a few firsts experiences.

New to distillation, or simply new to the HD forums.
** Your first post MUST go here. Introduce yourself and tell us a bit about your interest in distilling. Any posts asking distilling questions will be deleted. **

Moderator: Site Moderator

User avatar
smoCha
Novice
Posts: 60
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2015 4:24 pm

a few firsts experiences.

Post by smoCha »

2015-02-22 20.07.20.png
Well, here it is.............
First attempt at what appears to be a wonderful addition to my list of eccentric hobbies. A few buddies grabbed some local fame for some good beer brewing and not to be outdone I created this beast. I will admit I've been lurking around the site for a few months now, reading a lot of the newbie topics and writing down recipes. I'm new to distilling but not to Internet forums so i wanted to answer on my own some of the easy ones. On that topic, thanks to the mods/creators/contributors for what seems like a really well put together forum.

On to the good stuff. My first run was a pre-made 5 gal batch of apple wine that the beer maker i mentioned above donated to the cause. Into jelly jars poured the oddest apple paint thinner I have ever seen. At first, but it actually leveled out after a pint or so and made a really nice apple pie. I cut it off 1 jar after it stopped burning and yielded roughly 4 pints, 8 after adding the juice and such.

so now that I was an expert it was time to make something great! (go ahead and laugh). partner in crime and I headed to tractor supply and bought some nice livestock rations. 10# cracked corn, 50# of sweet feed. Did our first mash with all the corn, 7# of malted barley and bread yeast. He was appalled. After soiling his beautiful 25 gal mash tun with chicken food I went one step further and poured "roughly four inches" of fine fine horse dinner into a five gallon water bottle. Huge fucking mistake, I'll tell you why later. We tossed in a bit of malted barley for good measure. Both were done fermenting in about a 5-6 days. The corn mix was just that....corn. kept enough to make 6-7 pints at around 80 proof.

On to my new love, sweet feed..after what seemed like two pretty decent runs I was set back a bit with my third creation. First of all I had to get the 25# of oatmeal I had made out of the narrow necked bottle I decided to use. Then, I had to extract from this barnyard mush something I might be able to put in the pot. My elbows still hurt from the 3 hours of wrapping and wringing this funky mush in a cotton cloth. I also owe my wife a new pillow case. Roughly 21/2 gallons turned out some weird molasses whiskey with a total sum of 2 jelly jars. Here's where things got crazy. In a bit of a stupor, not brought on by my creation entirely, I decided charcoal aging would be a great idea. I opened the door to my wood stove, stumbled dangerously close with the tongs and plucked out an inch square chunk of maple wood I cut this summer and tossed it in the drink. Capped it up real quick cuz if I'm gonna ruin it, at least it will be fun to watch. A week later an viola, great tasting creation. Although it was a rather crude process my interest was peaked. And I only had two jelly jars of final product and that would hardly earn me bragging rights on the next camping trip.

So let's make some rum. Melted 21 lbs of brown sugar, two pounds of honey and passed out on the couch waiting for it to cool. It's 14 degrees in Ohio. At 3 am I awoke from my slumber and waddled the turkey fryer pot full of simple syrup into the kitchen. I'll just stop here because this is a sad story.

Most successful effort so far. I went back to the farm food, but put it in cheese cloth bags this time. Why isn't that attached to every dam sweet feed recipe on the planet? I bet I read 100 of them. I used some malted barley and threw in 5-6# of sugar, just for good measure. Two ale pales full of sweetness rotted six days exactly, still using the bread yeast, BTW. I've also learned a bit more about heads and tails at this point, so I've started keeping a lot less. .75 gal to be exact. Oh, and I dropped a charcoal stuffed mess of cheese cloth in the column. I left the top cap loose for this purpose. This one is really good! Cut it off around 60 and when mixed ended up with around 90. I plan on buying some barrel staves for this batch, the dirty charcoal treatment was just an experiment. But I think I'm on to something here, so I really want to press onward with my horse food concoction.

I'll keep you all posted, as I'm sure this is gonna be a long ride. I do have a few opening ?? for the experts.
1. Is the yield I'm getting in the ballpark? I feel like making 8-9 gallons of beer should get me more than 3 pints of output. Maybe not, I don't know the equation yet but I could do the math if you point me in the right direction.
2. Does starting abv determine output? The above reverenced apple wine was 12-14% start, I have no idea what the horsey juice was, but more of the apple seemed drinkable on a percentage basis. Maybe a function of question #1?
3. Any body else a sweet feed pro? Or is it bottom of the barrel, po' boy, ghetto shit. I think there's alot of potential here. Don't get me wrong, I don't assume to that I'm going turn turn winners choice show food in makers mark, but what you like is what you like right?
4. What do you think of the first build? Im $200 in. I run 3 gallons a min through the cooling jacket, in finish runs in 3-4 hours.

I look foward to your comments, and appreciate any advice. Ive got a few more pics to come, but i have to resize them all to get them over here. Thanks again for all your help.
CONFIDENCE-the feeling you get right before you realize the severity of your situation
User avatar
Halfbaked
retired
Posts: 3400
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2013 5:51 pm

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by Halfbaked »

Welcome Smocha. Wow, what a read. 200 bux not bad at all. Are you measuring SG or FG? It is a good idea. 10 gal of 10% gives you 1 gal of 100% abv theoretical alcohol of 2 gal of 50% (100 proof) alcohol. Measuring these gives you an idea when your mash is done and what you should expect. That does not take into account taking out fores heads and tales being taking out. A rough estimate is keep rate of 60%. My recomendation is read this link. It is long but worth the read. http://ww.homedistiller.org/forum/viewt ... 15&t=52975" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow The recipe in tried that you pick will guide you through the entire process and most likey give you what you should expect SG and FG and most likey what to expect.
User avatar
HDNB
Site Mod
Posts: 7427
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 10:04 am
Location: the f-f-fu frozen north

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by HDNB »

no expert here, but heres some opinion for ya

http://homedistiller.org/calcs" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" rel="nofollow will give you some expectations

1. try following a recipe in tried and true you'll have better success.
2.no
3. lotsa guys like sweetfeed, they say it needs to age for a while to come into it's own.
4.I'm surprised that if you have been reading that long, that you are not familiar with your design, and it's critiques. not to be discouraging, and i'm not writing anything new.... the workmanship and pride of ownership is there...but you already know it's not the most efficient design, and the thru-tubes don't really do anything spectacular. other than that, i like it (not that my opinion matters anyway.) I'd cut the thru-tubes off and turn the condensor 90* and hook the water up again. and run it like a potstill.

good job making your own rig, i do like the workmanship.

welcome to the forum, hope you have some fun here.
I finally quit drinking for good.

now i drink for evil.
User avatar
Bigbob
Master of Distillation
Posts: 3128
Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 2:57 pm
Location: SE Oklahoma

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by Bigbob »

SmoCha wow, quite the intro. Well your home now so take off the jacket,sit down and get to reading! Start at novice and read crankys post called a little spoon feeding for new distillers. It's long but it will answer most if not all your questions.as to your questions:
1 yes your yield is a little low, but that could be low ABV
2 read the post I suggested
3 sweet feed is very popular, it makes good drop done right. Again read,read,read.
4 sorry I'm not a builder, so I'll let somebody else chime in

it looks like you've made a fair amount of mistakes that can be traced to being new and not knowing. Now your home,now you can learn. Enjoy the forums! :wave:

Edited and posted same time
If you wear underwear then it's a dress!
http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 15&t=62150 How I run a small still
User avatar
smoCha
Novice
Posts: 60
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2015 4:24 pm

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by smoCha »

Half baked, thanks man. I'm not measuring sg or fg but I know I need to start. Tools are on the way. And wow, that's simple math I should have figured that out on my own. Anyway, I appreciate your help

HD thanks as well..I love the Itemized answers.
1. I thought people would recognize the " 4" of sweetfeed" quote. I found that recipe on 20 different sites.
2.i didn't think so, but wanted to be sure.
3. Agreed, so far. My years of experience..............lol
4. This was the most "build-able" design for the money. I'm an honest man but not a rich one. Also, if useless in principle, they do make the entire unit rather rigid. As such I can move it all easily, and if anyone ever saw it I could throw it over my shoulder, blow into the output tube and tell them I want to join the band.
- it seemed like more reflux/purity/abv occurred with the charcoal packing. I'm thinking about packing all three feet of the column with copper scrubbers.
-90*? That's how I sleep.
-thanks for the compliment. Building it was almost as much fun as running it.
CONFIDENCE-the feeling you get right before you realize the severity of your situation
User avatar
smoCha
Novice
Posts: 60
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2015 4:24 pm

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by smoCha »

Thanks big Bob. I'll read that post again. And again.
CONFIDENCE-the feeling you get right before you realize the severity of your situation
User avatar
T-Pee
Master of Distillation
Posts: 4355
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 9:20 pm
Location: The wilds of rural California

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by T-Pee »

What cleaning runs did you do on the still BEFORE you started drinking the product?

tp
User avatar
smoCha
Novice
Posts: 60
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2015 4:24 pm

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by smoCha »

Cleaned every single piece with salt water and vinegar. Then ran a vinegar/tomato paste/ water run just to test it because I knew the boiling points were wildly different. Water soluble flux , lead free solder, stainless pot, cork gasket. I did read that much, but thanks for checking. I ran 100% water after that , and wash and dry it after every run.
CONFIDENCE-the feeling you get right before you realize the severity of your situation
User avatar
T-Pee
Master of Distillation
Posts: 4355
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 9:20 pm
Location: The wilds of rural California

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by T-Pee »

How about a "sacrificial" alcohol run? http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 63&t=15489

tp
User avatar
smoCha
Novice
Posts: 60
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2015 4:24 pm

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by smoCha »

At 5 runs in, I think that's been covered. Am I missing something.
CONFIDENCE-the feeling you get right before you realize the severity of your situation
User avatar
T-Pee
Master of Distillation
Posts: 4355
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 9:20 pm
Location: The wilds of rural California

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by T-Pee »

We have had folk get violently sick drinking product from the very first alcohol run. If you avoided it, you're lucky. It's full of all the crap that the vinegar and steam runs missed...and there is plenty of it.

Steam run gets loose stuff. Vinegar run is acid and strips the copper down. Sacrificial run gets the remaining manufacturing oils (it's hot solvent after all) and everything that the two earlier runs missed and gets the protective layer of patina started.

tp
User avatar
smoCha
Novice
Posts: 60
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2015 4:24 pm

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by smoCha »

I was pretty paranoid about cleaning. Guess it served me well. Thanks for your concern.
CONFIDENCE-the feeling you get right before you realize the severity of your situation
User avatar
W Pappy
Distiller
Posts: 1140
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:11 pm
Location: A relocated Georgia boy

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by W Pappy »

So with the reading you have done here you can say after you built this rig .
1.You did not steam run it.
2.Did not do a vinegar water run.
3.Did not do a sac run and pitch it, instead you and your friend
have drank it and possibly gave it to others.Am I correct so far?
Buy the ticket and ride the lightnin boys !!!
Impatience is the root of all bad things in my book of makin likker!
The sound of a thumper is the heart beat of the rebel" Warden Pappy"
User avatar
dstaines
Swill Maker
Posts: 448
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2013 7:46 am
Location: The Left Coast

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by dstaines »

smoCha wrote:Cleaned every single piece with salt water and vinegar. Then ran a vinegar/tomato paste/ water run just to test it because I knew the boiling points were wildly different. Water soluble flux , lead free solder, stainless pot, cork gasket. I did read that much, but thanks for checking. I ran 100% water after that , and wash and dry it after every run.
Sounds like you ran it with water and vinegar, but didn't steam out the condenser (full heat, no cooling water), and skipped the mandatory sac run. Sorry to say it Smocha but if you have any of that apple brandy left its got to be tossed...
I buy all my liquor at the hardware store.
User avatar
T-Pee
Master of Distillation
Posts: 4355
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 9:20 pm
Location: The wilds of rural California

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by T-Pee »

Yep. Aka "poison shit". :thumbdown:

tp
User avatar
HDNB
Site Mod
Posts: 7427
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 10:04 am
Location: the f-f-fu frozen north

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by HDNB »

hang on, i must have fallen asleep during the intial read. did you say you packed the column with a rag full of charcoal????

where the hell did you get that idea? is the idea there to provide additional fuel for the fire after the pressure bomb goes off???

i gotta tell you... and i don't do this often....slow down and read some before you seriously injure, maim or kill someone. and fer chrissakes, don't drink the first booze outta that thing, it will be full of flux. thats not alcohol burning your mouth. it's oatey #5. think projetile vomiting and and drain cleaner. you know which drain i mean right??
I finally quit drinking for good.

now i drink for evil.
User avatar
W Pappy
Distiller
Posts: 1140
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:11 pm
Location: A relocated Georgia boy

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by W Pappy »

Here is the thing I dont believe he did any of these cleaning runs I bet it was soaking and or wiping the parts.
Holly balls he did say he stuffed a wad of cheese clothe and charcoal in that!!! I wander did ya use" match lite
or some cheep brand" damn son. :thumbdown:
Buy the ticket and ride the lightnin boys !!!
Impatience is the root of all bad things in my book of makin likker!
The sound of a thumper is the heart beat of the rebel" Warden Pappy"
User avatar
smoCha
Novice
Posts: 60
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2015 4:24 pm

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by smoCha »

W Pappy wrote:So with the reading you have done here you can say after you built this rig .
1.You did not steam run it.
2.Did not do a vinegar water run.
3.Did not do a sac run and pitch it, instead you and your friend
have drank it and possibly gave it to others.Am I correct so far?
1 did steam it, alot.
2.did do a vinegar/water run.over 5 gallons
3. Have not given any of it away and pitched the apple as all have suggested.
HDNB wrote:hang on, i must have fallen asleep during the intial read. did you say you packed the column with a rag full of charcoal????

where the hell did you get that idea? is the idea there to provide additional fuel for the fire after the pressure bomb goes off???

i gotta tell you... and i don't do this often....slow down and read some before you seriously injure, maim or kill someone. and fer chrissakes, don't drink the first booze outta that thing, it will be full of flux. thats not alcohol burning your mouth. it's oatey #5. think projetile vomiting and and drain cleaner. you know which drain i mean right??
not so much a pack , more like a loose wind sock. Total of 3, approx 1" chunks. Is this any different than a copper scrubber? I dont see how lump charcoal could ignite if placed in the vapor path, my intention was to get a bit more reflux and improve taste at the same time. And no, before anyone asks, it was not kingsford match light. I know better than to create a cannon, i already have one of those that will launch potatoes into the stratosphere.
I do appreciate the that you all seem to be very detail oriented individuals, so am i. Ive taken notes on every run,Weighed/measured ingredients, had several succesful runs and glossed over alot of the intricacies in my inital post. Dont mistake my nonchalant manner of speaking for ignorance, i have absolutely no desire to poison my self or my friends. In fact, at this piont ive probably discarded twice as much as ive saved.

Of course i have i have alot more questions than answers at this point. So ill keep digging around.
CONFIDENCE-the feeling you get right before you realize the severity of your situation
User avatar
smoCha
Novice
Posts: 60
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2015 4:24 pm

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by smoCha »

W Pappy wrote:Here is the thing I dont believe he did any of these cleaning runs I bet it was soaking and or wiping the parts.
Holly balls he did say he stuffed a wad of cheese clothe and charcoal in that!!! I wander did ya use" match lite
or some cheep brand" damn son. :thumbdown:
Constructive critisism is greatly appreciated, calling me a liar is not.
CONFIDENCE-the feeling you get right before you realize the severity of your situation
User avatar
MichiganCornhusker
retired
Posts: 4528
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2014 9:24 am

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by MichiganCornhusker »

Hey, smoCha, how you enjoying your full body cavity search? These are a good bunch a guys once you get to know them, and they you.
Everything you need to know is right here. This forum is the best place on the net for reliable info. You seem to be in full adventure mode, this site will help you travel safely.
Good luck, enjoy the journey. :thumbup:
Shouting and shooting, I can't let them catch me...
User avatar
smoCha
Novice
Posts: 60
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2015 4:24 pm

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by smoCha »

MichiganCornhusker wrote:Hey, smoCha, how you enjoying your full body cavity search? These are a good bunch a guys once you get to know them, and they you.
Everything you need to know is right here. This forum is the best place on the net for reliable info. You seem to be in full adventure mode, this site will help you travel safely.
Good luck, enjoy the journey. :thumbup:
yeah, hands on the car and spread em' , boy. Lol
CONFIDENCE-the feeling you get right before you realize the severity of your situation
User avatar
GrassHopper
Distiller
Posts: 1389
Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2015 6:35 pm
Location: Idaho

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by GrassHopper »

Welcome smoCha,
No worries.....they will shake ya down, but hey, they really do know their stuff. They just forget that they were rookies once as well. You are definitely in the right place. So much to learn and so little time. A lotta good advice here, especially the Tried & True Recipes. They didn't seem all that appealing to me at first, but I followed the advice and tried anyway. They really do work.... very well.
Great intro. Enjoy the ride.
User avatar
W Pappy
Distiller
Posts: 1140
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:11 pm
Location: A relocated Georgia boy

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by W Pappy »

OK OK OK as long as you did all those cleaning runs first and foremost and didn't drink your first run you and your friend just may live lol.
Really tho what kind of charcoal did you use this is a serious question is it the kind you cook with or not?
Buy the ticket and ride the lightnin boys !!!
Impatience is the root of all bad things in my book of makin likker!
The sound of a thumper is the heart beat of the rebel" Warden Pappy"
User avatar
HDNB
Site Mod
Posts: 7427
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 10:04 am
Location: the f-f-fu frozen north

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by HDNB »

k.

i've plugged up a funnel with cheesecloth, straining char out of aged likker.

saying you put "charcoal in cheescloth" in a column, i imagined (saw, read?) activated charcoal little bits in a cheescloth....which could plug a column solid.

boom.

even "3 chunks" with cloth around them could plug up.

boom.

the cloth is more what i saw as a "plug" the coal, well thats just something for it to dam up against.

if you were lucky, it would just be a potato launcher. there is plenty of video out there of of less lucky, where high abv vapour and liquid goes from bad to worse.

activated charcoal (at least at the appleton's tour) is used to filter a semi finished product. and at that bourbon place that tries to filter poor ferments and bad cuts through "12 feet of maple wood charcoal" to acheive drinkable beverage.

after it's distilled

they do not pack the friggin column with it.
I finally quit drinking for good.

now i drink for evil.
User avatar
Bigbob
Master of Distillation
Posts: 3128
Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 2:57 pm
Location: SE Oklahoma

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by Bigbob »

GrassHopper wrote:Welcome smoCha,
No worries.....they will shake ya down, but hey, they really do know their stuff. They just forget that they were rookies once as well. You are definitely in the right place. So much to learn and so little time. A lotta good advice here, especially the Tried & True Recipes. They didn't seem all that appealing to me at first, but I followed the advice and tried anyway. They really do work.... very well.
Great intro. Enjoy the ride.
We don't forget that we where rookies..... That's why we are so strict about safety.
If you wear underwear then it's a dress!
http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... 15&t=62150 How I run a small still
User avatar
W Pappy
Distiller
Posts: 1140
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:11 pm
Location: A relocated Georgia boy

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by W Pappy »

Oh yea I remember making my first batch, here is the thing I made damn sure I read everything for newbies.And I read all the other new guys getting there asses chewed
before I made anything.I figure what better place to learn how not to do something but hang out with other new people and watch and learn from their as chewins.
If your gonna pack the column you should use ceramic rings copper scrubbers SS scrubbers volcano rock some use marbles some use cut pieces of copper pipe.
But never charcoal and never packed in cheese cloth the only reason to pack the column is for reflux.
Last edited by W Pappy on Mon Feb 23, 2015 10:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Buy the ticket and ride the lightnin boys !!!
Impatience is the root of all bad things in my book of makin likker!
The sound of a thumper is the heart beat of the rebel" Warden Pappy"
User avatar
T-Pee
Master of Distillation
Posts: 4355
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 9:20 pm
Location: The wilds of rural California

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by T-Pee »

Hell, I'm still a rookie. Just ask Jimbo or woodshed. They'd be happy to put in their Image.

tp
User avatar
W Pappy
Distiller
Posts: 1140
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2014 11:11 pm
Location: A relocated Georgia boy

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by W Pappy »

T-Pee wrote:Hell, I'm still a rookie. Just ask Jimbo or woodshed. They'd be happy to put in their Image.

tp
Yep I wish I knew 1/8 of what you fellas know tp and that ain't no lie.But using common sense in this hobby will go a long way tho the rest will come with time.
Buy the ticket and ride the lightnin boys !!!
Impatience is the root of all bad things in my book of makin likker!
The sound of a thumper is the heart beat of the rebel" Warden Pappy"
User avatar
HDNB
Site Mod
Posts: 7427
Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2014 10:04 am
Location: the f-f-fu frozen north

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by HDNB »

here is an idea for you if you want to filter through coal while distilling:

make a surge breaker at your product take off (like you were going to fill a parrot) then pack a tube for of coal to drip though.
or drip your product take off into a cheescloth package of coal in a funnel.
I'd still keep a close eye on both though, because i have plugged a funnel just like that... straining charred wood out. i was pouring faster than what would have come out of a still though.
I finally quit drinking for good.

now i drink for evil.
Intimnasc
Novice
Posts: 57
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2015 5:00 am

Re: a few firsts experiences.

Post by Intimnasc »

I love ya man you sound like my kinda druntard. I am soo looking forward to finishing mine and posting it up here.
If a Frog had wings
Would he bump his A__
Post Reply