Muscadines

[whistlewetter]

There is a guy here at work who sells these. He will start selling them in August. Anybody have any experience making a mash from these? Know a good recipe? I want to try but I will have to buy these so I dont want to mess it up lol. I found this doing a google search but it is not very detailed. I assume I wouldn't want to use bread yeast? Also, I have become fond of using crushed oyster shells, could I add them to this?

[whistlewetter]

I did find this....http://homedistiller.org/forum/viewtopi ... s#p7113087

"All my fruit recipes use 6lb fruit,, 2 lb sugar, and 3 qts water all per gallon proposed wine."

So, it is my understanding that the above makes 1 gallon of liquid to be distilled. Therefore to make a 5 gallon batch I need to x5 the ingredients?

That means a 5 gallon batch would consist of 30lbs of muscadines, 15 quarts of water and 10lbs of sugar. I would probably put the muscadines into a kiddie pool, put some clean rubber boots on my two boys and let them have fun stomping away. I would pitch a wine yeast and leave it until its dry?

I would probably do 3, 5 gallon buckets worth. Dang, that would be a lot of muscadines!

[ga flatwoods]

Correct as written. Use less or even no sugar if you like. Round here 15 gallons grapes bought by the gallon @$8 ea would be $120! See if you can buy them cheaper maybe you can pick them. I did say do not use baker's yeast. Do not crack the seeds either. The device I detailed will cost less than $10 and an hour to put together and is the best way I found for cheap.
Ga Flatwoods

[whistlewetter]

Correct as written. Use less or even no sugar if you like. Round here 15 gallons grapes bought by the gallon @$8 ea would be $120! See if you can buy them cheaper maybe you can pick them. I did say do not use baker's yeast. Do not crack the seeds either. The device I detailed will cost less than $10 and an hour to put together and is the best way I found for cheap.
Ga Flatwoods

Any chance you could post a pic of the device. I am having a hard time picturing what it looks like. I have never claimed to be the sharpest tool in the shed lol.

[ga flatwoods]

[whistlewetter]

Thank you sir!

[Lazarus Long]

There is a lot of flavor in the skins and I like to leave them in the ferment, but be careful and leave yourself plenty of headroom in your ferment...the hulls trap the off gassing and tend to push up in a large cap that must be pushed back down. It can really make a mess. Good luck with the scupps, I have 11 different scupp varieties in our orchard.

[muscashine]

There is a guy here at work who sells these. He will start selling them in August. Anybody have any experience making a mash from these? Know a good recipe? I want to try but I will have to buy these so I dont want to mess it up lol. I found this doing a google search but it is not very detailed. I assume I wouldn't want to use bread yeast? Also, I have become fond of using crushed oyster shells, could I add them to this?

I know this is an old post but have you had success? I know a guy that makes muscadine wine, and its as good as some of the store bought stuff. His recipe is:
1 gallon ziplock bag of grapes (don't know the weight, just the gallon bag)
3/4 gallon of water
2.5 pounds sugar.
Peptic enzyme.
Yeast nutrient.

Stir it all together, wait overnight, then pitch yeast. He likes the K1V-1116 which I've also become fond of. From what I understand it kills off other yeasts and takes over. Not sure where I read that (maybe here?)

He ferments in a bucket, and after it calms down, puts in a carboy and lets clear for months.

I have 4 gallons of small muscadines I picked earlier this year from a friend's vines, and 7 gallons of big ones from my own vines, all bagged in my chest freezer. I'd love to hear from other muscadine users and successful runs. Muscadines are wonderful grapes and have a delicious odor and color. They are good as wine and even the most amateur muscadine jelly makes ANYTHING in the store taste like pure crap.
I'm going to try muscadine brandy sooner or later...

[ga flatwoods]

Muscashine
That recipe is a little sugar heavy but is similiar to all the "old timey" recipes I have ever seen and almost identical to mine. I too use pectic enzyme when available to me. Yeast nutrient may or may not be needed. I like to use Montrachet or Premier Cuvee, even wild before bread yeast which carries over hard in the wine. When Odin and family visited this summer I had samples of aged wine and Muscadine brandy. They preferred the brandy! Seems I also add some citric acid to most batches. Make a small dehuller like shown above and it will be absolutely worth the time to construct. Use a barrel to ferment in without worry of overflow or having to use a water trap-just hand snug the lid, or sit it on depending on type. NEVER NEVER grind the whole grape and risk crushing the seed. If so, the tannin will overtake the wine and cannot be reversed. After the initial batch, reintroduce sugar and make a second batch that will yield a rose colored wine.
Brandy enthusiasts, and some winos, will claim that the addition of sugar is sacrilegious and will not yield brandy. To each his own. It may take years of trying to get a combination and method you like. Record everything even the variety of grape. Always make sucrose if using sugar. Otherwise, be consistent and constant down the path.
Ga Flatwoods

[muscashine]

Muscashine
That recipe is a little sugar heavy but is similiar to all the "old timey" recipes I have ever seen and almost identical to mine. I too use pectic enzyme when available to me. Yeast nutrient may or may not be needed. I like to use Montrachet or Premier Cuvee, even wild before bread yeast which carries over hard in the wine. When Odin and family visited this summer I had samples of aged wine and Muscadine brandy.
Brandy enthusiasts, and some winos, will claim that the addition of sugar is sacrilegious and will not yield brandy. To each his own. It may take years of trying to get a combination and method you like. Record everything even the variety of grape. Always make sucrose if using sugar. Otherwise, be consistent and constant down the path.
Ga Flatwoods

Thanks Flatwoods. I put them on today, figured why the heck not? I've got almost 7 gallons in the bucket at 10% potential. Used D47, pectic enzyme and yeast nutrient (was told by the wine store guy that it's good for all sorts of fruits) this time, 50/50 combination of black grapes (magnolia I think) and bronze ones, which are for muscadine wine but not sure the exact variety. Went lighter on the sugar than the recipe, just enough to get the mix up to 10% potential alcohol. I do want to set just a bit aside for wine, and anything less than 10% supposedly will not keep well. Hands and kitchen smell awesome, like the grapes. I definitely need something to crush the grapes, I usually squash them by hand, takes about 30 minutes to do five gallons.

[muscashine]

Just an update -
Batch 1: Fermented on the skins four days (it TOOK OFF and fermented like crazy), took the spent grapes out and put in another bucket. Left me with about 5 gallons of wine fermenting slowly so I racked into Carboy and added an airlock.
Batch 2 from grape skins: Added a new sugar and water mix to the spent grapes/skins for a total of 12% potential alcohol. Seeds mostly floated to the top after a good stir. This is almost completely a sugar wash with a slight grape color and smell (like a rose' wine).

Batch 1 and 2: Over new years Day, racked Batch 1 and 2 off spent grunge in the bottom of the carboy/bucket. Kept them separate. Batch 1 slowed down a lot, and is turning a nice deeper red. Batch 2 still at 3% potential alcohol.

I wish I could bottle batch 2 right now. It has the wine taste with a REALLY sweet note from the remaining sugar, like an alcoholic soft drink. I guess I could heat it to around 140 and kill the yeast, then chill it until the particles clear out. But I've never tried that before. Next time I do wine I might try it.

Batch 1 plans: I will take 6 bottles of liquid for actual wine from batch 1. The rest will go into the still for making brandy.
Batch 2 plans: All of batch 2, once fermented and cleared a bit, will go into the still in it's entirety. It's way too much added sugar-water to be considered wine or a proper brandy, but hopefully will give me SOME grape notes in the final product.

[ga flatwoods]

I wish I could bottle batch 2 right now. It has the wine taste with a REALLY sweet note from the remaining sugar, like an alcoholic soft drink. I guess I could heat it to around 140 and kill the yeast, then chill it until the particles clear out. But I've never tried that before.

that is what potassium sorbate is for. Just a pinch of these small white dots will forever put an end to any yeast activity. It is used to ensure that no fermentation happens in the bottle to cause cork popping. Make sure it is what you sre ready to do because once added, it cannot be negated.

As far as the second batch not to be considered wine is bs. Many folks prefer the second to the first. It will not hurt to leave it on the hull for a week to week and a half for color and flavor. In this batch you will press the hulls to extract all the color and residual juices to be had. One sachet of Knox gelatin will aide in clearing. Be careful when adding as it will react like adding sugar if the ferment is still active and will try to boil over if the carboy is too full.

Ga Flatwoods

[muscashine]

that is what potassium sorbate is for. Just a pinch of these small white dots will forever put an end to any yeast activity. It is used to ensure that no fermentation happens in the bottle to cause cork popping. Make sure it is what you sre ready to do because once added, it cannot be negated.

As far as the second batch not to be considered wine is bs. Many folks prefer the second to the first. It will not hurt to leave it on the hull for a week to week and a half for color and flavor. In this batch you will press the hulls to extract all the color and residual juices to be had. One sachet of Knox gelatin will aide in clearing. Be careful when adding as it will react like adding sugar if the ferment is still active and will try to boil over if the carboy is too full.

Ahhhhhhh.... I didn't have much luck with sorbate last time, and I see why. I still had active yeast going after the sugar. I just read "the fine print" and it seems you have to let the yeast finish their job, let the wine completely clear, rack them off, then add the sorbate. You can't "stop" the yeast that are already alive with sorbate, which is what I thought... oops. It just prevents them reproducing.

I read about another way to do it with heat earlier, that looks better to me. No chemicals, just heat the bottles to 160 degrees and bring them down, then sweeten. I will say that even at this point, "batch 2" tastes pretty damn good. It still has about .5% potential alcohol left in it. Racked into the carboy since I have a free one, now. and there's already a darker, clearer section at about the top 1/2" showing where its starting to settle a bit.

[IanD]

I read about another way to do it with heat earlier, that looks better to me. No chemicals, just heat the bottles to 160 degrees and bring them down, then sweeten.

Sweeten and seal while they are still hot. If you let them cool down you run the risk of introducing wild yeast which will start to ferment again. Lay them on their side while they cool so that the cap or cork is pastuerised too. This is important. Exploding bottles are dangerous,

[muscashine]

I read about another way to do it with heat earlier, that looks better to me. No chemicals, just heat the bottles to 160 degrees and bring them down, then sweeten.

Sweeten and seal while they are still hot. If you let them cool down you run the risk of introducing wild yeast which will start to ferment again. Lay them on their side while they cool so that the cap or cork is pastuerised too. This is important. Exploding bottles are dangerous,

Thanks for that hint! Exploding bottles are also messy. I made the mistake of trying to make an apple wine before. I thought it was cleared and done, and bottled too quickly. After a while a gunky stuff built up in the bottles. I pulled the cork on one and it made a nice pop and fizzed a little in the bottle. (I believe I said "oh crap") nd the rest went down the sink.

[muscashine]

Just wanted to update this. Yesterday I had enough time to myself to run my still. I took five bottles out and bottled some of batch 1. I racked the rest into my still. I racked most of batch two into the still, but I'm still a bit shy about filling it over half full or so. I think I had about 7- 8 gallons into my 13 gallon boiler.
Turned it on 3/4 power and let it start to warm up while I assembled the column and got new Teflon on the joints of my Liebig and cooling hose. Then I turned it on full and waited. The cap finally got warm and I turned on the cooling water. Finally got a few drops output and cut back to 13 amps. Before long a nice stream was running and I cut back to 11 amps.
Got 1.5 gallons low wines out of it before I cut the still off. I could see the oils or something as I was letting it run into the sample tube and decided to switch off.
The low wines have a nice smell and test out to 110 proof. Stored them in jars until I can run them off.

[raketemensch]

It'd be interesting to see how those tails would taste when run with something else.

Definitely let us know how it ages out, it sounds delicious.

I had a bottle of banana wine explode, it's not fun.

[muscashine]

It'd be interesting to see how those tails would taste when run with something else.

Definitely let us know how it ages out, it sounds delicious.

I had a bottle of banana wine explode, it's not fun.

I put some oak cubes in one jar and stuck it in the attic to leave alone. Another jar I just put in the attic so it would experience the same heat/cold cycle.
The oaked one definitely tastes better. Smoother, more aromatic, calmer. The plain jar has a mean bite to it. It's "sharp" definitely not smooth.

[biggybigz]

If your looking something for a comparison, when you accomplish your muscadine heaven in a bottle, Rock Town Distillery in Little Rock AR makes muscadine shine. It is the bombshizzle. Good luck!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[muscashine]

If your looking something for a comparison, when you accomplish your muscadine heaven in a bottle, Rock Town Distillery in Little Rock AR makes muscadine shine. It is the bombshizzle. Good luck!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So far I'm still struggling (No pun intended - "STILL struggling") with the muscadines. My biggest problem I think is diluting the flavors by running it twice. I'm going to treat it a bit gently next time - Ferment for a week on the skins, NO added sugar. Then run the darn things through the still once really slow. Hopefully that gives me a bit more of a grapey profile without that sugar bite and having to run twice.
I've let some vines take root, and as soon as I can get another set of trellises up, I should have plenty of grapes. Right now I'm still borrowing from friends at the end of the season.

[muscashine]

Okay this is old but here are the results:
Six months ago I ran the grapes through the still. The parts I kept, I put in quart jars with toasted oak cubes in the attic in mason jars at 120 proof. I let them sit for five months on the oak, smelling every now and then. I removed the oak and diluted to 80 proof, and put the liquor in jars in the cabinet. I found these great quart glass jars at Hobby lobby. If you've seen the "Tim Smith" Moonshine jars in the stores, they look exactly like that, with a cork top. Classic "moonshine jug" shape without the little handle.
The MuscaShine tastes warm and oaky. Pale brown color, easy to sip. Still a little bite to it, but its mellowing. Not much of the original grape profile came through, but it's a decent drinkin' liquor - and no corn flavor. I'm not big on corn flavor in my booze.

I just put a new batch of grapes to ferment (actually they are still frozen from last year, they're thawing in the bucket as I type). I have 25 gallons of grapes in my freezer, from this and last year's harvest. Based on everyone's recommendations and other Fruit articles I have read, I've made up a "to do" list.
1. Ferment Muscadines with as little added sugar as possible. I'm not sure of their Brix, as I don't have a meter, but I'd like to get them to around 8 or 9% potential alcohol. A little low for wine, but it should run off okay.
2. Yeast - D47 with pectic enzyme and nutrient.
3. Run through the pot still slow, once. I'm looking for as much flavor carryover as possible. I don't have a thumper, just a boiler and my liebig (or my worm - I can't decide which I like better).
4. Age, age, age. Don't even think about touching it for 6 months. I might keep some of the tails separate and age them too - see what flavors come off later. I'm still learning about cuts and mixing, and I think I'm too eager to toss out stuff, or to dump in all in the jar and hold onto it.