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Any thoughts on how/why liquor ages in glass or stainless steel. I wanted to make enough to fill a large barrel but until I have made enough(i.e. a few years) I will be storing it in glass or stainless steel kegs.

You did do a search first, right...??? It's been discussed several different topics already... Even just recently...

I looked through the first few pages......didnt see much of interest. Maybe I drank too much, kind of inhibits my "research before I post" instincts.

Alright I went through 18 of 67 pages(the search engine on the site is not very good....when using google to search within the site I get better results), didnt find anything of interest. I am curious if anyone knows or has links to....do certain compounds within the liquor breakdown(i.e. poor tasting compounds). I am not talking about aging with wood chips in glass/ss, simply letting it sit in glass/ss does it change the flavor profile? I know it is a very subjective concept but I am curious to hear differing opinions.

The quick and dirty is that you're not going to get much change in glass by itself unless you are airing it pretty regularly, and even then you're just smoothing it out a bit. True aging doesn't happen unless wood is involved. Some might disagree with me there, but that's pretty much the definition of aging. If you're doing a neutral, you can filter it through activated carbon to smooth it out. If you're doing a whiskey, you could filter it through oak charcoal or whatever wood you prefer. But if you're just putting in the glass and sealing it up, chances are you're not going to get much of a change unless you just cover the top with something that breathes and monitor your levels for evaporation frequently.

I have something called a "Spirit Aging Box" in my house. This is an oak-based box in which I place a glass jar containing my distillate. The lid of the jar is punctured with several one millimeter holes. Beside it I place an open bowl of aromatic substances, such as blooming heather (not floral, but quite planty), lavender, even fresh earth!

The spirit can be left in the box for a long time and will take the flavors on.

Brian from Shelter Point Distillery on Vancouver Island, Canada explained how a Scotch distillery placed identical casks containing an identical distillate in two separate places and found that tasters could literally identify elements reminiscent of the environment in blind taste testing.

This is one example of many different ones.

In Japan it is known that Shochu makers often allow distillate to sit in glass. They frequently choose caves which have a stable temperature of eleven degrees celcius (About 50 farenheit give or take) because normal alcohol evaporates much more slowly than lighter, more volatile and harsh alcohols in such an environment. The result is a distillate that is softer.

In Josef Pischl's book "Distilling Fruit Brandy", he comments that the Germans, Austrians and French all age distillates in glass with minimal oxygen exposure for as long as two years, with exceptions given to particularly sensitive distillates such as Raspberry or Strawberry. I have unfortunately learned this about fragrant distillates the hard way, having lost an otherwise good batch of kiwi brandy and being left with unpleasant tails as my only source of good flavor.

Interesting! Is the box heated? I would imagine that keeping it semi-warm in there would help with the flavor transfer, as well as smoothing out your spirits. I had an old box that I warmed from the outside with a space heater back when I first got started. I chucked it, however, out of fear of burning the house down. Now, with my increased woodworking skills I'm considering building something that would go nicely in our viking-style home and rig it with a ceramic heater on the inside and a thermostat. I would love to smooth out some of my white rums and get a little more warmth to my stuff aging on wood. It stays so cold and rainy here most of the year...

Neat! Where can I buy one of them magic Spirit Aging Boxes?

BG

You won't burn any houses down. Just make a box, a small box big enough to fit the jar containing the distillate inside of it. Put a bowl of nice fresh herbs right beside it and leave it away in a cupboard somewhere for a long time.

I collected miniature liqueur bottles for a short time, all of which were stored inside of a cabinet also containing antique tins which had old musty smelling medical chemicals in them.

Any bottle smelled or tried quite literally took the "taste" of the cupboard's aroma on. The Bols Jenever? Old cabinets. The Luxardo Kirsch? Old Cabinets. Even a rare mezcal... What a disaster. I now wax all my bottles, like my neighbour does...

Needless to say no special equipment is needed. Just any box will do, as long as it can be closed to prevent airflow that will let your distillate float away.

I wish I could patiently do one bottle at a time. But I am interested in aging all my oaked bottles at once. And as nice as it sounds, I'm not really interested in adding fragrances to my liquor just yet. Might try that in the future, though. And your references certainly give me something to look into! I love when people come at me with things I don't know about this art. I love doing something that can never be fully known, only continually learned.

MDH wrote:I have something called a "Spirit Aging Box" in my house. This is an oak-based box in which I place a glass jar containing my distillate. The lid of the jar is punctured with several one millimeter holes. Beside it I place an open bowl of aromatic substances, such as blooming heather (not floral, but quite planty), lavender, even fresh earth!

The spirit can be left in the box for a long time and will take the flavors on.

Brian from Shelter Point Distillery on Vancouver Island, Canada explained how a Scotch distillery placed identical casks containing an identical distillate in two separate places and found that tasters could literally identify elements reminiscent of the environment in blind taste testing.

This is one example of many different ones.

In Japan it is known that Shochu makers often allow distillate to sit in glass. They frequently choose caves which have a stable temperature of eleven degrees celcius (About 50 farenheit give or take) because normal alcohol evaporates much more slowly than lighter, more volatile and harsh alcohols in such an environment. The result is a distillate that is softer.

In Josef Pischl's book "Distilling Fruit Brandy", he comments that the Germans, Austrians and French all age distillates in glass with minimal oxygen exposure for as long as two years, with exceptions given to particularly sensitive distillates such as Raspberry or Strawberry. I have unfortunately learned this about fragrant distillates the hard way, having lost an otherwise good batch of kiwi brandy and being left with unpleasant tails as my only source of good flavor.

I love how RAD thinks I am retarded for even asking. If I hadn't asked I would never have gotten this reply. I think that sounds very interesting and worthy of a try. Do you have any alcohol loss when you do this?? And thank you for replying.

Rad responded the way he did because he's been on this forum for a very long time and he's seen this question asked since that time began. He's a very prominent, very respected member here, as are many others. You would do well to remember that and treat them with respect. You ask a question that has been asked a million times or come in with a lot of attitude, chances are you're going to get much worse than what Rad gave you. I've seen it.

I thank it makes a difference what its made from,,brandy has fruit so it mite bottle age more like wine.whiskey not so much.it will some but not as well as a barrel.its just the chemicals that's is in it.

Aint the first time and it aint the last.

Take it for whatever it is worth, it is easier to just not say anything than go out of your way to point out when you think someone is being stupid. If I stopped for every person I thought was a moron I wouldn't get anything done in a day. I meet about 400 people a day and I consider myself lucky if I have a meaningful conversation with 1%. My question was reasonable and no it was not answered. If it had been I wouldn't've asked it. I looked through posts back to 2011 and i didn't find an answer.

I am respectful as long as I am respected, not in the "having earned it" sense, but in the base human being sense. I respect the knowledge given but not the attitude for a simple question. The question that got a really nice answer with information I hadn't seen on this forum before. The disrespect in this instance didn't come from me.

Attacking newbies for "stupid" questions sometimes seems to be sport around. Rather than "did you even look?", how about "type stainless steel storage in the search field". Do you beat your kids until they learn? Or do you show them advantages/disadvantages. This forum is supposed to be a help to those seeking out information, some of those may or may not be good at searching(and it is a skill to find what you are looking for).

Dnderhead wrote:I thank it makes a difference what its made from,,brandy has fruit so it mite bottle age more like wine.whiskey not so much.it will some but not as well as a barrel.its just the chemicals that's is in it.

Do the "bad tasting" esters breakdown into things more palatable? I think of it like when your Tylenol hits its expiration date it becomes less potent as time goes on, does this same process happen with esters in general? I've seen Death's Door advertise mellows in stainless steel for a month and that is an integral part of the process.

My thought is to store it for a couple years then barrel it as I have have enough to do that.

The correct answer is a range of possibilities. For each person that offers the one and only correct answer, there will be dozens of alternative answers all valid. Rad was respectfully checking if you have done some searching. I don't see any dis-respect in his reply; it was concise and valid.

There is so much information here that many people find the search daunting and request a summary from those who have been around.
This thread is your summary.

I thought MDH was spinning a practical joke where all you need to do is place your glass jar inside an oak box...but no joke! He has given examples of how it works and I'm following with interest.

Ayay wrote:I thought MDH was spinning a practical joke where all you need to do is place your glass jar inside an oak box...but no joke! He has given examples of how it works and I'm following with interest.

I imagine it is the same thing as infusing but because it is not forced it takes more time. I am still curious whether or not liquor is lost.

rad14701 wrote:You did do a search first, right...??? It's been discussed several different topics already... Even just recently...

@onemarleyfan

Hmmm... I don't see anything there about calling anyone stupid in this post... Perhaps when you've been immersed in these forums and have done as much reading, research, had enough practical experience, and endured having the same questions asked over and over again, you'll get over your self-imposed beaten dog complex...

Enough research would have enlightened you to the fact that SS and glass have nothing to impart into the aging process other than to protect the spirits from outside contamination during storage... And research on aging would have enlightened you to how specific characteristics are extracted from different chars of different woods, whether the spirits are stored in a wooden barrel, or through the use of chips, cubes, spirals, etc, when stored in SS or glass...

But it appears that you want people to do the research for you and spoon feed the answers or links to you... And that is why I stated things the way I did, albeit very briefly... Go forth and learn rather than acting like a starving baby bird waiting for someone to regurgitate what they have had to work hard for down your throat... Teaching you how to learn is part of the battle in this hobby just as it is in most others... Suck it up, Buttercup, and move on...

Yes dear.

How is the weather up there?

I make decisions by discussing them with others and asking questions. Any question that can be asked has probably already been answered. I know that. I seek out the interaction and from the interaction I devise a plan and often dream up "new" ideas. If you don't like how I make decisions ignore me. Why go to the trouble? It makes no sense.

In forums like these if my questions hold no interest to the public at large they will quickly drop into obscurity. As is there were a few replies that had interesting ideas. I will ask questions until I am satisfied with the answers(I am pretty sure you are the same).

If you take issue with whether I have researched anything I assure you I have read a good many books obsessing over the minutae. Books only take you so far, discussion is what elicits quality outcomes. If you are able go ahead and look through the logs of which pages I have accessed you will find I have read through almost every page of every section on this forum. You surely know I have sought out random pages on local history of moonshining(that weren't that easy to find). I very much take research of my hobbies to a level of obsession that I am not sure even you could match. Again if you are able, research what I have done for Bob Marley collectors of the world(I have tracked down recordings of material that few even knew existed).

Desmond Dekker, Lee Perry, and the legionary Rico, are aged on oak.

Indeed!

Interesting responses. The box idea makes sense. Ever stored any food near bananas? Everything ends up tasting like bananas. So with the lid pierced with small holes do you lose much product or does the box seal well enough to reduce this? I know you said even sealed bottles will take on the flavor but you'd think it'd take a lot longer to achieve.

Also. Happy one year anniversary as a member MarleyFan.

if thats what you want,,
take gallon/4-5 l jar,,put 2 quarts/litters in it then suspend fruit/herbs above.
.

I would think you could drive SS screws into the wood with pre drilled holes and you would have a pretty good seal. Does cost too much to make that much rum, might be worth giving it a try. Are uuntreated oak boards readily available(I haven't researched that one yet).

Try a cabinet shop if you have one near you. I'm lucky enough to have a buddy that works at one. Only place I've been able to find white oak. He gets me untreated pieces that they weren't able to use for free.

It doesn't need to be oak. The box doesn't impart flavor. The herbs in the bowl do. The point is that the air in box is filled with that aroma and as alcohol evaporates, which it does slowly, it takes it on.

I would think you would avoid a more aromatic wood like Cedar.

I know this thread has slowed to a stop for the last couple of weeks, but I ordered some of these for aging my stuff, might wanna give it a try. This guy is good at what he does.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/200702272501?ss ... 1438.l2649" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow