Fuselexpress Condenser 92% Alc.....

[draco]

Ah. I guess that makes sense but to tell the truth I like the stainless or copper look better. You make a good point about being a high percentage for such a short column.

[grogrum]

I like the stainless or copper look better.

That's easy to do - just polish the paint back off and polish it up

Copper look condenser

Copper Condenser sm.jpg (10.71 KiB) Viewed 3976 times

[grogrum]

Final yield was 4.5 litres in just under 100 minutes form commencement of the rolling boil at 76 c. Smell clean.

I just completed a burn using the essencia express and a wash made with Super 6. Stuck the results into the yield calculator (downloadable from http://www.essencia.com.au/downloads.htm )
These are the results obtained:
Sugar
Kilograms fermented 6 kg
Cost per kg $ 0.78
Other
Cost of yeast $ 6.95

Spirit Yield
Amount 3.4 Litres
Measured Strength (ABV) 95.5 %
Temperature of spirit 28 oC
Corrected Strength 94.4 % ABV @ 20oC

Statistics normalised at 40% ABV
Total amount of spirit 8.1175 Litres
Amount of spirit per kg of sugar 1.4 Litres
Overall cost per Litre $1.43 excludes electricity, etc

Have been waiting to see further detail posted here but in the absence of any, I thought I might take Reflux_King's results and see how they stack up. These are they.......
Sugar
Kilograms fermented 8 kg
Cost per kg $0.78
Other
Cost of yeast $9.50

Spirit Yield
Amount 4.5 Litres
Measured Strength (ABV) 92.0 %
Temperature of spirit 25 oC
Corrected Strength 90.7 % ABV @ 20oC

Statistics normalised at 40% ABV
Total amount of spirit 10.35 Litres
Amount of spirit per kg of sugar 1.3 Litres
Overall cost per Litre $1.52 excludes electricity, etc

I had to make some assumptions as the original data didn't give such things as spirit temp (mine was 28deg, because the air temp today is 28deg - I assumed Reflux_King may have had it a little cooler.

Interestingly, the eventual yield is only about 10c a litre different - and I'd put that down to the use of an 8kg Turbo yeast (the residual sugar will be in the region of 800g as none of these yeasts will actually convert that much sugar)

[grogrum]

[quote="Reflux_King"] I also found the digital thermometer an advantage, the fractional readout helps to balance the temperature, being able to see an increase or decrease of 1/10th of a degree helps a lot.quote]
I'm not sure I would agree with this.
One of the greatest misunderstandings that people have with reflux condensers is that the temp they are looking at at the measure point is actually the boiling point of Ethanol.
It isn't. It is simply a reference temperature at that point (usually at or near the take-off point) in the column. When the column is operating in balance - that particular temp is the temp you want. It may approximate the boiling point of Ethanol or Ethyl Alcohol.

For this reason - a thermometer with the precision to be read in 1/10ths of a degree can cause the operator to start making too many 'micro-adjustments'!
A reflux in balance will wander a little within it's own balance envelope, and attempts to make too many adjustments too fast inevitably knock it out of balance - thus the inevitable surge.

Anyone got a differing view?

[HookLine]

A reflux in balance will wander a little within it's own balance envelope, and attempts to make too many adjustments too fast inevitably knock it out of balance - thus the inevitable surge.

Anyone got a differing view?

Yup. I have a basic $40 electronic food thermo that reads in 0.1 ºC increments. Once I am into the hearts, the temp sits rock solid (± 0.1 ºC, allowing for weather changes; often it sits on exactly the same temp for hours at a time). When it consistently rises 0.2 ºC, then I know the end of the run is only about 20 minutes away. Done that on pretty well every run of the reflux still.

I agree that the exact temp is not important, and that it is pattern of change/variation that counts.

[minime]

sits on exactly the same temp for hours at a time). When it consistently rises 0.2 ºC, then I know the end of the run is only about 20 minutes away. Done that on pretty well every run of the reflux still.

I agree that the exact temp is not important, and that its pattern of change/variation is what counts.

Mine works exactly the same way. It doesn't wander up and down at all. Just sits at the same temperature 'till most of the hearts are gone from the boiler when bleeding 95+.

It does wander a bit when I push it down to the 93-94% range for white rum but always within 3/10 Celsius range

[VicBill]

I have to agree with Hook and Mini. My little mini bokakob, while producing 93-93.5% runs at constant temp.

As soon as temp rises .2 C I call it tails. Usually don't get much of these.

With a constant temp and equal flow rate, I cannot understand why temp would fluctuate, unless the coolant temp fluctuated or flow rate changed. Once in equalibrium, it should stay there until something changes (liquid constituents, heat input, coolant temp, maybe air pressure, etc)

[Reflux_King]

Vic Bill,
Ive just read the temp discussion, feedback i hear is with incriments of 1.0 degree, its not possible to detect the end of the run until you are 5x over the 0.2 change which some use as an indicator for tails. temp variances ARE most often realted to drop off of flow from the tap, as we all know this is a common occurance, so opening the tap fully and controlling the outflow, works well together with a fractional thermometer and ball valve on the outlet.

[minime]

Vic Bill,
its not possible to detect the end of the run until you are 5x over the 0.2 change which some use as an indicator for tails. temp variances ARE most often realted to drop off of flow from the tap, as we all know this is a common occurance, so opening the tap fully and controlling the outflow.

Your dead wrong on that Mr. King. All my vodka runs occur within 2/10C for hearts collection. Because a reduction in output and rise in temperature occur hand in hand they are not completely related. The drop in output on a reflux column indicates the bulk of alcohol is gone from the boiler. The rise in temperature indicates higher boiling point alcohols are ascending the column and the output valve should be closed to induce more reflux.
My VM column has a large reduction in output volume long before I see the first 1/10C increase in temperature.

[Reflux_King]

Mr Bill,
i cant quite agree on being DEAD WRONG, and i dont disagree with you. But controling tempature in a heat exchanger is deceptive. Perception can be, and often is that the faster the flow the better the cooling, when in fact closing flow improves cooling for a period, im sure you will know this. So the incriments of 1/10 of a degree most certainly afford a greater degree of control in micro adjustments in comparison to a display of a full 1 degree steps. im not guessing at this, i run 800 kg at a time through a spiral flow heat exchanger/pasturiser, we have an array of temperature monitors in the system.......none of them are there for decoration.

[maoule]

Mr Bill,
i cant quite agree on being DEAD WRONG, and i dont disagree with you. But controling tempature in a heat exchanger is deceptive. Perception can be, and often is that the faster the flow the better the cooling, when in fact closing flow improves cooling for a period, im sure you will know this. So the incriments of 1/10 of a degree most certainly afford a greater degree of control in micro adjustments in comparison to a display of a full 1 degree steps. im not guessing at this, i run 800 kg at a time through a spiral flow heat exchanger/pasturiser, we have an array of temperature monitors in the system.......none of them are there for decoration.

[Reflux_King]

CORRECTION, my reply was to minime not vic bill, apologies for the error

[grogrum]

I have to agree with Hook and Mini. My little mini bokakob, while producing 93-93.5% runs at constant temp.

As soon as temp rises .2 C I call it tails. Usually don't get much of these.

With a constant temp and equal flow rate, I cannot understand why temp would fluctuate, unless the coolant temp fluctuated or flow rate changed. Once in equalibrium, it should stay there until something changes (liquid constituents, heat input, coolant temp, maybe air pressure, etc)

Yes, indeed. I also agree - - when talking about a good-sized column (such as a 1.8m VM).

But this thread was talking about the Fusel Express. It is a commercial short column masquerading as a water purifier - for legality reasons. These short column (250mm) refluxing condensers are, I suppose, not 'true' refluxes and are inherently unstable. They do reach an equilibrium point - but it is an uneasy balance!

[minime]

I have to agree with Hook and Mini. My little mini bokakob, while producing 93-93.5% runs at constant temp.

As soon as temp rises .2 C I call it tails. Usually don't get much of these.

With a constant temp and equal flow rate, I cannot understand why temp would fluctuate, unless the coolant temp fluctuated or flow rate changed. Once in equalibrium, it should stay there until something changes (liquid constituents, heat input, coolant temp, maybe air pressure, etc)

Yes, indeed. I also agree - - when talking about a good-sized column (such as a 1.8m VM).

But this thread was talking about the Fusel Express. It is a commercial short column masquerading as a water purifier - for legality reasons. These short column (250mm) refluxing condensers are, I suppose, not 'true' refluxes and are inherently unstable. They do reach an equilibrium point - but it is an uneasy balance!

Ah, thanks for the clarification.

[mackay australia]

Hi all,

I also have a fuselex express unit that I brought last christmas. To date I haven't been able to produce result equal to ReFlux King. Usually I get roughly 3.5 Litres @ 88-90% from 7 Kgs sugar. Sometimes I find the process a little tempermental in as much that sometimes the flow from the still tends to surge and the quality when the flow starts to surge is generally no good.

Can someone suggest what may cause this surging to take place. I'm at a loss to the reason.

[grogrum]

Hi all,

I also have a fuselex express unit that I brought last christmas. To date I haven't been able to produce result equal to ReFlux King. Usually I get roughly 3.5 Litres @ 88-90% from 7 Kgs sugar. Sometimes I find the process a little tempermental in as much that sometimes the flow from the still tends to surge and the quality when the flow starts to surge is generally no good.

Can someone suggest what may cause this surging to take place. I'm at a loss to the reason.

Foaming in Distillations in general.pdf

Some help to understand Surging and the underlying foaming.

(91.37 KiB) Downloaded 168 times

This attachment can possibly give you some guidance. Its not really a condenser problem - more a wash issue. There are ways to deal with it and ways to minimise it. The document goes through this - basically add a 'surface-tension' reliever substance to your still. Also, your yield is a little low, suggesting you have quite a bit of unfermented sugar when you distil.