My idea for a contained safe(ish) pot boiler- needs critique

[moony]

I am new to the distilling art and after a good few months if not years of knowledge eating from various websites, youtube and word of mouth think it's time to make my own still and feel i can put this design together.

If i have missed something critical or could make any part work better please feel free to shove me in the correct direction, i also need a few pointers as to which clips to use for the lid and what diameter i need the top copper pipe to be.

Excuse my crappy worm coil drawing but you get the drift how many coils will i need and how long of a roll of copper should i buy? im thinking 5m should be ok but unsure.

One of the main reasons i want this design is water aint cheap round my way so for now i will be using re-usable frozen water bottles for the coil cooling tank unless someone has a plan for a way to recycle any water i use in the cooling aspect.

The design is set as such on the diagram for ease of use for my needs because i have limited storage and work space plus the design needs to use the boiler with the electric element underneath the boil area for safety reasons, the boiler i have found should work well and very safe (see images), i don't want a reflux system just yet due to height space but the header can be changed out once i get better at distilling.

The total height from the bottom of the boiler to the top of the header pipe will roughly be 1m/1.2m with a 40/60cm copper header.

The lid has a built in screw function which will help clamping it to the boiler but i am thinking of using some extra clips and food grade sealant along the underside outer edge then left to set before using the lid on the boiler so that it's removable not fixed permanently (not keen on messing with flour paste if i don't have to) any pointers on this area would be awesome.

The worm coil will be 10mm diameter on the inner bore hole (mainly because it's cheap and available here but if i should use wider diameter please let me know).

I will be mainly making vodkas using my set up and using pure sugar washes (any yeast pointers please for this would be great)

Think thats all i have to say for now but may edit this later to add bits and bobs ... so on with the picture show.

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This is my initial design

These are images of the boiler i intend to use - Thoughts on this please would be appreciated such as will it explode if used etc...

pic 1

pic 2

pic 3

[moony]

After a bit more reading and thought i came to the conclusion a safer, cleaner and more pro idea for the lid to boiler seal would be a silicone gasket such as the one below ,anyone else using or used this item or think it would be good to use? the price is minimal $5 or so on ebay

gasket

s-l500.jpg (7.41 KiB) Viewed 1999 times

[Fiddleford]

"Rules We Live By 8. These forums take a very strong negative view on the use of plastics and synthetics in distilling. It simply is not safe to use these during any part of the distillation process. HPDE buckets are acceptable for fermentation. There simply are too many types of plastics and a lack of reliable information for us to reliably advocate their use anywhere in the distillation apparatus. Also, from past posting history, this topic seems to quickly boil down into an almost religious flame war. Thus we simply will not put up with it, and posts about any form of plastic use will be edited, deleted or locked. There is a forum for proven info for or against any material (material/safety.)"

Safe(ish) isn't what we go for here. The only seal's you should use is flour paste, Teflon and silver solder. Flour paste isn't a bad thing to work with, its only messy if you use to much water, it should be a smooth dough like constancy and you can leave it for days so long as you do another run every other day.

[moony]

When i put safe(ish) i was referring to the none use of a naked flame to boil the mash/wash with but know other things can go wrong ,the (ish) part thats the novice in me typing.

I will have a search for teflon posts now thanks for the pointer, i always assumed (my bad) that silicone is food safe seeing as you can use silicone in baking but i do realise the strength of the product may rot anything away so i am interested to see how teflon is any different to silicone with it being a plastic based product ... off to google search i go.

Thanks for the heads up fiddleford, can i also ask what you think of the boiler itself good or bad?
I chose it for ease of use, ease of cleaning, none naked flame use, heating element and temp gauge built in, availability and it costs the same as a used empty beer keg in my area .

[Fiddleford]

That boiler you have in mind doesn't seem up to code a stockpot is probably cheaper and you can use it to cook up some good stews to , you may also want to rethink cooling.. if water is scarce there are other cooling methods such as air or maybe you need to find a stream and fill a few 5 gallon pales for recyclable cooling water, on my 5 gallon rig I can take off 2 litres before changing out the water for the worm which is in a 5 gallon bucket, just gotta run it really slow on the spirit run and most of the hot water stays on the topside

[still_stirrin]

...can i also ask what you think of the boiler itself good or bad?
I chose it for ease of use, ease of cleaning, none naked flame use, heating element and temp gauge built in, availability and it costs the same as a used empty beer keg in my area .

So, one big problem with those tea urns is that the spigot is also plastic. And even if you teflon wrap the top seal with plumbers tape, the spigot has a rubber seal that can’t be wrapped. Also, the photo shows a level gage...is that likewise plastic??..or did you luck out and it’s glass?

But another big problem with those urns when used for distilling is that the heat element is thermostatically controlled (hence the temperature gage). Thermostats won’t work on a boiler because the power self-regulates to “off” as the temperature approaches the set temperature. What you need is controllable power, ie - a means to regulate the current that passes through the heater coil. Even if you can bypass the thermostat, you still need a way to regulate the current (look in the Related Electrical Accessories forum for the epic thread for controllers.

Others here have used the tea urns as boilers although they’re not the best tool for the job. Although a compromise, with skill they can be modified to work satisfactorily. But, the plastics are a deal breaker, especially with the spigot. My best recommendation for that would be to remove the spigot and plug the hole.

Finally, the heat elements very well could be underpowered for your usage...but it depends on what you’re asking it to do. It will fall short of power for a fast strip run but may work just right for a low and slow (potstill) spirit run.

Bottomline advice...if you start with the urn, keep looking for its replacement because you’ll want to replace it soon. You’ll “outgrow” it within a couple of runs.

Be safe. Be responsible. And be discrete.
ss

[moony]

Thanks for the replies guys, the main use of what i need it to do will be making a vodka type drink which i can flavour up and age later and it's only for me so the size is perfect to my needs because i will be using 25lt sugar wash each time so a 30lt drum would be ample i thought.

The other main factors for me is price, small footprint, easy to store away, easy cleaning, easy starting learning curve (i can upgrade to a better more perm set up at a later date) .

It also needs to be electric because i do have solar panels so we get cheap leccy in the daytime plus i'm not keen on having vapours near a naked flame.
It's got 110c as it's max temp on the dial with increments of 10c the lowest being 30c it's also 2500w plus it will have been CE/PAT tested because i'm buying it from a reputable shop.

The cost is a factor too because i would need to buy a stock pot of 30lt or a keg then a separate heating element/hob all of which would double the cost
($65 for the water boiler urn or $125 for the stock pot/keg set up)

If i do go with the urn it will be getting modified and the tap is going first off and i will solder or block the hole shut, the outer gauge worries me too but with it being double skinned i'm hoping the gauge is on the outer skin with a small hole on the inner to let the gauge water through and if so can be welded or blocked shut.

Do i have to do a strip run or can i just run it slow without strip run because it will literally be for sugar washes only.

[Yummyrum]

The temperature controller will be a hinderance . It needs to be changed to a power controller . Temperature control has no place in distilling despite newbys thinking that alcohol and water have different boilong points .

[NZChris]

Do i have to do a strip run or can i just run it slow without strip run because it will literally be for sugar washes only.

Don't let the rednecks on Youtube give you unrealistic expectations on the quality and quantity you get from a slow single run with a pot still, you are far better off doing at least three stripping runs to make the low wines for your spirit run. My first fermenter held enough for four stripping runs and is still my most used fermenter decades later.

Spigots are great for doing quick and safe dumps and recharges when stripping. Replacing the plastic one with an SS one is much better than filling the hole with a blank.

Copper is beneficial in the boiler as well as in the vapor path, so collect some.

[paddy1000111]

If I can offer any advice is don't underestimate on your boiler. I bought a 17L stainless cookpot, then started looking at urns and basically outgrew it all. I now have a 55 litre stainless keg with a 5500W element which is far more than I need however it means I can do what I want with the still head. Add more height, take some away, change the design... Whatever I want to do I know my boiler is set and ready to go, i know it won't be a bottleneck to the system down the line.

On the point of sugar washes. I strongly advice you go with the All-bran wash on the tried and true recipes page. I have had nothing but success with it. Pot still it and have a nice bran whisky or run it as a neutral and do what you want with flavours. It's the best all rounder.