Home Distiller

Howdy folks.

I have been searching the net today for a supplier of "cracked corn" for my first UJSM brew.

I found the product below on a website and wondered if A. anyone has come accross it B. anyone can think of a reason it couldn't be used.

They have told me, whilst it is sold as stockfeed, it has nothing added to it but has been treated as described.

It almost sounds like it has been malted for want of a better word.

I'd be interested in you opinions.

Cheers.

Micronizing

Grains and seeds have always played an important part in balanced nutrition. However in the raw state, cereals and legume grains may contain an inaccessible, and therefore indigestible starch structure and occasionally some anti-nutritional factors.

Infrared micronizing is a highly reliable and consistent "short time high temperature" cooking process that increases the digestibility of most grains.

One of the reasons for the improvement in digestible energy is related to the physical nature of the starch granules. To "open up" the nutrients, the starch is gelatinised.

Micronization uses humidity, temperature and mechanical pressure to achieve high levels of starch gelatinisation and reduces the potential presence of anti-nutritional factors.

The process has advantages over other dry heat or extrusion techniques. Micronizing enables rapid, even internal heating without excessive vapour loss. Infra red energy is used to make the starch matrix swell, fracture and gelatinise rapidly without excessive protein degradation or over-cooking.

This gelatinisation is very important nutritionally as it allows the horses digestive system easier access to the otherwise locked in nutrients. The increased availability of starches as simple sugars improves the energy available to the horse.

The heating process greatly enhances the palatability of the product.

"Horses love the roasted flavour!"

Why does your horse need micronized grains?

Enhanced digestibility and increased nutritional value.
Starches are broken down and absorbed mainly in the small intestine as simple sugars.
Less starch passes to the large intestine and caecum. There is less fermentation of starches in the hindgut, leading to a reduction of lactic acid uptake and lowering the incidence of acidosis and laminitis.
Less antagonism of normal hindgut fermentation of fibre, hence less colic.
Extremely palatable flavours, particularly useful when fed as part of a coarse feed mix.

Haven't heard of the process, but if it breaks the starch into simple sugars it should work. Probably way more expensive than cracked corn (AKA: Cracked maise).
Depending on how much starch has been converted, you will need to adjust the sugar content accordingly.
I recently did a batch with only .5 pound of malt barley added, it converted enough of the corn that I ended up with some off flavors from stressed yeast.

It sure sounds to me like this corn is merely gelatinized. It would be the same as flaked corn: using high temperature rollers and steam to cook the grain. Like instant oats vs. raw oats, or quick grits vs. instant. Except in this case, the corn is not reduced to grits. Or is it?

gitchegumee wrote:It sure sounds to me like this corn is merely gelatinized. It would be the same as flaked corn: using high temperature rollers and steam to cook the grain. Like instant oats vs. raw oats, or quick grits vs. instant. Except in this case, the corn is not reduced to grits. Or is it?

I think Gitches got it, but it'd make a fine basis for a ujsm i reckon.


Is there a farmers Co-op or a big horse food place near ya?

Just ask for cracked corn, usually sold by the twenty kilo bag in Aus

I'd say try it. As long as it hasn't been treated with preservatives, go ahead. Try to make the same thing with regular, untreated corn and compare 'em. If you like one, use it. If you can't tell the difference, use the one that is cheaper/more accessible.

One thing to note though, is that you probably couldn't use this stuff to germinate for malt. Of course, if mechanical pressure means "crushed", then you wouldn't be able to use it anyway.

Thanks guys, you have been most helpful as usual.

I have been trying to find clean cracked corn/maize but have been struggling to find a product that doesn't have a heap of chaff/leaf product left in it.

I will keep searching but if I have no luck I might try this stuff. I was planning on making my first brew an UJSM so it may be fine.

Cheers

Scott

I just use cracked feed corn ,the chaff, sticks will float to the top just skim off besides that foreign mater gives the mash "character"

Dnderhead wrote:I just use cracked feed corn ,the chaff, sticks will float to the top just skim off besides that foreign mater gives the mash "character"

Same here, any dried sticks, chaff, dried grasshoppers or rat shit just float to the top and get skimmed off.






You'reOnlyCollectingTheSteamPunkin

Iv even ate that stuff by the bowl full just wash it cook it ,goes good with brown sugar/molasses and milk and the distillers grain goes good in corn bread/biscuits (very high in protein) what I dont eat makes the chickens happy (yes I'm an old hillbilly from way back)

If you were making a UJSM would you guys put the grotty cracked corn into a bucket, fill with water, remove debris from top, then drain and add to UJSM brew?

Or would this remove some of the good stuff as well?

If using a "Brewers Bag" with the corn in it would this solve the issue off the floaties (bit worried about the rat nuggets but!!??)

Cheers.

Just chuck it in mate, i made it up about the rat turds.











ButInTheEndIt'sAllSteamPunkin

Aussie Beamophile wrote:If you were making a UJSM would you guys put the grotty cracked corn into a bucket, fill with water, remove debris from top, then drain and add to UJSM brew?

Or would this remove some of the good stuff as well?

If using a "Brewers Bag" with the corn in it would this solve the issue off the floaties (bit worried about the rat nuggets but!!??)

Cheers.

Just get a sieve and take off any of the floaters

Thanks guys.

Only Thing I can get around here is a cracked corn with soy oil. I just heat some water to about 150*F, dump my corn in, stir and skim the gunk off the top. Then I drain it through a sieve and rinse with hot tap water before I add the backset/sugar mix and water.

Wow!

Corn is so oily to start with that addin' soy oil (which has a STRONG flavour) sounds like a nightmare. I wouldn't expect good results.

I get plenty of floating debris as well. If you let the corn sit in water for a day or two that stuff should sink which I've always taken as a sign that lactic souring is happening. I don't usually even remove it from my mashes. Dried corn cob is very light and I doubt it affects the mash enough to be concerned.

Just an update for those interested.

I found a bag of this product at a stockfeed place today and got some more info.

It has no preservatives or anything else added.

It looks like someone has hit a wet corn kernel with a hammer. Somewhere between a cornflake and a whole kernel. It's a bit hard to describe but the pieces are about the size of a cornflake but still have large parts of the original kernel intact. It appears to be being held together with the dried milky coloured starch component of the corn.

I'm going to try it by starting a new UJSM with backset from my current UJSM and see how it goes.

For those in Australia that might want to try it out, it's a Wesfeeds product called Microsweet.

I'll keep y'all posted.

Cheers

Scott

Is it dry mate?

Stock feed i assume?

punkin wrote:Is it dry mate?

Stock feed i assume?

Yes to both Punkin.

And not overly expensive at $25.00 for 20kg.

I like the part in the first post where the manufacturer describes it as having a roasted flavor (or words to that effect).

Sound like it could impart some nice flavors into a UJSM.

Just another update if anyone is interested.



I bought a bag of this this morning as my 1st generation of UJSM has fermented out and will be distilled on the weekend.

Sorry about the photo quality but I only had my phone at the time and had to use the camera on that. (but you'll get the idea)

It worked out the same price as whole corn and actually cheaper than cracked maize at $25 for 25kg.

Cheers,

Scott

Looks like its just been cooked and rolled if you ask me...

Its expensive too... I'm paying bout $10.50 for 22kg of cracked... and thats somewhat expensive for round here.

dixiedrifter wrote:Looks like its just been cooked and rolled if you ask me...

Its expensive too... I'm paying bout $10.50 for 22kg of cracked... and thats somewhat expensive for round here.

Hi DD

The best deal I can get here is about a dollar a kilo for whole corn and a $1.30 for cracked maize.

In the original post you will see how the manufacturer has processed this corn.

The reason for the post was to find out from you more experienced folk if A. it would be suitable for a UJSM and B. if it would cut down the cook time when I progress to cooked mashes in the future.

Any thoughts would be appreciated guys.

Looks excellent to me.

I reckon it'd even go through my barley mill ok.

Price doesn't seem too far off for aussie prices, although i can get a 40 kilo bag of cracked for that, your bag will last a very long time for ujsm.

looks awesome to me to save a whole lot of time gelatinising it. bring it up to temp chuck in some malt. Now someone needs to micronize rye oats and wheat..

I used micronized maise a while back, since that was what I could find ad the local feed shop here in viking-land. It is sold as high-starch horse feed and is completely without any other additives, at least here.

After one false start I found the secret to using it was to cook the rice for an hour or more at just below boiling. The maise corn is cracked and heat treated first, and just need to steep in hot water to fully gelatinize. Then I added malt when the porridge dropped to the appropriate temperature. When I made sure the maise corn was fuly gelatinized I got great yields from this process. And a wonderful maise smell.

I have 25l of 52% whisky aging and oaking right now. Scheduled to be finished for christmas.

rubelstrudel wrote: ↑Tue Apr 02, 2019 1:25 am I used micronized maise a while back, since that was what I could find ad the local feed shop here in viking-land. It is sold as high-starch horse feed and is completely without any other additives, at least here.

After one false start I found the secret to using it was to cook the rice for an hour or more at just below boiling. The maise corn is cracked and heat treated first, and just need to steep in hot water to fully gelatinize. Then I added malt when the porridge dropped to the appropriate temperature. When I made sure the maise corn was fuly gelatinized I got great yields from this process. And a wonderful maise smell.

I have 25l of 52% whisky aging and oaking right now. Scheduled to be finished for christmas.

Hey bud I'm trying out micronised on ujsm and did a all grain whiskey wash with it as well how's it tasting and any pointers ? I found once I heated to around 90c it almost gelatinized instantly but was not gelatinized out of the bag

Take your time. Let the maize soak for several hours at 90C, preferably over night. That will give you perfect gelatinization. Now, keeping a temperature in a big batch can be difficult, but gelatinization does occur by simply waiting and the exact temperature really isn't all that important. Throw a duvet over your cooker and leave over night without power, that will do just as fine.

ryanme123 wrote: ↑Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:23 pm

rubelstrudel wrote: ↑Tue Apr 02, 2019 1:25 am I used micronized maise a while back, since that was what I could find ad the local feed shop here in viking-land. It is sold as high-starch horse feed and is completely without any other additives, at least here.

After one false start I found the secret to using it was to cook the rice for an hour or more at just below boiling. The maise corn is cracked and heat treated first, and just need to steep in hot water to fully gelatinize. Then I added malt when the porridge dropped to the appropriate temperature. When I made sure the maise corn was fuly gelatinized I got great yields from this process. And a wonderful maise smell.

I have 25l of 52% whisky aging and oaking right now. Scheduled to be finished for christmas.

Hey bud I'm trying out micronised on ujsm and did a all grain whiskey wash with it as well how's it tasting and any pointers ? I found once I heated to around 90c it almost gelatinized instantly but was not gelatinized out of the bag

With corn just adding it to 90° water and having it gelatinize is a huge effort saving; wouldn't be disappointed in that. If it were more gelatinized, you'd be buying it in a bucket lol

Regarding UJ, micronized is really NOT what you want to be using. The intent with UJ is to pull the corn flavor, but not any starches, so having the corn gelatinize is working against you when you try to draw off the wash. More likely to get sludge in your boiler, and you're not gaining anything since there are no enzymes present to break the starches into sugars.

Suggestion: mash the corn with enzymes and any other grain you want for your recipe and ferment/run. And then, use the spent grain with sugar aka a gumball (include the backset if you want to go with something similar to the UJ route).