Pressure Cooker

[Cookie]

Hey guys

I recently made my firs still and it is a basic pressure cooker pot still. From what I can see on the forum it is generally considered a major safety risk.
So before I actually use it I figured it would be best to try and get some of my questions answered.

1) I understand that it can essentially create a pressure bomb when heated however as long as the pressure release weight is on, shouldn't that act as a safety valve to prevent this?

2) the seal pressure cookers seal is a rubber valve. Is this a risk of leaking toxins into my product and if so, why would this not happen to normal food in the cooker?

3) I have also heard that as the still cools it could create a vacuum. However, as long as I don't use a thump keg would this really be an issue?

any help would be much appreciated,
cheers

[Salt Must Flow]

If it is aluminum then it's a no go right off the bat.

If it's stainless then it's fine, but not the gasket. Rubber gaskets are a no go.

If you run a basic pot still, just a boiler and product condenser then there's no way to get a vacuum or build up any pressure.

[Cookie]

If it is aluminum then it's a no go right off the bat.

If it's stainless then it's fine, but not the gasket. Rubber gaskets are a no go.

If you run a basic pot still, just a boiler and product condenser then there's no way to get a vacuum or build up any pressure.

Thanks for the reply, sounds like I should mostly be in the green then with the only issue being the rubber gasket. Do you know of any alternatives to replace the gasket with or?
Cheers

[cob]

Hey guys

I recently made my firs still and it is a basic pressure cooker pot still. From what I can see on the forum it is generally considered a major safety risk.
So before I actually use it I figured it would be best to try and get some of my questions answered.

1) I understand that it can essentially create a pressure bomb when heated however as long as the pressure release weight is on, shouldn't that act as a safety valve to prevent this?

2) the seal pressure cookers seal is a rubber valve. Is this a risk of leaking toxins into my product and if so, why would this not happen to normal food in the cooker?

3) I have also heard that as the still cools it could create a vacuum. However, as long as I don't use a thump keg would this really be an issue?

any help would be much appreciated,
cheers

#1 the opening for the weight is too small by orders of magnitude and should never be considered a safety

device for a still. keep reading and supply more info about the rest of your build or pictures. Is your

pressure cooker actually stainless?

[Skipper1953]

Any pre-existing holes in the lid of the pressure cooker are likely only large enough to allow for using a 1/4" tube/pipe. That is really not recommended due to the fact 1/4" tubing can be very easily plugged. If you drill larger holes there will be no going back to being a simple pressure cooker.
What brand/model pressure cooker do you plan to use? Knowing that would make it easier to figure out what could be used for the gasket. Is it actually a pressure cooker or a pressure canner?
Are you sure it is not aluminum?
Most pressure cookers will make a pretty small still boiler. Chances are good that you will soon find yourself wishing you had something larger. That being said, it may be more trouble than it is worth to figure out how to replace the seal in a pressure cooker.
I would not use a pressure cooker for a still. I started with an 11 gallon Bayou Classic stock pot that I used for a beer boiler.

[Salt Must Flow]

If it is aluminum then it's a no go right off the bat.

If it's stainless then it's fine, but not the gasket. Rubber gaskets are a no go.

If you run a basic pot still, just a boiler and product condenser then there's no way to get a vacuum or build up any pressure.

Thanks for the reply, sounds like I should mostly be in the green then with the only issue being the rubber gasket. Do you know of any alternatives to replace the gasket with or?
Cheers

I don't see any advantage to using a pressure cooker even if it is stainless steel. You're not going to find a reasonable gasket that is safe. You could go to a local junk shop, Good Will store, etc... and pick up a stainless steel pot with lid just a few bucks.

[Cookie]

Any pre-existing holes in the lid of the pressure cooker are likely only large enough to allow for using a 1/4" tube/pipe. That is really not recommended due to the fact 1/4" tubing can be very easily plugged. If you drill larger holes there will be no going back to being a simple pressure cooker.
What brand/model pressure cooker do you plan to use? Knowing that would make it easier to figure out what could be used for the gasket. Is it actually a pressure cooker or a pressure canner?
Are you sure it is not aluminum?
Most pressure cookers will make a pretty small still boiler. Chances are good that you will soon find yourself wishing you had something larger. That being said, it may be more trouble than it is worth to figure out how to replace the seal in a pressure cooker.
I would not use a pressure cooker for a still. I started with an 11 gallon Bayou Classic stock pot that I used for a beer boiler.

Yeah I agree, It sounds like the pressure cooker is just overall not worth the many risks. I was wondering how did you seal the top of the stainless steel pot? would small latches be enough to create an air tight seal?
thanks for the help, cheers

[still_stirrin]

… I was wondering how did you seal the top of the stainless steel pot? would small latches be enough to create an air tight seal?

On my stock pot potstill, I wrap the lip of the pot with PTFE (plumber’s) tape. Then, with the lid in place, I clamp it down with a series of small binder clips, the kind you find in a stationery store for clamping papers together. The small clamps work perfectly if you use a dozen of them. I haven’t experienced a leak in any of the many, many runs I’ve done.

Teflon tape + binder clips. Cheap and easy.
ss

Hava’ look: download/file.php?id=60198&mode=view

[gurkan]

Hello Cookie,

I also started with a 15lt(4 gallon) pressure cooker and still using it for almost a year because with a 25lt(6.6 gallon) fermenter, it's the perfect size for 3 separate stripping runs and one final spirit run.

That pressure cooker came with little coin shaped rubber safety gasket stuffed in a hole on top of the lid, safe for cooking food but unsafe for boiling high proof ethanol. I later replaced it with a SS blind cap. It was surprising to see how weak and unsafe it is when it was popping out when just a little pressure applied with a finger to it. Imagine it's popping out during the run and causing vapor leaks.

Depending on your pressure cooker, a seal(around the lid) may not be necessary - mine does not have one and there isn't any leaks. Locking the handle above the lid provides enough strength to seal it tight. But if yours leaks without gasket, then what you need is PTFE.
You can check this thread as an example for making one:
viewtopic.php?t=24199

As a fellow newbie I can recommend you (after my foolish mistakes) to triple-check the worm condenser's levels in case it has upslopes, especially with a pressure cooker still and thin copper pipes. If it does, then apart from the actual danger, your cuts also will have no meaning because of smearing. After your first run, you can be sure by blowing air from above to see if it spits the remaining water from the worm's end. Or if you're married, you can leave your wedding ring from the top and see if it's sliding smoothly until the end

Also, pressure cookers are already unsafe and I believe using gas as a heat source would double that. Electric hotplates are great but only if you disable their on-off cycling for stable heat. I brought mine to an electrician and he replaced the cycling with some sort of AC dimmer, it works like a charm!

[Cookie]

… I was wondering how did you seal the top of the stainless steel pot? would small latches be enough to create an air tight seal?

On my stock pot potstill, I wrap the lip of the pot with PTFE (plumber’s) tape. Then, with the lid in place, I clamp it down with a series of small binder clips, the kind you find in a stationery store for clamping papers together. The small clamps work perfectly if you use a dozen of them. I haven’t experienced a leak in any of the many, many runs I’ve done.

Teflon tape + binder clips. Cheap and easy.
ss

Hava’ look: download/file.php?id=60198&mode=view

thanks for all the help. That looks exactly like what I am thinking of using instead. I was wondering what thickness of PTFE tape you use? is it the 0.1mm tape or like the 3mm thicker stuff? sorry for all the questions, this is the last one I swear.

Cheers once again

[Cookie]

Hello Cookie,

I also started with a 15lt(4 gallon) pressure cooker and still using it for almost a year because with a 25lt(6.6 gallon) fermenter, it's the perfect size for 3 separate stripping runs and one final spirit run.

That pressure cooker came with little coin shaped rubber safety gasket stuffed in a hole on top of the lid, safe for cooking food but unsafe for boiling high proof ethanol. I later replaced it with a SS blind cap. It was surprising to see how weak and unsafe it is when it was popping out when just a little pressure applied with a finger to it. Imagine it's popping out during the run and causing vapor leaks.

Depending on your pressure cooker, a seal(around the lid) may not be necessary - mine does not have one and there isn't any leaks. Locking the handle above the lid provides enough strength to seal it tight. But if yours leaks without gasket, then what you need is PTFE.
You can check this thread as an example for making one:
viewtopic.php?t=24199

As a fellow newbie I can recommend you (after my foolish mistakes) to triple-check the worm condenser's levels in case it has upslopes, especially with a pressure cooker still and thin copper pipes. If it does, then apart from the actual danger, your cuts also will have no meaning because of smearing. After your first run, you can be sure by blowing air from above to see if it spits the remaining water from the worm's end. Or if you're married, you can leave your wedding ring from the top and see if it's sliding smoothly until the end

Also, pressure cookers are already unsafe and I believe using gas as a heat source would double that. Electric hotplates are great but only if you disable their on-off cycling for stable heat. I brought mine to an electrician and he replaced the cycling with some sort of AC dimmer, it works like a charm!

Hey gurkan,

thanks for the advice. I know exactly what you are talking about with the rubber safety gasket which I also already removed from mine. ill have a look at the how well it seals without the rubber gasket in place but just to be safe I have already ordered some PTFE tape which should come in handy. also, I have used 1/2" copper pipes instead of something thinner to hopefully reduce the risk of something small blocking a pipe. I have heard that an upsloping condenser is also a big issue however so far i have only checked it by just looking at it so those tips are really useful and ill be sure to give it a second check.

I think ill also have a look at electric heat sources before my next run.
thanks for the help, cheers

[still_stirrin]

… I was wondering what thickness of PTFE tape you use? is it the 0.1mm tape or like the 3mm thicker stuff?

I’ve used both.

The “thin stuff” wraps easy and stretches as you go around the pot rim. But, it also can tear easy, sometimes complicating getting it to “stick” to itself.

I found a roll of 3/4” wide teflon tape that is a little thicker and it does a good job for the seal. It is a little more tricky getting it wrapped around the rim, but if you take your time, it’ll go on OK.

Either one works for me. The thicker tape seems more robust and will stay put on the stock pot rim longer (more uses) before needing to replace it. Cost wise, they’re both inexpensive enough to use. So, use what you can find.
ss

[jonnys_spirit]

… I was wondering what thickness of PTFE tape you use? is it the 0.1mm tape or like the 3mm thicker stuff?

I’ve used both.

The “thin stuff” wraps easy and stretches as you go around the pot rim. But, it also can tear easy, sometimes complicating getting it to “stick” to itself.

I found a roll of 3/4” wide teflon tape that is a little thicker and it does a good job for the seal. It is a little more tricky getting it wrapped around the rim, but if you take your time, it’ll go on OK.

Either one works for me. The thicker tape seems more robust and will stay put on the stock pot rim longer (more uses) before needing to replace it. Cost wise, they’re both inexpensive enough to use. So, use what you can find.
ss

Try a HD Google search for "everlasting gasket" - it's basically a cardboard form cutout to fit and wrapped in teflon tape..

Cheers!
-j

[Skipper1953]

Cookie,
You'll have to settle for the advice from the others who answered your question about sealing the lid. I would have done the same as still_stirrin using teflon tape.
I have another pot the same diameter as my boiler pot with a different style lid. Just for shits and giggles, I swapped the lids. It was a perfect friction fit. No need for teflon tape or binder clips. Never had any leaks in all the years I have been using it.
Some times, you get lucky.

[Cookie]

… I was wondering what thickness of PTFE tape you use? is it the 0.1mm tape or like the 3mm thicker stuff?

I’ve used both.

The “thin stuff” wraps easy and stretches as you go around the pot rim. But, it also can tear easy, sometimes complicating getting it to “stick” to itself.

I found a roll of 3/4” wide teflon tape that is a little thicker and it does a good job for the seal. It is a little more tricky getting it wrapped around the rim, but if you take your time, it’ll go on OK.

Either one works for me. The thicker tape seems more robust and will stay put on the stock pot rim longer (more uses) before needing to replace it. Cost wise, they’re both inexpensive enough to use. So, use what you can find.
ss

Try a HD Google search for "everlasting gasket" - it's basically a cardboard form cutout to fit and wrapped in teflon tape..

Cheers!
-j

I actually just had a look at that and it looks pretty neat. As e both tapes are pretty inexpensive I have ordered a bit of both and ill give both a try.
cheers for the help

[Cookie]

… I was wondering what thickness of PTFE tape you use? is it the 0.1mm tape or like the 3mm thicker stuff?

I’ve used both.

The “thin stuff” wraps easy and stretches as you go around the pot rim. But, it also can tear easy, sometimes complicating getting it to “stick” to itself.

I found a roll of 3/4” wide teflon tape that is a little thicker and it does a good job for the seal. It is a little more tricky getting it wrapped around the rim, but if you take your time, it’ll go on OK.

Either one works for me. The thicker tape seems more robust and will stay put on the stock pot rim longer (more uses) before needing to replace it. Cost wise, they’re both inexpensive enough to use. So, use what you can find.
ss

Yeah i have ordered a bit of both and ill see which one works best for mine. cheers for the hepl!

[Yummyrum]

The everlasting gasket based on cardboard is quite fine for smaller size gaskets . For larger ones like a pot lid , you might try cutting a ring out of copper or staino ( if you are brave ) as it will hold its shape better .

Theres also good old flour past and binder clips method a few use as well .

[Chauncey]

Flour paste.

[StillerBoy]

The everlasting gasket based on cardboard is quite fine for smaller size gaskets .

Mat board work better than cardboard and easier to make the gasket with, and I've had these last for a few yrs with care in storing then after use..

Mars

[Cookie]

The everlasting gasket based on cardboard is quite fine for smaller size gaskets .

Mat board work better than cardboard and easier to make the gasket with, and I've had these last for a few yrs with care in storing then after use..

Mars

Hey mars,
I had never heard of mat board before but it looks perfect. ill be sure to give it a shot

thanks for the help

[nano]

I have made the same mistake, Al²⁷ is very common material (and, while it's debatable weather the heavy ions it forms would be volatile, from reading around the consensus is to not use, and you'll destroy your $100 pressure cooker if not cleaned every time, right away) So let's assume you have stainless steel with approved grommets sonehow (like flour paste replacement or something).....
(I read Your sure you have a stainless one?! Lucky you!)

Believe me, I see the appeal of having a backup safety valve and a perfectly fit geometry for a worm. Buy it is a laborious process (you need very small collection vessels on the final run and the result will always need charcoal, you go crazy second guessing yourself with every step.)

And all you control is the rate of boiling (delayed) and sample size.

But if you make a reflux still, you can control the separation as well. Your call, enough runs and cuts will get you some fine pressure-cooker booze, but it's not worth your time imo.

Once you learn the art of controlling separation and get a high proof neutral that barely gives a hangover, and nothing like the ones your used to; almost pleasant. Then you will know much more about the process and, you can make a good pot still and dive in to the art of mixing portions.

At least that's my plan, I've been exactly where you are but didn't know what I know now, the efficiency ceiling and diminishing quality returns are the other shoe of the simple pressure cooker pot still imo.

No one ever took issue with my distillate, except me; my biggest critique. It was the best I've ever had, but also the most expensive at any reasonable rate of pay for my time.

After reading through your replies, I guess go for it. Just know it takes alot of time and effort. But sounds like you've proper metal and good grommets that don't require constant flour paste application.

As for the hole, when I did it it took ½" just fine and never built up pressure (though I've heard somewhere you should replace the gauge with a bolt or something) but mind the advice of those who practice, if your worm is too small you'll have problems apparently (makes sense).

EDIT:

IT SEEMS SONE MAY HAVE THE WRONG IMPRESSION
MY OPINION IS AS FOLLOWS
-if you already have good gaskets, a stainless steel cooker, and a large enough diameter worm I THINK YOU WILL GAIN VALUEABLE KNOWLEDGE ABD FRUSTRATION FROM THIS
-else
CLEARLY DON'T USE, THIS IS NOT OPPOSING ANYTHING ANYONE HAS SAID SO FAR, IT IS BASED ON MY OWN ANECDOTAL EXPERIENCE ALONG WITH KNOWLEDGE SINCE GAINED.

it ain't worth building, but if you've already done it "right" or at least safely I love learning and think it worth a few runs.

Coffee beans to smell between samples can help, stay conservative, and collect very very slowly if you do. You'll keep less than predicted due to inherently sub par separation.....but enough runs with enough collection flasked running slowly enough you'll learn the scent (after second guessing yourself 1,000,000 times and calling 80% of your first few batches heads or tails)

THIS WILL BE MY FINAL POST UNTIL I HAVE A SET UP AND AM OPERATIONAL, JUST FIGURED I'D FEEL OUT THE FORUM. FEEL FREE TO INGNORE MY ADVISE.

[Cookie]

I have made the same mistake, Al²⁷ is very common material (and, while it's debatable weather the heavy ions it forms would be volatile, from reading around the consensus is to not use, and you'll destroy your $100 pressure cooker if not cleaned every time, right away) So let's assume you have stainless steel with approved grommets sonehow (like flour paste replacement or something).....
(I read Your sure you have a stainless one?! Lucky you!)

Believe me, I see the appeal of having a backup safety valve and a perfectly fit geometry for a worm. Buy it is a laborious process (you need very small collection vessels on the final run and the result will always need charcoal, you go crazy second guessing yourself with every step.)

And all you control is the rate of boiling (delayed) and sample size.

But if you make a reflux still, you can control the separation as well. Your call, enough runs and cuts will get you some fine pressure-cooker booze, but it's not worth your time imo.

Once you learn the art of controlling separation and get a high proof neutral that barely gives a hangover, and nothing like the ones your used to; almost pleasant. Then you will know much more about the process and, you can make a good pot still and dive in to the art of mixing portions.

At least that's my plan, I've been exactly where you are but didn't know what I know now, the efficiency ceiling and diminishing quality returns are the other shoe of the simple pressure cooker pot still imo.

No one ever took issue with my distillate, except me; my biggest critique. It was the best I've ever had, but also the most expensive at any reasonable rate of pay for my time.

After reading through your replies, I guess go for it. Just know it takes alot of time and effort. But sounds like you've proper metal and good grommets that don't require constant flour paste application.

As for the hole, when I did it it took ½" just fine and never built up pressure (though I've heard somewhere you should replace the gauge with a bolt or something) but mind the advice of those who practice, if your worm is too small you'll have problems apparently (makes sense).

EDIT:

IT SEEMS SONE MAY HAVE THE WRONG IMPRESSION
MY OPINION IS AS FOLLOWS
-if you already have good gaskets, a stainless steel cooker, and a large enough diameter worm I THINK YOU WILL GAIN VALUEABLE KNOWLEDGE ABD FRUSTRATION FROM THIS
-else
CLEARLY DON'T USE, THIS IS NOT OPPOSING ANYTHING ANYONE HAS SAID SO FAR, IT IS BASED ON MY OWN ANECDOTAL EXPERIENCE ALONG WITH KNOWLEDGE SINCE GAINED.

it ain't worth building, but if you've already done it "right" or at least safely I love learning and think it worth a few runs.

Coffee beans to smell between samples can help, stay conservative, and collect very very slowly if you do. You'll keep less than predicted due to inherently sub par separation.....but enough runs with enough collection flasked running slowly enough you'll learn the scent (after second guessing yourself 1,000,000 times and calling 80% of your first few batches heads or tails)

THIS WILL BE MY FINAL POST UNTIL I HAVE A SET UP AND AM OPERATIONAL, JUST FIGURED I'D FEEL OUT THE FORUM. FEEL FREE TO INGNORE MY ADVISE.

Ahaha yeah I am definitely regretting the pressure cooker still. I didnt see your reply until now and you have very much predicted every issue i came across when it comes to cuts and effort to reward. sadly i already made the condenser before looking into reflux stills so it is a tad late for that : (

I do agree completely that i can still learn the basics with what I've got before i look at anything else

One last thing, you mentioned that everything would always need charcoal. I haven't done any research on this and will do a bit now as I'm wondering what it does?

thanks for the help

[Demy]

For small batches I use normal pots, office clips and Teflon, I also created a soft gasket with Teflon-coated vegetable hemp, I wanted to share the idea on the forum then I thought maybe it would be boring.

[ThomasBrewer]

What pressure cookers *can be* useful for, is a source of steam. Early in my beer brewing days, I used a 23qt pressure cooker and a steam manifold to do step mashes. It works great.

More details here: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/ea ... tem.25974/