Home Distiller

Hi guys,
I was a serving soldier and come from N Ireland. I served in the army regulars from 1969 to 1981 and a lot of that time was on active service in Belfast and my family, parents only lived 40 miles up the motorway with all the ensuing terror and stress that they went through.
While I was serving in the army a lot of my friends/buddies got killed in the terror campaign in Northern Ireland. They went out on night patrol and just didn’t come back. (But we all believed in what we where doing and we all knew someone had to make a stand no matter how shitty it got).
So I’m not sorry to say, the wishy washy attitude of all you anti war people just sickens me and pisses me off, if it wasn’t for guys like my mates and all those American/British guys that landed and died in Normandy you wouldn’t be able to have all your noble liberal attitudes that you hold so dear
But when you have filled a few of your dead mates kite bags and separated their personal private stuff into signed and sealed jiffy bags. You tend to get a different perspective on everything.
My point is that if you stand by and do nothing, evil corrupt people will and do win out.
To name but a few like Stalin, Hitler, Pol-Pot, Gadaffi, Slobodan Milosevic, Saddam Hussein.
So at what point do we as a human being draw a line in the sand and say enough is enough these people must be stopped. (And who is going to stop them?????????)
And like making scrambled eggs you have to break a few eggs and stand on a few toes along the way. If some people get offended that’s just tough, deal with it. There where people like you before WW1 and WW2 and there always will be.
Here in N.Ireland we now have a rule of law much the same as you had in 1930’s with Al Capone with all the towns divided up into different turfs with different ruling thugs from the two major ruling families Catholics and Protestants. Long gone is any pretence of any Noble Causes. On either side what matters now, is black mail, scams, protection rackets, kickbacks, drugs, prostitution, corruption at it’s worst and plenty of it. But keep it all well covered up from bad publicity and kept well under the “Noble Causes” (of “Free Ireland” or “No Surrender” umbrella) and keep following the money trail no matter what. And a peace of sorts springs out of all this, as long as you keep in line and pay up when the man calls. (I personally don’t pay and wouldn’t, I have too many old friends who would haunt me if I did, but I know those who do).
I don’t normally sound off like this and I know this is not the forum to do so, but everyone else is throwing their pennies worth in. So I just thought I would speak up on behalf of many well remembered dead mates who can’t speak up.
Who liked nothing better than a bloody good drink of poteen/moonshine when I got hold of it, have a bloody good laugh and enjoy themselves
So, Nuf said I’m off the soap box now. If I’m bumped off the forum because of this I don’t really mind, but I’ll still read the forum because it’s got real good information on it.

Regards Geoff

geoff, i dont disagree with war i just dont like violence, i wish everyone could just live in peace but i know that will never happen n i know that sometimes the only way is for war, such as the world wars.

Hi Brett,
I don’t like violence either and avoid it if I can. And if I can do anyone a good turn I will. But do on to others before they do on to you. Sorry but that’s life and the school of hard knocks talking.
Geoff

I wholeheartedly agree that we should all stand up against evil and do away with it wherever it raises its ugly head. If we stand fast against the greed and evil of George Bush and Tony Blair, maybe one day we will have a truly just and peaceful society. Until then, stand fast and fight the good fight!

"the greed and evil of George Bush and Tony Blair"

OK, I'll bite. Please explain to me how Bush an Blair have personally profited from the war in Iraq. Greed is defined as "An excessive desire to acquire or possess more than what one needs or deserves, especially with respect to material wealth." Just how much have they profited?

Next, explain what makes Bush and Blair evil, again defined as "Morally bad or wrong; wicked: an evil tyrant." The last I heard, Bush and Blair were responsible for freeing 17 million people who did live under an evil dictator. You want evil? Try this on for size.

1979 - US Embassy in Pakistan attacked by mob mistakenly blaming the US for radical Islamic faction hostage crisis in Mecca
1979 - Iran Hostage Crisis, Nov. 4, 1979 444 days
1980 - Iranians seized the Iranian embassy in London, taking twenty-six people hostage. Two hostages were killed on May 5. Special forces stormed the embassy in Operation Nimrod, rescuing the remaining hostages and killing five of the six terrorists. Much of the embassy was destroyed by fire.
1983 - Bombing of US Embassy in Beirut, April 18, 1983
1983 - Bombing of Marine Barracks, Beirut, Oct 23,1983
1984 - Twenty-two people were killed (2 of them American) and seventy were wounded when a van loaded with four hundred pounds of explosives exploded in front of the U.S. Embassy annex in Awkar, Lebanon. Islamic Jihad (code name of Hezbollah) claimed responsibility for the bombing in a call to the media.
1985 - TWA Flight 847 hijacked, U.S. Navy diver killed
1985 - Achille Lauro hijacking, wheel-chair bound American killed by Palestinian terrorists
1986 - Four Americans were killed and nine people, including five Americans, were injured when a bomb exploded aboard TWA Flight 840 as it traveled from Rome to Athens. The aircraft was able to land safely at Athens airport.
1986 - Berlin discotheque bombing
1987 - A car bomb exploded outside the back gate of the U.S. Embassy in Rome and rockets were fired at the compound from across the street. One passerby was injured in the attacks.
1988 - April 14 at 8pm, a car bomb exploded in front of the USO Club in Naples, Italy. Five people died and fifteen were injured, including four U.S. servicemen. Junzo Okudaira, a Japanese Red Army (JRA) member, was indicted in the United States on April 9, 1993 for the Naples bombing. Okudaira is also a suspect in the June 1987 car bombing and mortar attack against the U.S. Embassy in Rome.
1988 - Pan Am Flight 103, outbound from London for New York with 259 people aboard, was destroyed by a bomb on December 21, 1988 while over Lockerbie, Scotland. All aboard the aircraft were killed as were eleven persons on the ground.
1993 - First World Trade Center bombing, February 26: 6 Killed, 1,000 injured
1995 - Killing of two US Diplomats in Pakistan, March 8, 1995
1996 - Khobar Towers bombing: 19 American servicemen killed
1998 - US embassy bombings: U.S. Kenya Embassy blown up, 214 killed (12 Americans); U.S. Tanzania Embassy blown up, 10 killed
1999 - Millennium terror plot foiled. Plan by Al Qaeda related groups to attack Los Angeles International Airport, the USS The Sullivans, and tourist sites in Jordan
2000 - USS Cole attacked, 17 U.S. Navy sailors killed
2001 - World Trade Center attacked and the Pentagon attacked by airplanes, 2995 killed
2002 - Reporter Daniel Pearl, kidnapped and beheaded
2002 - Karachi consulate attack
2002 - 2 Marines shot, 1 killed in Kuwait
2003 - Riyadh Compound Bombings kill 9 Americans, among 35 others
2004 - Civilians Nicholas Berg, Jack Hensley, and Eugene Armstrong kidnapped and beheaded in Iraq
2004 - Paul Marshall Johnson, Jr, civilian working in Saudi Arabia, kidnapped and beheaded; 5 other Americans die in attacks in Saudi Arabia in 2004

These are the people who are trying to give you your free and just society. And you call George Bush evil? You had better hope that we stop them or you will be wearing sheets for clothes and praying to Allah 5 times a day. That's not my idea of a free and just society.

AkCoyote

AkCoyote wrote:"the greed and evil of George Bush and Tony Blair"

OK, I'll bite. Please explain to me how Bush an Blair have personally profited from the war in Iraq.

Sorry, but it seems you are just too ignorant for this discussion.

"What makes yer opinion the "right" one? Am I susposed to be swayed to yer position solely by you sayin' "the other guy is stupid"?"

I didn't call anyone "stupid". I said they were :ignorant". Anyone who asks how Bush personally profitted from a war in Iraq doesn't have all his facts and needs to do a bit more researching.




I don't care what anyones political beliefs are. I'm near the extreme edge of the political spectrum. Bein' way out there I've learned that no-one changes anyone's mind. Believe what ever you want, but show tolerance. Tolerance is so important to livin'.[/quote]

THM ur right im pretty much way of on the political spectrum to and something iv come to realise is that everyone has there own views about it and no one is willing to listen to anothers opinion, there simply right because they believe they are, what we believe n what we actually know doesnt make any difference as we will never know all the truths. As such i agree we should keep politics far away from this forum n in future anything like any of the past posts will be ignored by me and id like to suggest that everyone else simply ignores them.

To put it simple we all have our own political beliefs and it seems some people will take digs without just discussing the relevant topic, so lets ignore them, dont bite back, there entitled to there opinions if we agree with them or not, so id like to ask in future sit back sip a brew count to 10 and read the next thread, its what ill be doing

Hi there AkCoyote
Here!! Here!! I couldn't agree with you more. George bush and our Tony Blair may not be perfect but what’s the alternative. We always hear the major powers in the world come out with this line after an atrocity like the WW2 massacre of Jews in Europe.
This must never be allowed to happen again, but they do allow it to happen again again and again. So can you really blame Israel for getting nasty?
Fact is the Jews creed since WW2 is “Never Again” and they have stuck to it. No matter what the rest of the world thinks. So when the major powers say Never Again and all parties in the UN agree to it throughout the world at the time. Is it just talk or just lip service, to be forgotten when the next, one more atrocity comes along as has happened so many times in recent history.
When a few world leaders like Tony Blair and George Bush actually have the balls to stand up and stick by their convictions they are then the great evil people in the world. Empty promises don’t protect your family.
I was a wannabe hippy years ago and all this “peace man” was great at the time and the idea of everyone living in peace and harmony is a nice thought, but like the ideal life, or marriage it’s a dream for most of us and a myth and a nice fairy tale. I would really like it to be so. But wake up and smell the Coffee before your house ends up like an indoor grenade range.
This is the end of this futile thread for me because it’s going nowhere. I just got me a 10 gallon aluminium milk churn that needs a bit of mechanical surgery. And two electrical elements that need to be wired and connected. So I’m gone, and I’m going to do something important. I’m not sorry but I’m finished with this thread guys. Now to get to the important stuff
Geoff

ginzo wrote:

AkCoyote wrote:"the greed and evil of George Bush and Tony Blair"

OK, I'll bite. Please explain to me how Bush an Blair have personally profited from the war in Iraq.

Sorry, but it seems you are just too ignorant for this discussion.

What are you sorry for, Ginz? Do you dispute the facts Coyote presents? Or do you think he's "ignorant" because he acknowledges them?

I realize that you and I don't agree on these matters, but civility is the goal to reach for. (Sometimes, I fall short--mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa). Forgive me if I offend.

The Chemist wrote:

ginzo wrote:

AkCoyote wrote:"the greed and evil of George Bush and Tony Blair"

OK, I'll bite. Please explain to me how Bush an Blair have personally profited from the war in Iraq.

Sorry, but it seems you are just too ignorant for this discussion.

What are you sorry for, Ginz? Do you dispute the facts Coyote presents? Or do you think he's "ignorant" because he acknowledges them?

I realize that you and I don't agree on these matters, but civility is the goal to reach for. (Sometimes, I fall short--mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa). Forgive me if I offend.

I beg to differ, if you are suggesting I was anything but civil.

I don't think telling someone they are "just too ignorant for this discussion." wins you alot of points with the judges in a civilized debate competition.

Grayson_Stewart wrote:I don't think telling someone they are "just too ignorant for this discussion." wins you alot of points with the judges in a civilized debate competition.

I cannot help what you think. I will reinterate that pointing out someone's deficiency in the neccessary information for a particular discussion is far from uncivil.

If we were discussing the best places in Rome to eat Torpa Cheese, for example, I, never having been to Italy nor having tasted torpa would, in that case, be too ignorant for said discussion. In which case, I would not engage in it in the first place. But should I so engage, then anyone
would be right to call me on my ignorance.

The seeds of WW2 were sown when WW1 ended. The reparations demanded of Germany were as severe as could be. You can't do that to a nation and not reap the whirlwind. If there was no Hitler another would have taken it up, maybe not that year but it would have happened.
After WW2 the Marshall plan made sure the seeds for WW3 were not sown in Europe.
[An act of American generosity mostly ignored by those who are currently benefiting from it.]
It's pure speculation but had some form of Marshall Plan been implemented in 1918 it is possible there would have been no WW2.

I do agree with Geoff on most points, it's to our shame a handfull of armed thugs were allowed to run amok in Yugoslavia, a company or two sent in early could have prevented a great deal of human misery. The Ireland problem has been going on for years. Much as we love our US cousins, knowing that most of the IRA funding came from American donations to NORAID really did rankle. Post 9/11 the funding has dried up and now Gerry Adams wants peace, it's an ill wind...

I'm not having a pop at anyone, I believe all actions are perceived as being correct by those who make those actions. I hate politics because it ends up as a left/right thing. Sort of assumes one is right and the other wrong but no option for saying both are wrong or that both might just have a point.

I think a debate on the best places in Rome to eat Torpa Cheese is a more subjective matter of opinion based on the fact that you have been there.

Surely you don't dispute any of the well publicized events or dates that AK coyote listed. I think most all of us here are old enough to remember them.

Grayson_Stewart wrote:I think a debate on the best places in Rome to eat Torpa Cheese is a more subjective matter of opinion based on the fact that you have been there.

Surely you don't dispute any of the well publicized events or dates that AK coyote listed. I think most all of us here are old enough to remember them.

I am not disputing it. Did I say I was?

This thread was started with Geoff talking about personal life and death sacrifices, enduring the death of friends only to do what needed done no matter how shitty it got. He went through hell in his war, his "place to eat in Rome" and this is his "Torpa Cheese";

rkidtech wrote: My point is that if you stand by and do nothing, evil corrupt people will and do win out.
To name but a few like Stalin, Hitler, Pol-Pot, Gadaffi, Slobodan Milosevic, Saddam Hussein.
So at what point do we as a human being draw a line in the sand and say enough is enough these people must be stopped. (And who is going to stop them?????????)

ginzo wrote: I wholeheartedly agree that we should all stand up against evil and do away with it wherever it raises its ugly head.

In another thread;

ginzo wrote: You'll find that all wars are about business

Is it business or standing up against evil? I doubt Geoff served 12 years because of his leaders greed. Seems you don’t understand his Italy and haven’t tasted his Torpa of hell. One would think you would "not engage in the topic in the first place" and might say you’re showing a lack of knowledge "for said discussion". My guess is, your stirring the pot .

Ignorant: resulting from or showing lack of knowledge or intelligence

I've been called many things in my life but this is the first for ignorant. Back in the late 60s and early 70s I too was a 'hippie' and thought that if everyone would just stay stoned, we would have peace and love around the world. I bought into it all. Nuclear power bad. Solar good. Democracy bad. Socialism good. Right wing bad. Left wing good. And on and on and on.

And then something that I never expected happened. Damned if I didn't grow up! There were bills to pay and I really didn't like giving my tax dollars to those who wouldn't work. The left managed to get the Rancho Seco Nuclear power plant shut down and my utility bill doubled. Then Reagan came into office, cut taxes and revenues went up! Every time I turned around, the lies of the left were proven wrong while the policies of the right were successful. After earning 2 college degrees, I began to study history and political science and soon realized that not only is the U.S. the greatest country to ever exist, but that the left was intent on changing it into some type of utopia that existed only in their minds.

As I moved to the right, I suddenly became 'one of them.' My 'friends' on the left were tolerant as long as I thought as they did. Logic, reasoning and facts were irrelevant. It was blind obedience to the cause or else. Everything that I had believed was staring me in the face as an out and out lie.

The morale to this story is that I at least know why I think as I do. It's not because of a blind hatred for a particular president. Nor is it due to anger over losing an election. I think as I do because I'm the sum total of my life's experiences, my scholastic education and the ability to look at facts and arrive at a reasonable conclusion.

Am I so arrogant to believe that I'm always right? Hardly.But look at it this way; we currently have the choice to fight against terror or just sit back and let things happen as they may. As I illustrated in my last post, Islamic fanatics have been attacking us for 20 years before we even started fighting back. For me to believe that the attacks would stop if we would just bring our troops home is as naive as believing that some day evil will cease to exist.

AkCoyote

I thought Geof was talking about standing up to evil and so was I. I don't believe that surviving a battlefield gives one the right to be correct about everything regardless of what they actually know about. He made an ignorant statement and I called him on his ignotance. That's all. Stop making this into more than what it is.

In addition, I have no idea why you think a soldier would not be in the battlefield because of his leaders' greed. That very statement betrays your ignorance of history and war in general.

ginzo wrote:

AkCoyote wrote:"the greed and evil of George Bush and Tony Blair"

OK, I'll bite. Please explain to me how Bush an Blair have personally profited from the war in Iraq.

Sorry, but it seems you are just too ignorant for this discussion.

Ginzo,
I beleive you need to check your note cards. While you made an initial comment to Geoff, it was AKcoyote that you made the disparraging comment too.

theholymackerel wrote:Ginzo, most everyone here has been able to have their say with out callin' names. Except you. You have called AK coyote ignorant twice and rkidtech once.

Voice yer opinion, if you must, but be nice about it.



If ya can't make an argument without callin' names, consider silence: like in yer signature.

Pointing out ignorance is not "name calling". I am ignorant on a great many things. In which case, I might ask questions, hoping to learn more, or listen more, but I certainly don't pontificate on subjects I know little, if anything about.

Ginzo,
Technically being ignorant is not the same thing as stupid. I'll give you that much. But in the post where I saw the "ignorant" comment being made you directed it towards AKcoyote When he was only asking you to support your comments and opinions. I don't see where he has a lack of knowledge on a subject simply because he would like to hear your opinion or listen to the facts that you feel have caused you to form your opinions.

AKcoyote posed two questions to you asking for the factual documentation which you feel supports your opinions. AKcoyote then went on to list 26 events in history that have led to the formation of his opinion. This was countered with the "ignorant" comment.

Alienating another person through poor choice of words is not condusive to a free exchange of ideas.

AkCoyote wrote: Back in the late 60s and early 70s I too was a 'hippie' and thought that if everyone would just stay stoned, we would have peace and love around the world.
AkCoyote

Sorry I’ve been sampling and that was just too funny. I wish I was old enough to have been there with you. I mean no offence of course. Maybe its hype but that period of time MUST have given you experiences you always look back at and (I don’t know?) be proud or fond of. You could change the world with love.

What makes you the judge of what AK Coyote and Geoff know or don't know?

[/quote]


I am basing what they know - or don't know - on their posts here.

If we were discussing the best way to treat cancer and they said that cancer was the result of an evil spirit inhabiting the body then I would know that they don't know enough about cancer to discuss proper treatment.

That doesn't mean I am any wiser, or smarter or experienced in general, however.

Most of us here would treat someone the same way if they made statements about distilling that were obviously coming from someone who had never distilled in his life.

can i just point something out.

This conversation has become pointless n any conversation based around this will be the same.

The reason is that everyone has there own political beliefs and they will believe that they are right no matter what and that the other is full of lies n rumours..... This isnt to have a dig at anyone, this is just pointing out something iv come to learn.

The only answer is to count to 10 n ignore any post delving into politics.

ginzo wrote:I am basing what they know - or don't know - on their posts here.

Geoff has posted twice and AK three times (hardly enough to judge someone’s total knowledge or intelligence). AK asked you to clarify something you believe to be true and he was responded to with name calling. AK did say "Ill bite" suspecting maybe you’re a troll (my summation not his) but at least he asked you for more info instead of calling you anything.

ginzo wrote: I might ask questions, hoping to learn more, or listen more, but I certainly don't pontificate on subjects I know little, if anything about.

So it seems you do "pontificate". I don’t see where you’ve asked them any questions in an effort to clarify a point or at the very least to make sure they are saying what you think they are saying.

What I see as Geoff’s point behind the first post; At some point in time you must stop an evil force of man from taking over every day life, even if it means taking life(right or wrong?). I see him as saying fight to save the good in men and the freedom of men. I see you as saying revolution but, from what - to what? With the price of the last revolution we are better off to use the system in place to vote, run for office or the use of the press to inform (but I don’t see this as the forum to do it).

level Joe:
The funny thing about the 60s and 70s is, that time period of my life is pretty much a blurr. I think I had a really good time but I'm not sure how much really happened verses what was, shall I say, chemically induced


AkCoyote

i resemble that remark. i think. best i remember. what was it agin

You guys wnat to know how bad it can really be then have some fun and read history.

1. Start with The Conquest of Gaul by Julius Caeser..He killed tens of thousands the old way..

2. Fifteen Decisive Battles of the World by Creasy..IE..if Athens had not beaten Darius we may be speaking Arabic now <G>

3. Try The War with Hannibal by Livy..

4. The rise of the Roman Empire by Polybius(Good historian 200-188BC)

Get the Penquin Classics except for no 2.

The point is, democraacy may be have its problems but it sure as hell beats dieing and killing just to survive everyday. Where the weak die at the whim of the strong.

Hi AkCoyote,
We used to have a saying about the late 60’s and 70’s “If you could remember them you weren’t really there.” We were invincible then, with the attitude of it’ll never happen to me. (I’m still here so it didn’t) We used to say “Who in hell wants to live to be a 100 anyway”
I ‘ve thought a lot about that 100 year old remark since, cause’ I’m 53 now, and came up with the conclusion that. The man, who really passionately wants to live to be 100 years old is. Well just ask the horny 99 year old pensioner, all soaped up, soaking wet and balancing one footed on a bar of soap. In a marble shower who has just married a really horny Marilyn Monroe look-a-like and it’s his birthday tomorrow.
And she’s waiting on the water bed and wants to sing “Happy Birthday” to him
As I’ve said before live how you want to live, and more importantly don’t get caught. Treat others the way you would like them to treat you. Slide through the swampy waters of life(sharing a wee dram with others on the way) and don’t splash because that big alligator on the bank will notice you, and then the game is really up, and he’ll get ya. (and impound your gear and arrest ya’ and drink all your poteen/shine)

Geoff