barrels or glass

[copperhead]

Is there really a big diffrence in ageing in a barrel than say putting in a gal jar with charred wood in it. I'v got a couple of gals of sour mash that has been sitting on charred oak for only a month and it realy looks great flavor is starting to smooth out to. was just wondering if the diffrence is worth the price of investing in a barrel. i mean you can use a barrel maybe twice and the flavor is gone. Im thinking about odering a gibbs barrel next week. but is it realy worth it?

[Rocky_Creek]

My OPINION is that a large barrel is worth the investment, I use 15 gallon barrels. Small barrels bring the price per gallon to the moon. Also If you are going to get your money's worth be prepared to leave it in the barrel for a good long time. Multiple barrels recomended. You can't feed large barrels with a small still.

Others who look on this as more of a hobby don't care about cost. I am sure that most of the others on the board with barrels will have a different OPINION.

[copperhead]

thanks rocky creek 15 gal was the sizes i was going for I'll do my drinking from the jars. hopfuly i can leave the barrel for about three years. think im going to try filling two a year.let me know how your new rig works.

[lawnman]

with the barrels ive seen then at my local brew shop.
so you can use them over and over ,can you put a whiskey in to age and flavour and then next brew put your bourbon in there?
will the flavours clash?

[Uncle Remus]

From what I've read rum makers especially want used barrels. Most want used whiskey barrels, some put their rum in used sherry casks. Then after the rum makers have done their thing, the scotch makers take the barrels... probably after the scotch guys get through with it it becomes a flower planter.

[Rocky_Creek]

Each time you use a barrel the effect of the oak will lessen, each time will take a little longer. Best if it fits in to do whiskey once or twice then use it for rum. Something I will try down the road is oaking first and then put it in a well used barrel for aging ( oxygen effect).

[Longhairedcountryboy]

Could you re char them, or would it not be the same?

[Rocky_Creek]

They could be recharred, but that is a lot easier said than done for us amatures.

[Longhairedcountryboy]

I imagine it would be difficult to take one apart and put it back together without it leaking or anything. I hadn't thought of that.

[DBM]

Yes they are worth the investment, there is no comparison between a real barrel and glass with oak chips.
Don't get a barrel you can't handle, 5 gal of whiskey in an oak barrel is heavy, all I want to handle.
Gibbs barrels are the best. I try to add on a new barrel every year or two. I number my barrels, I drink from number one, whenever it gets a gallon or two down I refill it from Number two, then refill number two from number three, etc untill the last barrel which gets the white whiskey watered down to 130 proof.
I make my whiskey in the winter and keep it in five gal carboy's with cork stoppers. My whiskey is made via the sourmash, mashback method, using cracked corn. The cracked corn is cooked using the hot mash from the still in five gal water coolers.
Good Luck

[theholymackerel]

DBM said :

Yes they are worth the investment, there is no comparison between a real barrel and glass with oak chips.

Strange, I own several white oak barrels and can find no difference between product aged in a barrel or a jar with stick/chips/shavin's.

I'm not sayin' yer wrong, I just wanna know what makes it "no compairison" to you.

I used to like my barrels more, probably because I enjoyed doin' it the authentic way, but now I prefer the ease and ability to speed or slow agin' and color usin' chips and a jar.

DBM, please expound on yer statement.

Thanks.

[golden pond]

The barrels have their purpose and that is they are able to breath, the glass cannot do this. But you defeat the purpose of the barrel if it's kept in the wrong place, it needs to be in an outside building that gets the summer heat and winter cold. The barrel houses here in KY are usally built on high ground and well ventilated also. Some barrel houses here even rotate the barrels once a year so all can the hottest temp and also the coldest. The wood of the barrel expands in the hot summer heat and absorbs the alcohol and then releases it back in the cold winter months. Hell this even was on Kentucky TV this very morning about "Woodford Reserve" being barreled and aged. I go past some of the barrel houses in Davis county every now and then and they are well secured with high fences.

[golden pond]

On the other hand, I've done ok using wide mouth gallon glass jars, about 6 sticks of charred oak about one inch square and 6 inches long. I'll rotate these between the warmest place in the room and every so often I'll put them in the freezer overnite, that seems to help speed the process up somewhat. But I really do like my oak kegs and barrels that I keep in the barn loft.

[Longhairedcountryboy]

I read on another site that guys are using oak in glass and puting it in the fridge at night and leaving it out during the day to simulate season changes very quickly. They were calling it the oak freak-out. I haven't tried it, but it sounds like it would work.

[copperhead]

thanks guys for the in put right or wrong i'm going to try at least two barrels maybe about six months apart at least the jars will give me something to drink while i wait and something to experment with. right now i'm trying quart and gal jars with sour mash corn.going to try to barley rye corn for the first barrel sour mashing method. just hope i can make somethig worth the wait.the corn so far has been realy good.

[TRANSPLANTED HILLBILLY]

I dont remember who it was, but about a year ago somebody had gotten one of them 1000 oaks, or other non desirable, barrels that had wax or paint or both in it and had disassembled it and put it back together. He claimed it had gone back together ok but the whole process of apart, cleaning,and back together took him about 12 hours. I believe it was smaller than 5 gal.
Agreed a Royal PITA.

Glass can be left cracked open then closed and shaken to oxidize the likker. I leave them in my shed for the temp swing thang. Seems to work OK but my barrels add color faster. Suppose I could up the charred wood content, but it makes for a smooth drink thats not overly oakey.

But isnt the deep amber color of a freshly drained barreled likker a beautiful site.

[Rocky_Creek]

DBM I don't know if you live in an apartment or something, but those of us with property in the country don't worry aabout how much abarrel weighs. As long as you are set up to roll your barrel, tilting one way for a while then the other to keep the bung area wet, you have no problem. My barrels are several feet off the floor and are emptied with a stainless and chemical resistant syohon. The building is dedicated to that putpose plus holding the cooling reserve4 water and pump. No need to ever move anything.

[DBM]

Rocky_Creek;
I live way out in the country. Store my whiskey in oak barrels in an old log corn crib. If you ever have to move every thing, believe me you don't want any oak barrels larger than 5 gal.
Had a brother-in-law get involved in a nasty divorce case one time. They got to telling every thing they knew about each others family. I had to loadup every thing and move it. Then put a bunch of junk furniture in the corn crib. Sure enough in about two weeks a depity shirff come ask if he could look in my barn and corn cribs. I told him to go ahead and ask what he was looking for, he said, moonshine. I told him if he found any I sure would like to help him test it to make sure it was moonshine, that I hadn't had a good drink in several years. He went straight to the right corn crib, checked around then went to the other cribs then to the barn.
When he got through and came back to the house, I was sitting on the front porch. He said he was through looking, that the sherff had told him to come look and had told him to tell me that they wouldn't be back and that his family (the sherff's) looked forward for the fruit cake my wife gave his wife down at the church every christmas. That was the end of that, but I waited for a coupla months after the divorce was over before moving everything back. Used a different corn crib when i did move back. Used the time to build better racks for my barrels. Built me a bench so that a one gal jug fits perfect under the spigots (I have Gibbs to drill all my barrels for spigots and order the spigot from them when I order the charred barrel) and up close, this way I dont have to use a funnel when filling jugs. I also built my new racks so that the back is 1/2 in lower than the front, this way those little pieces of carbon settle toward the back. I can fill a gallon jug and it will be just as purdy and clean looking as store bought.
I saw in a catalog the other day where they had this tool for drilling a one inch hole in wood and then this tool for threading it, then another tool for puting threads on a 1" dowell. I think i'll get one then I can just un screw the dowell when I want to get some whiskey out or to put some in. Put an end to banging the bung out then banging it back in.
Hopes this lets you know what you wanted, My wife often accuses me of telling someone how to build a clock when all they wanted know was what time it is.

[Rocky_Creek]

Well the Sherrif's son ( a Detuty) hunts on my property and he ( the sherrif ) is also my brother in law's brother in law. Don't really know what would happen in a similar situation.

[level Joe]

I saw in a catalog the other day where they had this tool for drilling a one inch hole in wood and then this tool for threading it, then another tool for puting threads on a 1" dowell. I think i'll get one then I can just un screw the dowell when I want to get some whiskey out or to put some in. Put an end to banging the bung out then banging it back in.

Seems like that dowell would soak up the spirit and swell up tighter than a ducks ass. Maybe they have you soak the dowell befor you cut the threads? Cant say I would trust it to cut clean threads or seal if thats the case. Im just guessing but its a nice idea.

[golden pond]

I just drilled and tapped the end of my barrels for a 1/2" TPT, put a thin coat of "Gorilla Glue" towards the outside on a 1/2" PVC bushing and screwed it in,being a TPT, you probley could get by without the glue, a 1/2" ball valve next with a 90 degree elbow. Now I've got shine on tap. Screwed a 3/8" eye bolt in a popular bung so I can stick a screwdriver or other object through the eye, using a block on the other side, I can pry stright up and pull the bung to add more liquor. Built stands just tall enough to put a gallon jug under the elbows and I was set to go. If you didn't like or trust the PVC, you could use brass,copper or stainless steel fittings.

[DBM]

I was just going to screw in the wood screw far enough to seal good. My bungs fit so tight I have to loosen them to get the spigot to work. I plan to put the threaded hole in the bung, that way I could just unscrew it and the whiskey would flow out the spigot. Was not planing on it getting wet.

[junkyard dawg]

My biggest problem in using oak chips was finding good oak and how much to use. Fun to learn and do. I have a gibbs barrel, and am ordering another soon. It was exactly what I couldn't replicate any other way for the whiskey I'm trying to make. I'd love to have the time and equipment to fill 15 gallon barrels...