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Bradster68 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 02, 2022 2:09 pm Usually they all end up dry.990. Just.like the recipe said. I use a hydrometer every time so I know something was off. Still got a good yield though and no complaints about the sweet taste. I'll be doing another soon and I'll post my results

I just checked on the mash and it is at .990 so I will rack her into some carboys for a clearing phase soon. While it's clearing I will start a fresh mash of Ted's in the fermenter.

Dutch41 wrote: ↑Sat Nov 05, 2022 7:18 am

Bradster68 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 02, 2022 2:09 pm Usually they all end up dry.990. Just.like the recipe said. I use a hydrometer every time so I know something was off. Still got a good yield though and no complaints about the sweet taste. I'll be doing another soon and I'll post my results

I just checked on the mash and it is at .990 so I will rack her into some carboys for a clearing phase soon. While it's clearing I will start a fresh mash of Ted's in the fermenter.

That's a perfect batch right there. Nice

News from the front...
Since yesterday, my fourth TFFV 70-litre batch of this year is nicely fizzling, the previous one is waiting for its stripping run. The first three are next going to become a nice neutral after a spirit run in my VM. So two more TFFV batches, and I'll go for a molasses/ sugar cane brown sugar series because T° are slightly rising down here...
Ted's recipe deserves the qualification of bulletproof recipe, congratulations and many thanks again !

Garouda wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 1:35 am News from the front...
Since yesterday, my fourth TFFV 70-litre batch of this year is nicely fizzling, the previous one is waiting for its stripping run. The first three are next going to become a nice neutral after a spirit run in my VM. So two more TFFV batches, and I'll go for a molasses/ sugar cane brown sugar series because T° are slightly rising down here...
Ted's recipe deserves the qualification of bulletproof recipe, congratulations and many thanks again !

It's a very simple recipe. Very hard to mess up. For a while I was doing 55 litre batches.
Ferment dry in 4 days. 3 more to clear. Done. Ted's got a few good ideas he's provided to this forum. to him.

I could sit and watch the bran volcanos all day it's so cool to watch it work.

Canuckwoods wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 1:37 am I could sit and watch the bran volcanos all day it's so cool to watch it work.

It is one crazy active ferment, that's for sure

I've done over 30 batches of TFFV and it has never failed and always started strong and finished within 5-6 days. -- very reliable.

Rrmuf wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 5:56 am I've done over 30 batches of TFFV and it has never failed and always started strong and finished within 5-6 days. -- very reliable.

to that

Rrmuf wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 5:56 am I've done over 30 batches of TFFV and it has never failed and always started strong and finished within 5-6 days. -- very reliable.

I can confirm this. In my case, there's a slight difference, I do not add any citric acid, do not make any measurements SG or pH whatsoever any more which by the way could be the cause of contamination. The boiling sugar/water and bran mash raise the T°to > 80 °C, which pasteurizes the fermenter... I use one kg of rice bran instead of the 750 g given by the recipe (basic recipe x3), we grow sticky rice here and bran is free. There's no airlock, I regularly open the lid to release the pressure of the produced CO2. It's funny to observe, when I open the lid, the surface of the liquid is quiet, but starts fizzling after a few seconds, with sometimes a large bubble of CO2 bursting the surface... When the yeasts have finished their job, after 5 or 6 days, there's a slight difference in colour. I then use my hydrometer to measure the SG : 0.990...
A refractometer gives wrong values due to the Bran... (e.g. 5% Brix on the refractometer-SG 0.990 on the hydrometer Stevenson and Reeves S1011 Triple Scale Hydrometer). There's a T&T recipes section, TFFV deserves the "Bullet Proof" award !

Garouda wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 6:21 pm

Rrmuf wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 5:56 am I've done over 30 batches of TFFV and it has never failed and always started strong and finished within 5-6 days. -- very reliable.

I can confirm this. In my case, there's a slight difference, I do not add any citric acid, do not make any measurements SG or pH whatsoever any more which by the way could be the cause of contamination. The boiling sugar/water and bran mash raise the T°to > 80 °C, which pasteurizes the fermenter... I use one kg of rice bran instead of the 750 g given by the recipe (basic recipe x3), we grow sticky rice here and bran is free. There's no airlock, I regularly open the lid to release the pressure of the produced CO2. It's funny to observe, when I open the lid, the surface of the liquid is quiet, but starts fizzling after a few seconds, with sometimes a large bubble of CO2 bursting the surface... When the yeasts have finished their job, after 5 or 6 days, there's a slight difference in colour. I then use my hydrometer to measure the SG : 0.990...
A refractometer gives wrong values due to the Bran... (e.g. 5% Brix on the refractometer-SG 0.990 on the hydrometer Stevenson and Reeves S1011 Triple Scale Hydrometer). There's a T&T recipes section, TFFV deserves the "Bullet Proof" award !

Your exactly right Garouda. I never added the acid either. But I did hang a small bag of egg shells to keep ph in check. If you follow the recipe you just can't mess it up.

i think with the acid, you should do what you need to do to your water, not what other people do or don't do.
my filtered town water is usually 7.8-8.0 so i bring it down with citric.
i've done about 80 x 25l of FFV and not had a failure yet.
never needed to add any oyster.
all fermenters are cleaned after use, star san, rinsed and air-dried. (beer brewing habits die hard )
it really is bullet proof.
the question is......where has all that 2000l of wash gone?
<looks at gin stock, ethenol stock, low wines stock, liver x-rays> oh!

howie wrote: ↑Wed Feb 22, 2023 8:16 pm i think with the acid, you should do what you need to do to your water, not what other people do or don't do.
my filtered town water is usually 7.8-8.0 so i bring it down with citric.
i've done about 80 x 25l of FFV and not had a failure yet.
never needed to add any oyster.
all fermenters are cleaned after use, star san, rinsed and air-dried. (beer brewing habits die hard )
it really is bullet proof.
the question is......where has all that 2000l of wash gone?
<looks at gin stock, ethenol stock, low wines stock, liver x-rays> oh!

Garouda wrote: ↑Tue Feb 14, 2023 1:35 am Ted's recipe deserves the qualification of bulletproof recipe, congratulations and many thanks again !

Thanks indeed. I am humbled by your praise

Bradster68 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 6:53 pm Your exactly right Garouda. I never added the acid either. But I did hang a small bag of egg shells to keep ph in check. If you follow the recipe you just can't mess it up.

Adding eggs or oyster shells can work as a pH buffer, and are only necessary when your water is too acidic. Yeasts do like a low pH environment up to 3.5, ideally around 4.5-5; a low pH also prevents the development of other undesired organisms, I do not add those fashionable oyster shells either... A stalled fermentation showing a low pH is often due to a contamination from acetobacter or from lactic acid bacteria... I guess many articles recommend controlling your pH because they are sponsored by a company selling pH meters... Good pH meters are expensive, know your water by using some litmus paper before pitching the yeasts. Nowadays, I do not make any control whatsoever except a visual control when I open the lid of my fermenter to release the CO2 pressure. When I think that the fermentation is finished, I check with my hydrometer as explained in a previous post. Each time you want to take a measure, you run the risk of contaminating your wash...

Garouda wrote: ↑Fri Feb 24, 2023 2:35 am

Bradster68 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 6:53 pm Your exactly right Garouda. I never added the acid either. But I did hang a small bag of egg shells to keep ph in check. If you follow the recipe you just can't mess it up.

Adding eggs or oyster shells can work as a pH buffer, and are only necessary when your water is too acidic. Yeasts do like a low pH environment up to 3.5, ideally around 4.5-5; a low pH also prevents the development of other undesired organisms, I do not add those fashionable oyster shells either... A stalled fermentation showing a low pH is often due to a contamination from acetobacter or from lactic acid bacteria... I guess many articles recommend controlling your pH because they are sponsored by a company selling pH meters... Good pH meters are expensive, know your water by using some litmus paper before pitching the yeasts. Nowadays, I do not make any control whatsoever except a visual control when I open the lid of my fermenter to release the CO2 pressure. When I think that the fermentation is finished, I check with my hydrometer as explained in a previous post. Each time you want to take a measure, you run the risk of contaminating your wash...

Mine was taking about 2 weeks and ending above 1.000 until I discovered my problem was pH buffering. I have extremely soft water (very little mineral content) and almost no pH buffering. See thread on pH problems (viewtopic.php?p=7739310#p7739310). I've been adding about 250mL of crushed oyster shells to buffer pH, reducing time to about 1 week. I could add pure (powdered) calcium carbonate to further optimize fermentation, but it takes a whole lot. Oyster shells are cheap and easy.

My first attempt at this was a slow success. I have a 3 gal pot still and miscalculated the sugar ratio. 4 lbs sugar, 115g bran, made up to 10 qts with SG 1.080. Took about 8 days to finish. Next time I’ll use 3.25 lbs sugar, 100g bran, and should hit the 1.060 SG. I’m also going to add oyster shells next time, as my ph got down in the 4s. But it made 1.5l of good liquor! No off flavors, and tons of hearts.

Used some of it for Kahlua, which is getting rave reviews (1 cup vodka, 1/2 cup espresso, 1/4 cup sugar, 1/4 cup coconut sugar, 1 tsp vanilla).

Jimmygu3 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 01, 2023 10:12 am My first attempt at this was a slow success. I have a 3 gal pot still and miscalculated the sugar ratio. 4 lbs sugar, 115g bran, made up to 10 qts with SG 1.080. Took about 8 days to finish. Next time I’ll use 3.25 lbs sugar, 100g bran, and should hit the 1.060 SG. I’m also going to add oyster shells next time, as my ph got down in the 4s. But it made 1.5l of good liquor! No off flavors, and tons of hearts.

Used some of it for Kahlua, which is getting rave reviews (1 cup vodka, 1/2 cup espresso, 1/4 cup sugar, 1/4 cup coconut sugar, 1 tsp vanilla).

The sugar ratio/still size does not tell anything, how much water in total, 10 qts, do you mean US quarts, so it's 9.5 litres (9.4635)?
The bran isn't that critical, 100g or 115 g, are you serious? I'm at 136g/10qts (1 kg/70 litres) but I'm using free sticky rice bran we grow here.
Indeed, you were high in sugar, stick to Ted's recipe, it's 4kg for 23 litres, or in your case 3.6 pounds for 10 quarts... SG 1.067
You could use metric measures by the way, many thanks to "a little help from my friend" FermCalc for the conversions...
Did you add DAP, Epsom salts, vitamins accordingly?
There are no oyster shells in Ted's recipe and a pH in the 4s is OK, you may reduce the citric acid, I'm not adding any.
I'm regularly making 70 litres batches, and it takes 4/5 days to reach 0.990...

Yes I’m serious, lol. I know the minor adjustment on the bran doesn’t make a huge difference, nor does the still size to sugar ratio. As I said, I made it up to 10 qts (US). I suppose about a quart of that was the increased volume due to the dissolved sugar, so maybe it was just 9 qts water I added to 4 lbs sugar (it came in a 4 lb bag and it seemed close enough). Anyway, the still wouldn’t have enough headroom with any more liquid, so I’m going with 9 QTs water and 3.4 lbs sugar next time. Should be just like the recipe. Thanks for the reply.

Jimmygu3 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 02, 2023 5:31 pm Thanks for the reply.

My pleasure...
The way I always proceed is to divide my sugar into two parts. I'm following Ted's recipe times 3, so 4 kg --> 12 kg and 23 litres --> 69 litres rounded up to 70 litres. I borrow two large sauce pans from my wife's kitchen utensils, 7 kg sugar in one 5 kg sugar in the second, I cover with water from my well and bring it to boil. I then pour the boiling sugar/water mixture into my stainless steel fermenter and then cook my bran as Ted explains it, beware bran can easily overflow. Likewise, I pour the hot bran into the fermenter, wait for 15/20 minutes to let the heat sanitize the whole (T° up to 80+ °C), then I add drinking water and adjust the level up to 70 litres (+/- do you know the trick to mark your SS fermenter with a 9 volts battery, vinegar and a cotton bud?) and leave it to cool down, I reactivate my yeast as soon as the T°is below 30 °C and add the yeast and the nutrients to the fermenter, using a large whisk to aerate the wash as much as possible, I do not trust the aquarium air stone trick any more, too risky. I've never got a stalled/slow fermentation with Ted's bulletproof recipe and with that method, I made several Hl so far... This gives me a clean neutral (VM still), I usually do three stripping runs that go in one spirit run, the interesting thing is the whisky smell I can recognize from the tails when I clean my column...
Nowadays, the weather is already too hot, 11 g of Kveik yeast are more expensive than 500 g of instant baker's yeast! I'm going to try to make some whisky during the next cold (?) season...

howie wrote: ↑Wed Feb 22, 2023 8:16 pm i think with the acid, you should do what you need to do to your water, not what other people do or don't do.
my filtered town water is usually 7.8-8.0 so i bring it down with citric.
i've done about 80 x 25l of FFV and not had a failure yet.
never needed to add any oyster.
all fermenters are cleaned after use, star san, rinsed and air-dried. (beer brewing habits die hard )
it really is bullet proof.
the question is......where has all that 2000l of wash gone?
<looks at gin stock, ethenol stock, low wines stock, liver x-rays> oh!

+1 citrid acid is completely a result of the water you use. If you don't need it, great! My water is over 7 and I typically bring it down around 6 or a bit less and use oyster shells to maintain the desired PH level. The shells do degrade over time so I think they do add a benefit with my water.

Im curious as to doing a neutral using this recipe, however I don't want the slight "wheat flavour".

Could I substitute the bran for rice powder at all? Or would that not be the right nutrients that the bran provides?

If you don't want the slight Wheat influence then choose a different recipe. Shaydys sugar shine might be a better fit.

Facter wrote: ↑Fri May 26, 2023 2:35 pm Im curious as to doing a neutral using this recipe, however I don't want the slight "wheat flavour".

Could I substitute the bran for rice powder at all? Or would that not be the right nutrients that the bran provides?

It all depends upon your still, personally I do not recommend Shady's recipe, maybe because of trying it, it's the only time I got a stalled fermentation.
My still is a Ø 3" VM still, and I can produce a real neutral even with a molasses wash...
The wheat flavour comes from the tails, while cleaning my still, I can identify a typical whisky smell due to the tails that are on the pot scrubbers in my column, but the heart is a pure 95.5 ° neutral...
The reason why Teds' recipe is a bulletproof recipe is that, beside lots of nutrients (minerals, vitamins), bran provides fibres.
So far I've successfully made several hectolitres of wash following Ted's recipe...
By the way, I'm using rice bran because we grow sticky rice here, it comes fresh from the mill and free...
I quote :The Compleat Distiller page 13 "Particles for them to stick to, which helps to keep them suspended in the fermenting fluid." them = the yeasts of course... Don't ask me why the title of that book is the Compleat and not Complete distiller...
THE COMPLEAT DISTILLER, Michael Nixon & Michael McCaw, ISBN 0-473-08135-0. I managed several years ago to download a free PDF...
I highly recommend that book !

Facter wrote: ↑Fri May 26, 2023 2:35 pm Im curious as to doing a neutral using this recipe, however I don't want the slight "wheat flavour".

Could I substitute the bran for rice powder at all? Or would that not be the right nutrients that the bran provides?

there are lots of tricks you can use, using less wheat bran is one of them. I'm not a wheat fan, so my version used far less wheat and it still got repurposed rather than used as vodka.

Your choice of still makes a big difference. If you are running a simple pot still and wanting neutral, you don't want much flavor from the ingredients in the wash, so TFFV and Turbo are a poor choice compared to SSS. I've been making Shady's for over three decades and don't recall ever having a disaster. It is slower than TFFV because it doesn't have similar high levels of nutrients, but the final product gets less flavor from the ingredients.

If you are stripping wash using a pot still, then spirit running using reflux, flavors in the wash are not as important.

Garouda wrote: ↑Fri May 26, 2023 8:42 pm

Facter wrote: ↑Fri May 26, 2023 2:35 pm Im curious as to doing a neutral using this recipe, however I don't want the slight "wheat flavour".

Could I substitute the bran for rice powder at all? Or would that not be the right nutrients that the bran provides?

It all depends upon your still, personally I do not recommend Shady's recipe, maybe because of trying it, it's the only time I got a stalled fermentation.
My still is a Ø 3" VM still, and I can produce a real neutral even with a molasses wash...
The wheat flavour comes from the tails, while cleaning my still, I can identify a typical whisky smell due to the tails that are on the pot scrubbers in my column, but the heart is a pure 95.5 ° neutral...
The reason why Teds' recipe is a bulletproof recipe is that, beside lots of nutrients (minerals, vitamins), bran provides fibres.
So far I've successfully made several hectolitres of wash following Ted's recipe...
By the way, I'm using rice bran because we grow sticky rice here, it comes fresh from the mill and free...
I quote :The Compleat Distiller page 13 "Particles for them to stick to, which helps to keep them suspended in the fermenting fluid." them = the yeasts of course... Don't ask me why the title of that book is the Compleat and not Complete distiller...
THE COMPLEAT DISTILLER, Michael Nixon & Michael McCaw, ISBN 0-473-08135-0. I managed several years ago to download a free PDF...
I highly recommend that book !

I have downloaded this book,along with tons of others, but haven't gotten a chance to read it yet.

Bradster68 wrote: ↑Sat May 27, 2023 3:21 am

Garouda wrote: ↑Fri May 26, 2023 8:42 pm I quote :The Compleat Distiller page 13 "Particles for them to stick to, which helps to keep them suspended in the fermenting fluid." them = the yeasts of course... Don't ask me why the title of that book is the Compleat and not Complete distiller...
THE COMPLEAT DISTILLER, Michael Nixon & Michael McCaw, ISBN 0-473-08135-0. I managed several years ago to download a free PDF...
I highly recommend that book !

I have downloaded this book,along with tons of others, but haven't gotten a chance to read it yet.

That's the problem, indeed, tons of books and there are several books that do not go straight to the point, if you have time to read at least one book, that's the one I recommend.

Hi all.

I stripped a couple of FFV on the weekend.
I went fairly deep on one and the low wine is a little cloudy. The other strip was completely clear.

Still fairly new to this.

Do others see FFV low wines cloud like this? Is this normal for FFV?

Low wines can be cloudy. Depends on what it is and how deep you go. Don't worry and all will be well on the spirit run.

zed255 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 04, 2023 4:58 pm Low wines can be cloudy. Depends on what it is and how deep you go. Don't worry and all will be well on the spirit run.

It's often because you do not clean your still after use. I rinse my column and my Liebig condenser each time and wait until water comes out clear.