of having copper in same section of both the wash and spirit stainless stills. As I understand that graph, S2 and S5 are the stainless stills with copper in the vapor path. It looks like copper in the vapor path in the wash (stripping) still reduces sulfur compounds by more than 80% and when in the spirit still reduces by more than 60%. And this is compared to two passes through all copper still which reduces sulfur by about 95%.

So if the wash started with 100 parts of sulfur two passes through all copper would leave 5 parts. In the stainless still with copper at S2 and S5...after S2 there would be 20 parts left and after S5 there would be 8 parts left which may not actually be different given the error bars in the experiment.

Same with the experiment where they swapped out only one part in each copper still. Would have been interesting to see if the copper still with stainless in the vapor path for both the wash still and the spirit still would be able to knock down the sulfur.

[VLAGAVULVIN]

So if the wash started with 100 parts of sulfur two passes through all copper would leave 5 parts.

But what if it started with 5 parts only?

The strip of poorly fermented mash at 45% from the spout smells like unsuccessfully stewed cabbage. But how often do we encounter this? I can't even remember the last time this happened. Moreover: I select a little bit of "strip scents" at a strength of 47% to 43% for long maturation in a separate jar. After a year, it turns out to be a great thang for blending.