Home Distiller

The devil's in the details . Like most other novices I hurried as slow as I could to get to the point of safe , drinkable distillations . Once my cherry was busted I slowed enough to start lookin I began trying to refine my act . I started rereading the site and out jumped 2 important details that I ha passed by in my haste to make product . Boiling chips and a heat shroud . They were part of my original plan and , somehow , got pushed to the back in my haste to get to stillin . That has been costly for me in propane energy wasted .
I have a 15.5 keg boiler , double tapered , mounted in a wheel rim burner mount over a 60k burner from a turkey fryer setup . Open top with flanged surfaces to attach the cap . Never put boiling chips in until today when I was boiling water to set up another batch of sweet feed ferment . That had been taking me 3+ hours to get a rolling boil on 15 gallon water charge . Today I covered the bottom of the keg with unused copper fittings , short lengths of tubing , and some rolled up balls of solid copper wire . That increased heat transfer to the water to the point that I had a rolling boil in 1hr 15 min for 15 gallons of water .
Watching heat waves wafting away from the boiler sides also convinced me that I need to fabricate a heat shroud outside the boiler to channel the wasted heat up along the sides . That will happen this week .
Hope this insight helps someone else save a few $ .

Progress at it's finest

you are doing well young grasshopper keep up the goodwork

do all the copper pieces bounce around and make a lot of noise when boiling?

TB, those are 2 very good tips to point out. The boiling chips always stuck out to me, so I've used them from the get-go. Your 0 to boil time is same as mine 1hr 15min. I've yet to build the shroud.

shroud will make a very big difference. Heat up times will improve (if getting 1:45, will likely drop to 1:20 or better). But a bigger improvement will be on the running. It will take a LOT less power to run, and I have found it is more stable. Drafts and other things like that (wind, cold) do not impact the boiler once the boiler is enclosed in a wall of heat. Your column, lyne arm will still feel the drafts, but the boiler can stay rock solid on course.

I am pretty surprised you got that much speed up in to-boil time that you did with the chips. I have seen a 'little', but the biggest diff is in avoidance of puking, especially if boiling a molasses wash, or distilling on the grain (or with some grain solids, like dust still in the wort). Those seem to always want to boil over, but the chips help keep a much more even boil.

Now it could be that due to you having one of those 'egg' shaped kegs, it behaves differently than what I am used to. I have a skirt on all my kegs, so there is a 'little' natural shrouding already. It may be that having that skirting has already done what you are seeing with the addition of the chips, as far as improved thermal xfer.

H.

I use a 15.5 gal keg heated with LPG on a wheel burner as well. How do you create a heat shield with a set up like this?

straight walled steel trash can worked fine. Other options would be to fabricate something by hand out of a roll of flashing and some very heavy gaged wire for legs, support. With the home made design, you could even add 2 layers of metal, and some thermal foam between them, to create a very efficient, and also safer from burning you setup.

I found a can like this, that was beat to hell, and paid a dollar for it at a yard sale. It had holes in the bottom, and was pretty much rusted out. However, I cut most of that out (cut a 7" hole in the bottom), and a door in the 'was' top side for O2 flow, then put it upside down over my keg/burner, with column or lyne arm out top. The shroud does get hot, so you have to be careful, but no more careful than touching the hot keg was prior to the shroud. With that can over, working outside, even in colder weather or windy conditions is not a problem. Also, the amount of propane used is significantly less, because I can run with a much smaller flame.
Note, the can did smoke a little, the first time I used it. Not sure if it was some oil in the thing, or something about the galvanize layer burning some. I was outside, and could 'tell'. I do not know how bad it would have been inside, on that first run.

H.

That's one reason why i opted for a heating element instead of propane. The element is inside my boiler. No wasted heat, at all! I did however, wrap my boiler in insulation.

8 gallon boiler, 4500 watt element, = full rolling boil in 32 minutes.

I would imagine a 15 gallon boiler with a 4500 watt element would be at a full rolling boil in under 1 hour.

+1

I am so happy I switched to electric. Mulekicker's controller, a 5500W element and a 240V plug and I was good to go. No propane fumes, the room stays cool, quiet, fuel doesn't run out, no open flame around your flammable liquor, and you can be so specific (3A for pot still runs, 8A for reflux).

I agree with mazz and jeep. Although I have never even tried running with propane, I would have to say that electric is more efficient, safer, and less hassle. Just plug it in and go, no running out of fuel, no having to go to the store to get a refill, therefore no wasting gas for the car. Much safer, because you don't have an open flame around flammable liquid, and no co2 fumes to worry about so you can run indoors. Heck, I set up and run in my kitchen.

I would also have to say that you can control electric much easier than propane.

Heat shield is easy. Go to homedepot and get a roll of 24" alumn roof flashing (10 feet), and a cheap poprivet tool, some med alum rivets. Just wrap it around your keg, measure a 1" or so overlap, and mark it. Cut it with shears, tape down the seam flat with duct tape. Then drill the holes and start putting rivets in. It's easier to drill it if it's flat. Clamp a 2x4 or something on a work table so it hangs off far enough to work with. Put your taped up shield cylinder on it and rotate it so the seam side is up. This will give you a flat leverage surface to drill into.

A cheap way to make a stand//base for the shield is to use long bolts/nuts...so they stick out at the level you want the bottom of the shield to be. You can drill holes, put the bolts through, tighten to shroud with a nut, then let the bolt stick out to act as a base for the shroud.

Viola
Now, you can also lower this all the way to ground by cutting a notch for the air/valve assembly. If you need to make it taller, buy 2 rolls of flashing and poprivet them together horiz. I used this both ways (ie., at the level of just below the flame/burner, and all the way on the ground surrounding the burner with a cutout). With it all the way around on the ground...depending upon how close it is to the keg...it will kick up an incredible amount of heat (ie., it was heating the bottom of my column and all the way up to my product condenser). The alumn shield stays cooler...but the keg gets HOT. So, you might have to experiment within the 1-3" range (away from keg) depending upon how much heat you use, and how low it is on the burner. If you are running with it at flame level or slightly below...1 to 1.5" should be good. If you are running it off the ground...completely covering the burner with a cutout....best go 2-3" away...or it will just put too much heat straight up into your rig. The alumn flashing is rather flimsy...but works well in this particular application. It's pliable and easy to construct. It's also cheap.

Thanks for the large number of responses . I 'll try to answer a few and offer a very large CAUTION!!! .
CAUTION !!! FIRST : Galvanized metal is not your friend in a heated environment . I used to blacksmith . Belonged to a popular website for that hobby . Everyone revered one particular mentor for his skill and willingness to share his skills with us . For whatever reason he decided to burn galvanize off some pipes in his forge for a project he was starting . Sent his employees out of his shop while he did this . The results were a drawn out disaster that he chronicled online as he was dying from the fumes he breathed that day . It was weeks watching this good man die as he walked us along with him on his last trail .
NO GALVANIZE IN A HEATED ENVIRONMENT FOR A HEAT SHIELD , PLEASE !
Sorry to shout . I get very passionate about that subject .............
Rager : heard and saw no bounce from the copper . Just saw lots more bubbles coming off the copper as it transferred heat as opposed to the bare keg bottom .
dallen : What I'm going to do is place my wheel on the welding table and weld on angle iron supports around the edge of the bottom rim . 1"x1" should give me enough stand off for the shroud of mild steel or aluminium
that I have to fit around a drain pipe and a fill pipe . Whole burner deal is mounted on the factory tripod and sits on a 2 layer brick hearth to get a comfortable working height .
I don't disparage those of you who have chosen to go electric . Seems to be working well for you . I'm not a trusting man and do believe SHTF is coming . My design lends itself well to being plastered into a throne of rock and clay and being warmed by the embers of a wood fire if that is the last resort to stay pleasantly buzzed while the world goes to hell

I was going to post about galvanized and heat as well. Glad TB beat me to it as his warning is much more thought through than mine would have been.
I just use fiberglass insulation held on with 2x4 chicken wire on my boiler and the fiberglass hangs down a couple of inches past the boiler to channel the heat around the boiler.
Works great for me!

Truckinbutch wrote: My design lends itself well to being plastered into a throne of rock and clay and being warmed by the embers of a wood fire if that is the last resort to stay pleasantly buzzed while the world goes to hell

TB you are a poet!

Richard7 wrote:

Truckinbutch wrote: My design lends itself well to being plastered into a throne of rock and clay and being warmed by the embers of a wood fire if that is the last resort to stay pleasantly buzzed while the world goes to hell

TB you are a poet!

Thank you . Let's hope it is poetry and not prophesy . The times , they are a'changin ..............

hellbilly007 wrote:TB, those are 2 very good tips to point out. The boiling chips always stuck out to me, so I've used them from the get-go. Your 0 to boil time is same as mine 1hr 15min. I've yet to build the shroud.

I've been using boiling chips in bottom heated vessels in Science Labs since I was 15 , I'm now 43.I still use them at work daily for determining sugar levels in completed ferments or bottled wine ( Rebelein method , in case interested) and in my still for the same reason - they give an even boil without excessive surging. The chips provide a nucleation site for dissolved gases to become bubbles and without, the boil is more uneven. They're called boiling chips because they assist with the boil, not speed it up.

Your boiler looks like a big cob of corn Richard!

googe wrote:Your boiler looks like a big cob of corn Richard!

Damnit Googe! Since you posted that, I can't walk past my boiler without laughing and thinking big ole corn cob!

What better way is there to brew corn likker... than in a big ole corn cob...

Richard7 wrote:

googe wrote:Your boiler looks like a big cob of corn Richard!

Damnit Googe! Since you posted that, I can't walk past my boiler without laughing and thinking big ole corn cob!

So now I'm cranky as a stepped on baby . Married ole 'Calvin' up to a brand new thumper and gave him a new suit of 1/8" steel to keep him warm . He survived the cleaning runs and performed admirably for 3 stripping runs . Addition of the heat shroud along with the boiling chips kept start up time to 1hr 40 min with a 12 gallon boiler charge and 3 gal in the thumper . I'm too crippled to dance to that thumper music but I sure bobbed my head and clapped Had a small leak or two that a dab or flour paste took care of . Life is good . Did the last strip run this morning .
Charged up to go for the gold this evening . 5 gal of low wines , 7 gal of fresh wash in the boiler and 4 in the thumper .
Just got to rolling good . Took off a quart of fores and started collecting in half pints (16 of 'em) and went to full pints . And then the leaks started and I started pastin and c clampin and got ahead of them enough to , maybie, finish the run .
And then the propane tank froze up cause it's cold in the still house and I just gave up for the day .
Tommorow I will break everything down and fix my construction failures and figure a way to defrost the propane tank . Then I'll pour everything back in the boiler and start over

A fermenter heat belt on the propane tank won't hurt it. Hotter belts are used on HIGHLY pressurized nitrous oxide tanks to keep output even. Used batt powered versions on my CO2 tanks playing paintball as a kid

Thanks for the advice . I'm thinking about suspending the tank in the cooling water barrel as the first attempted fix .

I started a thread ages ago about that on aud truckin, half submerge the tank in the cooling water, or wrap the cooling water hose around the tank. Try giving it a shake when it starts freezing too. Good luck.

Truckinbutch wrote:Thanks for the advice . I'm thinking about suspending the tank in the cooling water barrel as the first attempted fix .

googe wrote:I started a thread ages ago about that on aud truckin, half submerge the tank in the cooling water, or wrap the cooling water hose around the tank. Try giving it a shake when it starts freezing too. Good luck.

I have not had this problem yet, but if I do I have some good solutions thanks to you all.

I have a propane splitter, it hooks up two tanks and you can switch between them by flipping a valve. I brew beer outside in the winter (Chicago) and a single tank will definitely freeze. I just flip to the other one when one starts to ice up. You can tell from the drop in pressure as it gets colder. The drawback of immersing the tank in water is that as it empties, it will float and you risk having it flip over and possibly getting liquid propane out instead of gas. The plus side is that it is cheap of course.

I too thought a warning about galvanized metal was in order. Zinc poisoning is very real and very possible. Be careful.

I used a blanket of kaowool. Its a liner for forges and it insulates very well. I cut a piece big enough to wrap around the keg from the top handle to a few inches below the bottom. It attaches with a couple of spring clamp. It cuts the propane use way down...

I've also run cooling water over propane tanks to keep them from freezing. It worked great...

Thanks all , for the replies . Got 8 or 9 plastic 55 gal barrels stashed here and there on the farm . Hunted one out and cut 14" off the bottom and plunked the propane tank into it and tethered it to a leg of the operator's table and put the water to it . Wouldn't you know that I picked a barrel that had a small hole in it Found out that I could weld plastic with my electric soldering gun . Rollin good now .
Want to hear the 'Whisky Gods' laughin ? Just get complacent for a moment